Aluminum Calipers

[Justin Daniels]

Just wondering if anyone knows of a straight-up aluminum replacement for the LD-19, IE: something that will bolt onto existing caliper mounts. (3.5" on centre). I was thinking of the Outlaw 1000's but I would have to modify my uprights to suit the 3.25" or 3.75" mounts. Does anyone have experience with Outlaw? Any recommendations on other calipers?

In OFFC we're allowed aluminum calipers on our fords and I'm looking to shave some weight from the corners.

5.0.1 Brakes are unrestricted, except that calipers shall be cast iron, or two-piston aluminum. Aluminum
calipers shall have a maximum piston diameter of 2.00in. Rotors are restricted to ferrous material.

Thanks in advance.

[Josh Pitt]

I think there is a direct replacement from ICP that is ~ 4 lbs less than an LD-19.

[Justin Daniels]

After some more digging on here I found some AP aluminum replacements for the LD19 and LD20 (CP3696-6E0 and CP2577-14E0 respectively)

If anyone has any other suggestions I would still appreciate it as I'm sure the AP ones cost a pretty penny.

[Justin Daniels]

I think there is a direct replacement from ICP that is ~ 4 lbs less than an LD-19.

Yeah just wondering if aluminum ones would be cheaper than the ICP's - I know the Outlaw 1000's are $120USD whereas the ICP LD20 is $200USD. Plus if I can run LD19 replacements (ICP ones are LD20 only I think) I wouldn't need to swap out my M/Cs.

[Rick Kirchner]

Aluminum APs will not be cheaper than ICPs. Shoot, IIRC, their iron calipers are nearly twice as much.

You don't necessarily need to change your masters if you go from 4x LD19s to 4x ICP LD20s, but the stroke and required force will change. I'd just give it a try before replacement. I switched my rears from LD-19s to LD20s and that required a MC change to keep the bias bar more in the middle of the range.

Even adding the cost of two new girling M/Cs to the ICPs I'd bet the total will still be less than the Aluminum LDs.

A couple of months back there was a long thread in the FC forum about aluminum calipers, might be other options listed there.

[R. Pare]

We no longer make an LD19 direct relacement - the market pretty much died out 8 years ago. The LD20 is the preferred upgrade in FF nowadays, but does require larger diameter rotors.

The preferred MC choice with LD20's seems to be .625 and .7 bores.

[Justin Daniels]

Sounds like the ICPs are going to be the only viable option. Unless someone chimes in about Outlaw.

[John Robinson II]

You might want to check and see if your wheels will work with the ICP. I have panasports and they wont clear LD20s or the ICP.
John

[cliff]

John, give me about 10 minutes with a die grinder...I can make them fit
Oh my, I said "fit".....creeping socialism at play!

[Justin Daniels]

Good point guys, I'll take some measurements when I'm at the shop tonight.

Thanks!

[flat broke]

Hi Justin,
I have some ICPs you can trial fit (no die grinding allowed). Give me a shout.

Tony Cove

[Brian]

Honestly, save your cash until you are consistently within 5/10's of Shane and Matt et al. Aluminium calipers will get you about a tenth at Mosport. Or less. Spend the cash on test days...


Brian

[Justin Daniels]

Honestly, save your cash until you are consistently within 5/10's of Shane and Matt et al. Aluminium calipers will get you about a tenth at Mosport. Or less. Spend the cash on test days...


Brian

I'm just curious on price points really, I'm going to go the cheapest route possible. I'm just wondering if there's something out there that anyone is using that would do the trick... heck the Wilwoods are $110 a caliper but are 3.25" or 3.75" spacing. Should have made it more clear in my original post. I'm a b-class car on a RELATIVELY tight budget, no way I'm even considering running at front runner A-Class pace.

Tony, thanks for the offer! I'll have to hold you to that in the near future. Saw you at the drivers meeting on Saturday with Chris, sorry I couldn't say hi; I was in quite a hurry to get back into Whitby.

[Justin Daniels]

I've come to a rather weird discovery... I could have sworn my calipers had LOCKHEED on them but apparently I was mistaken. I measured my upright caliper mounts and noticed they were 3.25" centres, which means I must have Girling 14LFs.

That really limits my options as far as calipers go I suppose, its either more 14LFs, or the ICP replacement.

I have to double check my calipers because as I said, I could have sworn they had LOCKHEED right on the cup.

[John Robinson II]

ICP makes a radial mount replacement.

Cliff,
I saw a panasport that was machined to fit over the ICPs, it will make a nice table bottom. No, I did not waste one of mine.
John

[cliff]

actually you grind on the brake caliper where the wheel would rub. there is a surprising amount of meat on those...thus the reason ICP calipers save so much weight

[R. Pare]

Yes, we have a direct replacement for the 14LF - our radial mount version with the appropriate bracket. Pegasus has them in stock for immediate delivery. If I remember correctly, the weight difference per caliper is about 6.5 pounds.

I'm surprised that the Panasports have such a hard time fitting over the typical FF caliper/hub face relationship - sounds like someone didn't do their homework.

[Brian]

There are Girling 14lf equivalent calipers that are made out of aluminium. I have a set on the rear of my sports racer. They are the same mounting center as the Lockheed, as far as I know, but they are vintage...

I plan to run in C class OFFC this year, Lola T440 unless I diet enough to fit in my RF-85 (or move the chassis side tubes...)

Edit: curiosity got the better of me, I went out to the shop and measured the mounting centres on my aluminium Girling 14 lf calipers, and they are 3.5". As I recall the offset is different to LD-20, and the piston size is 1.89", larger than LD-20. If you indeed have 3.25" mounting centers then maybe these would work http://i.b5z.net/i/u/351269/i/f1.pdf from The Brakeman. I put these on a small sports racer and I liked them a lot.

Maybe you have Girling 12SP's, which are a smaller caliper, kind of equivalent to a Lockheed LD-19. What car do you have?

Brian

[Justin Daniels]

My curiosity got the better of me too and I went back to the shop to double check ( I was taking measurements from a photo I had with a tape measure layed over it )... turns out they ARE 3.5" centres.. sorry for the confusion.

I've got a 1989 Swift SE-1, will be in B-Class obviously, look forward to seeing you out.

[RedRacer27]

Fellas

In the UK you have the crazy situation of people converting National spec cars with alloy calipers back to club spec steel ones... there is a AP caliper that is a straight replacement - and judging by the amount of Club spec cars around - there are prob piles of these sat in peoples garages...

I would put an wanted ad in the UK websites (pm me for more details)... I suspect a few hundred bucks will prob by you a full set and postage.... Good luck.

[R. Pare]

Yes, I was surprised to have inquiries from (and sales to) over there about our calipers to replace the alu AP's. Guess that they are finding out for themselves the fact that you can't make an alu caliper as stiff and responsive as a cast iron one in the same envelope.