Is Formula 1000 FB class for me?

[Qz5gxt]

I am looking into a new formula car purchase. My focus has been Formula Continentals FC only because they seem to be more popular in my region here in south east Michigan. But I have not found a FC car I like for sale. If I was to look into a Formula 1000 FB car what race tracks location options would I have? My normal tracks last few years in order of most often has been, Waterford Hills, Gengerman, Grattan, Mid Ohio, Autobahn Club Chicago. But I do not seem to see any FB cars around here, but I could be wrong.

I have no plans to go to higher level racing this is a hobby sport for me to get out on track about max 8 weekends year. I am 50 and this is a hobby not a career to just have fun, and wrench on a cool car. I am coming from 5 years of OTD in a Very well track set up Lotus Elise I just sold, but not to make me look like a total newbie I was running at lap times within tenths of track records of class but new to wheel to wheel racing.

I am a little concern that I seem to find on web searches blown engines or engine fires seem to come up more then a few times with FB DSR searches with the motorcycle engines.

So is FB something I should consider and if so is anyone around my area running FB?

[JohnPaul]

Check out this thread it has a list of people in your area with FB cars:
http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55095

[Northwind]

If you do buy a FB, don't forget to pick up a box of Depends.

[Rick Ross]

FB is not an entry level race class. Going from track days in a Lotus Elise to racing an FB is a very big step. Do you have any past racing experience?

You should at least consider something a little slower and easier to maintain.....FF, FE, FM are all possible options if you want an open-wheel car (all are much faster than the Lotus). Good luck with your decision.....you will enjoy driving an open wheel car.

[Qz5gxt]

If you do buy a FB, don't forget to pick up a box of Depends.

So I guess I should not have said I am 50

[S Lathrop]

An FB is a very high performance small bore formula car. It has power to weight ratio almost equal to FA but runs on FC tires. Top speed is about FA velocity.

A lot of guys have bought FBs and then sold them because they did not have fun.
You need a strong foundation in FF or FC before you jump into a FB.

I would recommend some time in a lower level formula car before you decide on FB. FF would be my recommendation as a starting point. Master that car and the transition to FB will be way more successful. Age is not an issue if you prepare properly.

[Qz5gxt]

FB is not an entry level race class. Going from track days in a Lotus Elise to racing an FB is a very big step. Do you have any past racing experience?

You should at least consider something a little slower and easier to maintain.....FF, FE, FM are all possible options if you want an open-wheel car (all are much faster than the Lotus). Good luck with your decision.....you will enjoy driving an open wheel car.

Thank you all for your knowledge as i make a choice on my next car.
yes I do not have past wheel to wheel race experience. Other then 30 years ago some motorcycle road racing. I just have 5 recent years of OTD in fastest group that was treated more like TT events. My groups where mostly with some closed wheel pros that where out doing test and tune. But I know my place as a novice.

After talking with some formula guys that know me they felt FF I would get tired of quickly and was suggested i get into FC class but still looking

But sounds like FB is too big a jump for me

[Qz5gxt]

Thank you, I will focus FC FF as starting out

[glenn cooper]

I would not count out FM. Reliable like an appliance, just got to take care of the gearbox for the most part: Inspect and replace gears prior to them failing! TONS of fun, great pricing and resale, lots of grip, half sprint car, half dirt bike.
As a former m/c roadracer (84-93) that is the path I initially chose after a few rentals in FF.

[2BWise]

If you're looking for FCs have you given this car a look yet?
http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55508

Last I saw it the car was in fantastic shape. Very pretty car.

Another option would be to consider DSR. At Waterford, and regionally, there are quite a collection of DSRs. http://dsrforum.yuku.com/forums/14/F...s#.UVL3MjdZM4I

Pop over there and take a look at what's available. They might have fenders but they are open wheel fun! I have a friend locally who stepped into a DSR after racing a 924 for a few seasons (Radical then Stohr, not you Vaughan you knew what you were getting into) and has been figuring out how to drive it as he goes.

The only downside to FB is that there are very few around here regionally. Even FF is pretty thin, but FC and DSR are very well subscribed. My suggestion, find a car you want to run and buy it. There are enough people around here who will be more than kind enough to help get you up to speed.

-Bill

[formulasuper]

So I guess I should not have said I am 50

The Depends are for when you get the xxxx scared out of you, nothing to do with age. Heck, your just a kid compared to some of us.

[carnut169]

What's your budget for a car? For racing? Have a trailer, tow vehicle? Safety gear? SCCA Membership?

