Small Formula car HST elimination...

[Messenger Racing]

I receive a monthly SCCA email for road racing as follows:

I believe it is available to all. It is specific to what is being discussed here. I assume that others do not receive it??? Maybe I signed up for it back when they stopped the prior monthly system - I don't recall.

[924RACR]

So I get the frustration here. But your ire should be directed at your BoD rep(s) to get off their arse and perform their oversight of our CRB.

Fun story. My BOD rep is now in charge of the CRB, according to this thread!

Doubly screwed!

Guess I picked a good time to find better orgs...

[pacratt]

I receive a monthly SCCA email for road racing as follows:

I believe it is available to all. It is specific to what is being discussed here. I assume that others do not receive it??? Maybe I signed up for it back when they stopped the prior monthly system - I don't recall.

Interesting. I've been an SCCA dues-paying member since 1983 (42 years) and I've never heard of, nor seen this...let alone been notified of it. Haven't received a Fastrak notice for quite some time.
Since I've been more involved with vintage racing in a different organization, maybe I should just save my money and forget about hitting that 50-year milestone...I mean...what's the point?
Glenn

[Ed Womer]

In response to Steve note about the whenever they come things from some fictitious being Kerri Speed, I actually open it this morning and just like Steve mentioned way down in the bottom I have to click on the road racing cone and up pops BS. I am sorry that some think what is basically a large add, is info.

That is not informing me that something is in discussion and I might want to search the terrible website and hope I can uncover something useful. That is not information, just distraction. You might be able to wo the younger crowd with BS, but normally us older ones just go WTF!

When that rain light issue came about for open wheel and sports racers, I finally heard about AFTER the fact. I did email my area director who actually called me that night and said it was a done deal but I should send my response to the whole BOD which I did.
Much to my amazement, I actually received a reply the next day from I guess the chairman or whoever and got the same basic BS. I did explain that going with a ONE supplier approve product was not what they could have chosen and there were other brilant LED units available, Didn't care. Only said it was easier for tech to look for a stamp instead of seeing if it was bright.

Interesting, Having to now only have an annual tech where what I have observed, is checking for the date sticker on the helmet and checking your gear and the date stickers on the head and neck system and then looking at the car and I use that loosely, that is it. I remember the days or should I say nights, when they did a full tech at every event.

I explained that after nearly 50 years in the club that I will stop racing over this reach into my wallet, his response was, Wait for it, I hope with your years of experience and car building that he hopes I stay a member and come and help tech. After realizing what he said I was about to send a response but really though about it and decided that as a customer I really don't have to do this.

So I left my full competition license expire and the car is for sale. Needless to say I am disappointed but I really don't need to do this and the club is abandoning a long time racer/customer for it's inability to think something thorough and reverse a bad decision. Just remember, I don't need you, you need me.

Ed

[DaveW]

I receive a monthly SCCA email for road racing as follows:

I believe it is available to all. It is specific to what is being discussed here. I assume that others do not receive it??? Maybe I signed up for it back when they stopped the prior monthly system - I don't recall.

Email is cheap. I would expect that everyone with an SCCA membership gets this.

[BLS]

Email is cheap. I would expect that everyone with an SCCA membership gets this.

I've never seen it.

It would seem that with the current ability to communicate, individual members should be able to receive any and all notices/updates/letters submitted/responses/rules changes/ etc through a mass email as events occur.

Even better would be additional targeted email - you get what you sign up for. It should be right in your personal settings. You could check off for all "FC", all "FV", all "SRF", etc. An automated system would then send that as a separate email.

This is 3rd grade stuff to people in the business.

[Peter Olivola]

I've never seen it.

It would seem that with the current ability to communicate, individual members should be able to receive any and all notices/updates/letters submitted/responses/rules changes/ etc through a mass email as events occur.

Even better would be additional targeted email - you get what you sign up for. It should be right in your personal settings. You could check off for all "FC", all "FV", all "SRF", etc. An automated system would then send that as a separate email.

This is 3rd grade stuff to people in the business.