You can spend $9k on a regional FC or over $50k for a nice pro-level car with a bulletproof Zetec.

Nice FFs with the Honda motors go for a bunch of dough but are less expensive in the long run than the Kent powered cars.

FMs are also pretty robust cars, level playing fields.

That said- bang for the buck, it's hard to beat FB. F600 looks interesting as well.

I would suggest going to the local track for the next SCCA event, see who shows up, sit in the cars, ask questions. You will get more out of the experience if you get along with the folks your racing with.

[provamo]

follow the path of YOUR heart

live YOUR dream

go for it

whatever

(older than you LOL)

[Qz5gxt]

What's your budget for a car? For racing? Have a trailer, tow vehicle? Safety gear? SCCA Membership?

You can spend $9k on a regional FC or over $50k for a nice pro-level car with a bulletproof Zetec.

Nice FFs with the Honda motors go for a bunch of dough but are less expensive in the long run than the Kent powered cars.

FMs are also pretty robust cars, level playing fields.

That said- bang for the buck, it's hard to beat FB. F600 looks interesting as well.

I would suggest going to the local track for the next SCCA event, see who shows up, sit in the cars, ask questions. You will get more out of the experience if you get along with the folks your racing with.

Hello,

My Tow vehicle, 2012 GMC Serra full size pick up with covered bed. With lotus I could fit two full sets of 17" wheels/tires tools jacks, air tank..... ( I bought the truck for my 17 old son and it doubles as my tow Vehicle on weekends)

I have full race suite, helmet gloves, shoes, but need updated Hans due to formula seat difference. I just joined SCCA

Inclosed car trailer, custom built aluminum trailer (light) that was built for my old Lotus ( 14' floor with 10' ramps) some room on inside walls for stuff.

Budget for car, dependents on the car. Newer car with less track time with better resale I would pay more (market value). Older car with lots of track time with lower resale value I would pay less (market value) So $15k to $40k budget for car, wife would like lower number...

Lotus mistake, I bought at lower end and put in ~$25k plus (i dont want to add it up) of go fast stuff to get where I wanted to be verse buy up front the car I wanted in the end.

Iam leaning to CF or DSR, but dream about FB some day?

[johnspranger]

I just purchased a Stohr F1000.

Sounds great, looks modern, sequential gearbox and an engine gearbox price that is unbeatable.

Feel free to contact me, I just went through the same decision matrix.

[mikey]

I jumped out of corvettes and into FE. Very happy with the car, it was a relatively easy transition. Spec class means I can go be competitive. Consider it! I do see myself graduating to something faster within a couple years. Maybe a PFM.

[AEA_Team_Lotus]

http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/show...509#post383509

I am selling my CFC it was a great car to get acquainted with the feel and speed of formula cars.

It has been meticulously matained , I can provide additional photos upon request.

I was able to set the lap record at NHMS in this car twice last year.

[BennyBad]

Hello,

My Tow vehicle, 2012 GMC Serra full size pick up with covered bed. With lotus I could fit two full sets of 17" wheels/tires tools jacks, air tank..... ( I bought the truck for my 17 old son and it doubles as my tow Vehicle on weekends)

I have full race suite, helmet gloves, shoes, but need updated Hans due to formula seat difference. I just joined SCCA

Inclosed car trailer, custom built aluminum trailer (light) that was built for my old Lotus ( 14' floor with 10' ramps) some room on inside walls for stuff.

Budget for car, dependents on the car. Newer car with less track time with better resale I would pay more (market value). Older car with lots of track time with lower resale value I would pay less (market value) So $15k to $40k budget for car, wife would like lower number...

Lotus mistake, I bought at lower end and put in ~$25k plus (i dont want to add it up) of go fast stuff to get where I wanted to be verse buy up front the car I wanted in the end.

Iam leaning to CF or DSR, but dream about FB some day?

DSR

having fenders you can do most HPDE to get cheap practice time to re program your brain how to drive a downforce car
by brain programming i mean it is screaming brake but dont listen stay on the throttle the car will stick amazing what 3 g's feel like

once you learn how to drive one nothing else will do

i havent regreted the decision

benny

[Nardi]

Is a 14 ft long trailer floor going to be long enough for your choice? I suggest you start considering car lengths.

[Qz5gxt]

Is a 14 ft long trailer floor going to be long enough for your choice? I suggest you start considering car lengths.