I was reminded earlier that SCCA's systems are old. Very old. I don't know their full capabilities/limitations, but it was described as dating from the days of PC DOS (pre windows.) That was my era of coding and while some neat things were possible, business software and especially non-profit systems, were quite limited by today's standards.

[CheckeredFlag]

Fun story. My BOD rep is now in charge of the CRB, according to this thread!

Doubly screwed!

I was thinking the same thing.

[CheckeredFlag]

I was reminded earlier that SCCA's systems are old. Very old. I don't know their full capabilities/limitations, but it was described as dating from the days of PC DOS (pre windows.) That was my era of coding and while some neat things were possible, business software and especially non-profit systems, were quite limited by today's standards.

My Bachelor's degree is Computer Information Systems (CIS); graduated MagnaCumLaude (yes, I did one word due to the forum censor not liking the middle word, even though it's Latin) and twice received the university's Academic Achievement Award for CIS. I only mention my credentials in that I do not envy the new IT Director and the tasks ahead of him. I fear his staff may be too small and the budget insufficient. (What else is new at a not-for-profit?) At our divisional conference/training this year it was mentioned the plan is to upgrade the computer systems and get the different systems all on the same page together and maybe move away from MotorSportReg. Funny thing is, the last I attended was two years ago and the exact same things were said then.

I apologize for the detour. Someone was talking about Small Formula Car HST Elimination or something?

[douglap1]

In response to Steve note about the whenever they come things from some fictitious being Kerri Speed, I actually open it this morning and just like Steve mentioned way down in the bottom I have to click on the road racing cone and up pops BS. I am sorry that some think what is basically a large add, is info.

That is not informing me that something is in discussion and I might want to search the terrible website and hope I can uncover something useful. That is not information, just distraction. You might be able to wo the younger crowd with BS, but normally us older ones just go WTF!

I'm glad you guys informed me that those stupid Kerri Speed emails had an actual useful link in them. Ever since they started coming a year or two ago, I've just been deleting as spam.

Then today, I tried to find an updated GCR on the website, and the only way I could locate it was to go to the section on how to get a racing license where they had a hyperlink.

Common sense is no longer common...

[Messenger Racing]

Neither of these are defense of mutually agreed IT system needs - I agree it needs work, has limited staff and most likely a limited budget as well.

FWIW:

Regarding finding the gcr - I prefer to take fewer clicks and simple type "scca gcr" in the the address bar of my Chrome browser - it brings up the link to the Cars and Rules - Sports car Club of America page.

A comment above suggested we should be able to sign up for targeted rule updates - it has been available for some time - that is exactly what I did - I do not know how to sign up but will look and see if I can come up with the link.

[FVRacer21]

I suggested years ago, and many times after that; since the GCR is the “bible” of the SCCA, that there should be a direct link on the front page of the website. And yes, I sent it to Topeka, not just on this site.

However,

For a forum that has a section for data analysis, you would think we would have the knowledge to:

Bookmark the GCR page in our Browser, (and Fastrack), or

Set a desktop shortcut to the page,

Set up a reminder in whatever calendar program we use, with the link.

All websites today are messed up - trying to navigate Medicare sites, pharmacy sites, and most business sites is a chore. (you see what age I am…)

I can't image what it takes to keep this forum going compared to a few years ago.

But I used to love computers, writing my own basic programs, batch files, tinkering with the registry… Now I feel like Charlton Heston in Planet of the Apes. “We finally really did it. [screaming] You Maniacs! You blew it up! Ah, &^%##$^&&.....

ChrisZ

[Steve Davis]

...
A comment above suggested we should be able to sign up for targeted rule updates - it has been available for some time - that is exactly what I did - I do not know how to sign up but will look and see if I can come up with the link.