I been wondering the same. Some cars I will need to take rear wings off. Base of trailer is 14' but doors open front and rear and are V shaped out for more room. <=>

Attachment 38055

[Mike Devins]

I would also suggest that you consider a F500/600, they will produce lap times similar to an FF. They will fit in your trailer and the best ones in the country are inside of your budget!

F600 is not yet a national class yet but still lots of opportunities to go racing at Waterford Hills plus all of the other tracks that you mentioned.

Re: f600 Please note that this is selfish self promotion since I am involved with the new F600 that Jay Novak is building, but I would not be involved unless I believed that the class had huge potential. There is a very active f600 forum here on apex

[JohnPaul]

follow the path of YOUR heart

live YOUR dream

go for it

whatever

(older than you LOL)

I think that so many times it happens too fast, you trade your passion for glory.
Don't lose your grip on the dreams of the past you must fight just to keep them alive.
It's the car and the driver, It's the thrill of the fight. Risin' up to the challenge
Of our scca rival. And the last known car driver stalks his prey on the track.
And he's watching us all (race director) with his eye on the driver.

[glenn cooper]

DSR

having fenders you can do most HPDE to get cheap practice time to re program your brain how to drive a downforce car
by brain programming i mean it is screaming brake but dont listen stay on the throttle the car will stick amazing what 3 g's feel like

once you learn how to drive one nothing else will do

i havent regreted the decision

benny

I would strongly urge against this practice unless the run group is comprised exclusively of sports racers (which I have never seen or heard of). Typically the group consists of all types of cars, most of which weigh 4-5 times what a DSR does.
We have had guys killed and horribly injured in the above scenario...

I have always been a firm believer in working, or more appropriately earning one's way up the ladder. Sure there is the odd occurence of someone entering fairly high up the ladder and immediately doing well, but those are very rare, and usually accompanied by a lengthy karting background.

To jump straight into DSR in my opinion would be a disaster. We have had folks do this in my region (southeast) and it's not super pleasant.

Anyone (well, damned near most!) can pull the trigger in a straight line, but when a driver can not even begin to approach the (actually quite daunting in DSR) cornering ability of their car and basically parks it in the turns, it leads to a bunch of ill will from the other drivers.

We all love our sport/passion so much and want to share this with anyone that shows the slightest interest. We freely share all info (even if it can be construed as painful, or in my case perhaps semi-brutally honest is more accurate) so that folks can get straight to it and avoid any of the hassles we have encountered along our journey.

[glenn cooper]

I think that so many times it happens too fast, you trade your passion for glory.
Don't lose your grip on the dreams of the past you must fight just to keep them alive.
It's the car and the driver, It's the thrill of the fight. Risin' up to the challenge
Of our scca rival. And the last known car driver stalks his prey on the track.
And he's watching us all (race director) with his eye on the driver.

Are you doing copy for cheesy beer commercials now?
"Eye of the Tiger" indeed!

Here's to you, oh Sultan of late night garage knuckle busting.
It's guy's like you who set the standard that mere mortals can never approach.
Women flock to be at your side, but wait ladies, wait you must.
You're in Group 7 today, and that means no hanky panky till the checker flag falls.
You're a race car driver, and that's all that matters...
Until Monday morning that is and it's back to the grind, now get to work!

[JohnPaul]

Are you doing copy for cheesy beer commercials now?
"Eye of the Tiger" indeed!

Here's to you, oh Sultan of late night garage knuckle busting.
It's guy's like you who set the standard that mere mortals can never approach.
Women flock to be at your side, but wait ladies, wait you must.
You're in Group 7 today, and that means no hanky panky till the checker flag falls.
You're a race car driver, and that's all that matters...
Until Monday morning that is and it's back to the grind, now get to work!

Busted! I'm embarrassed.....Damn you Coop, damn you to racing hell...

[Qz5gxt]

Thank you, I will focus FC FF as starting out

I believe I am best to focus on FF FC maybe someday F1000

[Bob Wheless]

you might consider a rental or 2.... cheap way to find out what trips your trigger,,,, just my 2 cents,,,,,,,bobo the fato

[Josh Pitt]

I believe I am best to focus on FF FC maybe someday F1000

years ago I used to roadrace motorcycles, took time off from that.
recently I came from driving a lotus elise for track days, to spec miata racing. I now also race open wheelers. i started racing karts(kt100), then got into formula cars.
I started with FF, and other than the curiosity of wanting to race other types of cars, the FF is all I need, and more.


honda or ford, and CF or FF. what are most of the cars in your area that you would be racing against?

buy whatever tool(racecar) fits into that group. its no fun racing alone in a class.

if you dont learn the basics in FF, you wont learn them in a FB.