I sent a message to 'membership@Scca.com 2 days ago to ask about it.... crickets....
Trying again now sending to RoadRacing@scca.com .. we'll see if I get a response this time.
Steve

[Steve Davis]

OK.. just got a response from Brandy Wiggans (BWiggans@scca.com). She said she put me on a list to receive 'Announcements' about Road Racing. Not exactly sure what that means. Said it took her a bit to FIGURE OUT what list that was and how to get me on it. I won't know for sure until something gets sent out to that list.
If any of you WANT to be on that list, suggest you send your request directly to her since she now KNOWS how to do it.
Seems that ought to be an option on the RULES page for Road Racing ... doesn't it?
Steve
ps,, her response seems to be from my first email to 'membership' - just took her a while to figure it out.

[Steve Davis]

OK.. someone try this.
Go to SCCA site
in search box, type 'road race announcements' and hit enter
it should take you to some announcements
click on 'Announcements' - just shortens the list
Look for one related to the publishing of the FASTRACK and click on it
takes you a page with a link on it...
Look for FOLLOW to the right of the title and click on it

Mine now shows that I'm following Road Race Announcements
but I'm already following them now.. if you are NOT, I'm not sure what you will see - possibly as soon as you click on FOLLOW, it will show (the result of clicking). SO I don't know how to know if you are already following or not.. but you can click on it to UNfollow if you decide you don't want it any more.
AND, pretty sure you have to be LOGGED IN on the SCCA site.. but that's NOT the same as logging in to YOUR ACCOUNT.. I think.
If you want to get to your Profile in My Account, that's another log in .. I think. Needless to say, as we all know, the SCCA website can be pretty confusing.

I did find that SOMEONE at SCCA is doing a good bit of research. I had not spent any real time with the options at the top of my ACCOUNT home page. Under those options are LOTS of data. I spent over an hour looking through what is there to see if I could find a way to subscribe myself to the Road Race Announcement list - no luck (that was before Brandy got back to me with the process above). However, go to the RUNOFF statistics to see some involved research and an obvious indication that SCCA DOES have a nice database of every driver and his information Class/name/events run (at least in recent years) and probably easy access to EMAIL to reach 'us' by name or CLASS if they want to.. (and know how to use it).

Which reminds me that members of the CRB, BOD and the official Committees (e.g. FSRAC) have access to that database of LETTERS that we don't have access to.. It's THERE but WE can't access it.
Steve, FV80

[Peter Olivola]

Which reminds me that members of the CRB, BOD and the official Committees (e.g. FSRAC) have access to that database of LETTERS that we don't have access to.. It's THERE but WE can't access it.
Steve, FV80

My letter today to the Bod:

My primary involvement with SCCA is in the Road Racing program, but I am writing this to the BoD because it applies to all SCCA programs.

As currently is the case with Road Racing and Solo (and probably other programs I'm not familiar with,) member letter submissions are not visible to the rest of the membership. Over the years I have heard this defended as a protection of privacy. Why? We're not a health care provider and we don't need the equivalent of HIPAA.

One of the earliest things I learned when I first joined in 1967 was an example of a particularly egregious case of self dealing involving a change allowing aftermarket alloy wheels in the production category. Things have improved since those days but there remains a perception that self dealing still happens.

The single best way to overcome this perception would be to make available a digitized copy of the exact request including identifying the member or staff person making it. Not only would this make it possible for all members to see the request, the resulting response from the membership would provide the BoD and program boards and committees a better, faster feedback mechanism about the proposal. That feedback and the accompanying peer response to the originator would either reinforce the request or provide a disincentive to make self serving requests. The overall effect would also be to reduce the volume of requests, and reducing staff, boards and committees' review time.

I also understand that current SCCA IT capacity may not be capable of supporting such a large database. I would hope any new systems considerations would include sufficient capacity.

In political terms, this would be using sunshine as a disinfectant.

[brian styczynski]

My letter today to the Bod:

My primary involvement with SCCA is in the Road Racing program, but I am writing this to the BoD because it applies to all SCCA programs.

As currently is the case with Road Racing and Solo (and probably other programs I'm not familiar with,) member letter submissions are not visible to the rest of the membership. Over the years I have heard this defended as a protection of privacy. Why? We're not a health care provider and we don't need the equivalent of HIPAA.

One of the earliest things I learned when I first joined in 1967 was an example of a particularly egregious case of self dealing involving a change allowing aftermarket alloy wheels in the production category. Things have improved since those days but there remains a perception that self dealing still happens.