Josh

[Marshall Mauney]

I jumped out of corvettes and into FE. Very happy with the car, it was a relatively easy transition. Spec class means I can go be competitive. Consider it!

Particularly in the OPs area, FE is a good choice. Plenty of competition and some good CSR support nearby. Both GLDiv and CenDiv have active FE groups, and the car is easy to maintain and pretty solid (once you get the transmission PMs procedures sorted out). Not as fast as FB or DSR, but it's a really "friendly" car that's easy to drive, IMO.

The upside of a spec car like FE is that you don't spend your time figuring out what parts are fastest on your car. The downside is that you can't find faster parts for your car..... IF you're just looking for fun competition between drivers, it's a great choice.

[LLoshak]

if you dont learn the basics in FF, you wont learn them in a FB.

Close, I think it should say "if you don't learn the basics in X, you wont learn them in a FB either."

What I'm trying to say is generally if your competitive in X class, you will be just as competitive in X class. Driving skill, tolerance of speed, consistency is something that can be learned with practice. Of course some have more potential than others.

What I'm trying to say is, you need to take a look at your experience, comfort level and how competitive you are. Want to know if you're ready or a jump start? Do a 3 day Skip Barber school, which will also get you SCCA Novice Permit, bypassing the need for a SCCA school (which IMHO, is just a trackday). In Skip Barber your instructors will tell you if you got it and teach you many things along the way....In a open wheel car. The rest is practice which you will get while completing your requirements for your novice permit and 4 more regional races to get your national license.

I agree with Glen, don't go out on the track with full size cars. A DSR is hard to see because they're so low PLUS the closing speeds are ridiculous. Always asked to be grouped with open wheel on track days etc.

I would definitely pick FB before DSR. DSR is even faster and WAY more expensive to run competitively. Buying and selling cars is not easy. Especially without losing/spending tons of money in between. Pick the car you can afford AND run competitively.

I say do Skip Barber. If you decide you like open wheel, you do great and your instructors give you their blessing, get yourself a bad ass FB and join this awesome growing class.

Because remember, no matter what class you chose, being slow and in peoples way isn't safe and wont make you any friends. FF, FC are just as competitive, any national class for that matter. Try a rental weekend in a SRF. Hire a coach for a weekend. Many options.

There's just no replacement for a 13K RPM, sequential shifting FB. Coolest and best bang for the buck class in SCCA IMHO. And man... Do they look cool too.

[Tiago Santos]

Just to add in my experience - I moved from riding a BMX bike, to racing a formula vee. Similar kind of gap in performance as comparing a Lotus Elise to an F1000, really.. I did fine and was fairly competitive locally after my first full season!



In all seriousness.. I say give it a try. Maybe work out a deal to rent one at a track day or test day. It'll probably scare the crap out of you, either in a good, or a bad way. If it's good, buy it, learn it, race it. If it's bad, at least it'll have been an experience, sort of like riding a rollercoaster

[Thomas Copeland]

If you can handle racing an FC you can handle racing an FB.

Just make sure you get plenty of seat time in the car before venturing out on a race weekend. When I hurt my back a few years back I spent nearly two years out of the car.

When I got back in the car it was a open track test day at Sears Point. I did it because I knew my track time would be limited at a race weekend and I didn't want to pressure of trying to go too fast too soon.

Anyway, I spun twice the first lap. But then went on to do more than 100 trouble free laps that first day (well, it felt like 100 anyway). I took the time to get the feeling back and progressed little by little up to speed. In all I did three of these test days before even taking on a race weekend. It's all about seat time. Too often I see guys jump right off the deep end and start racing before they are ready. As long as you build up to it you'll be fine.

But having that pressure free open test day was key to getting back into racing.

I did the same thing last year after a 4 year layoff before racing at Laguna Seca in the FB. Several open track days at Thunderhill. I was't fast yet when I raced, but at least I was safe on track.

Also, one reason I quit FC for FB was because maintaining the FC took much more time and was more of a headache than the FB. Ever change a clutch seal on an FC on a 106 degree hot day? Or change gears before a race at 3am in the pouring rain in Seattle? Never, Never, Ever again!!!!

[provamo]

"Just make sure you get plenty of seat time in the car before venturing out on a race weekend"

this is KEY