The single best way to overcome this perception would be to make available a digitized copy of the exact request including identifying the member or staff person making it. Not only would this make it possible for all members to see the request, the resulting response from the membership would provide the BoD and program boards and committees a better, faster feedback mechanism about the proposal. That feedback and the accompanying peer response to the originator would either reinforce the request or provide a disincentive to make self serving requests. The overall effect would also be to reduce the volume of requests, and reducing staff, boards and committees' review time.

I also understand that current SCCA IT capacity may not be capable of supporting such a large database. I would hope any new systems considerations would include sufficient capacity.

In political terms, this would be using sunshine as a disinfectant.

It will be ironic when they thank you for this letter that members (who bother to look at fastrack) will have no clue what it was about

[Rick Kirchner]

I don't even see how this would stress the IT. In the end, it's memory, and a pointer in a database, tied into a HTML front end. The database software already exists, the website already exists, and memory is cheap.

I have no doubt though that given the number of letters received, the labor required to get things properly entered would not be insignificant unless there was a way to automate that. And doesn't the club prefer snail mail? Paper makes things much harder....

[BLS]

"unless there was a way to automate that."

You have the letters submitted digitally though the website. Category, letter, id, etc. all done at the front end.

SCCA must first recognize there is a problem, then the solutions can be pretty straight forward.

[Peter Olivola]

It will be ironic when they thank you for this letter that members (who bother to look at fastrack) will have no clue what it was about

I've preconditioned myself by already bashing my head against a wall.

[Peter Olivola]

I don't even see how this would stress the IT. In the end, it's memory, and a pointer in a database, tied into a HTML front end. The database software already exists, the website already exists, and memory is cheap.

I have no doubt though that given the number of letters received, the labor required to get things properly entered would not be insignificant unless there was a way to automate that. And doesn't the club prefer snail mail? Paper makes things much harder....

As already said, submissions are now electronic. If there are any paper submissions the number would be small. The letters are already stored in the system with access limited to staff and board and committee members. My concern is capacity to handle multiple access requests simultaneously. That's a common choke point for things like this.

I would urge anyone who has an opinion on this to submit their own letter. Finding the location on the website is, um, obscure. Here's my best stab at a map:

scca.com > About > Staff & Board of Directors > (at the bottom of the page under Board of Directors) here > (at the bottom of the page) E-Mail All Directors

[Jim Garry]

Try http://www.crbscca.com/

[racerjon1]

Email is cheap. I would expect that everyone with an SCCA membership gets this.

Just a note on this - sending emails out to people who do not want them can be "expensive" in that, when you send emails you have to provide a way for folks to unsubscribe.

If we send out *all* the SCCA mails to all the membership, more people unsubscribe and then you can get classified as spam, or specific people you need to see specific announcements then don't get them at all. I imagine many of the folks here would want to mash the unsubscribe button if they kept seeing Autocross or Road Rally announcements. Those folks will also unsubscribe if they see road racing announcements.

If a company sends you an email after you unsubscribe - it can mean fines. Real, expensive, fines. So we try to make sure the emails you get and the lists you are on are relevant and wanted. Hence the ways to subscribe to the announcements.

Now - I know we're not perfect, we're probably not even good when it comes to how to find those. We're working on a new site, and the issues with search, and finding the information you want easier are WAY at the top of the list.

I know someone mentioned not liking it in the thread, but the SportsCar News Email, then scroll to the bottom and see if the Road Racing icon (the trophy) has a number by it is the most consistent way to see if there have been announcements in the previous week.

[racerjon1]

I suggested years ago, and many times after that; since the GCR is the “bible” of the SCCA, that there should be a direct link on the front page of the website. And yes, I sent it to Topeka, not just on this site.

In 1970 the GCR was the "Bible" of the SCCA. The first Solo (autocross) rules were a supplement to the GCR. Now.. not so much.

The SCCA has seven programs, each with their own rulebook. Six of them are not the GCR. One of them has five times the participation as Road Racing, so the GCR doesn't even govern a majority of our events or entries.

Which leads me to:

All websites today are messed up - trying to navigate Medicare sites, pharmacy sites, and most business sites is a chore. (you see what age I am…)

The more "things" you have, the harder the website is to do, the level of complication to get a subset of members to where they want to go is tough. We started to try this my making tribal sites (e.g., timetrials.scca.com) but then you start running into issues with multiple log ins, etc.

The good news is, as I mentioned in the post to Dave about emails, we're working on a new site. Navigation, log ins, search function, less clicks to get to where you want to go, etc - are all very high on the list. I have a lot of faith in the people we have heading it up, and the processes they are using to get there. Things we haven't excelled at previously.

[BLS]

If we send out *all* the SCCA mails to all the membership...

Which is why each member should choose what email category they wish to receive. Settings, selection, done.

Category's would include each class, racing in general, rally, autocross/time trial, etc. Really not that difficult. Email can be tailored to fit the individual member. Some people will be interested in rule change proposals, some will not. Some only for a particular class perhaps. That is, IMO, the easy part. The hard part is on the categorization of information which requires all the SCCA employee's to do this properly.

[Peter Olivola]

Try http://www.crbscca.com/

Jim,

That's good for Road Racing, but as I said in my submission, the idea applies to all programs and needs to be looked at from the top down.

[Jim Garry]

Jim,

That's good for Road Racing, but as I said in my submission, the idea applies to all programs and needs to be looked at from the top down.

When you click on that link it takes you to a form. After filling out your personal info the next thing is a drop down menu asking you which board you want your comment to go to: Club Racing, Rally, Solo.

I suppose the URL says "CRB" because that was the initial use of the website but over time it has expanded.

So it works for Club Racing, Rally, Solo.

[Peter Olivola]

When you click on that link it takes you to a form. After filling out your personal info the next thing is a drop down menu asking you which board you want your comment to go to: Club Racing, Rally, Solo.

I suppose the URL says "CRB" because that was the initial use of the website but over time it has expanded.

So it works for Club Racing, Rally, Solo.

You're not looking at the same thing I posted.

Here's an email shortcut: bod@scca.com

[Jim Garry]

Ha, I see my mistake, obviously. But it's an honest one ... I'm aware of the strong preference for comments and questions to go through the letter portal so they can get an ID, be seen by subcommittees if appropriate, and be officially recorded. But email works.

[FVRacer21]

In 1970 the GCR was the "Bible" of the SCCA. The first Solo (autocross) rules were a supplement to the GCR. Now.. not so much.

The SCCA has seven programs, each with their own rulebook. Six of them are not the GCR. One of them has five times the participation as Road Racing, so the GCR doesn't even govern a majority of our events or entries.

Jon,

I looked at each of the program pages. Maybe the Club is trying to do too many things - but that is not the topic for this thread.

Most "rules" pages can be accessed with just three clicks, but in my opinion, the Autocross and Time trial pages are really complicated. Most programs could probably benefit from a one GCR type document - rather than multiple documents, although that might be part of the goal going forward. I do not envy the team working on this. This is what I meant when I said we have blown the technology up.

In the meantime, in this forum, maybe we need a sticky with how to navigate the rules for racing. How to find them, how to recommend changes (I did notice the Autocross has a section "Current Active Change Proposals". Similar to the idea Pete is proposing?.) How to create shortcuts and bookmarks to find them easier - or better yet downloading them to the laptop we all seem to be carrying around these days.

ChrisZ

In the Bible, Paul says : "I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some." Not sure that is the right way to run a business or a club.

[BLS]

Regional race with "Bonus Majors for FF, FV, & F600" May 3-4 at VIR -

The bonus majors group includes (this is not a joke) two FA's, two FC's, four FE2's, two P2's, and an SR1.

That is not a "bonus" and there are currently two FV's, one F6, and no FF's entered.

[CF56]

I originally entered but had to withdraw due to a family situation. My local FF friend has chosen to go to the Pitt Race Majors the same weekend. We both ran the VIR HST last year.


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