2015 F1 Australian Grand Prix - Spoilers

Guys - don't you realize this is the pinnacle of motor racing engineering? You know the one where it takes a day to pull an engine and replace a seal, where one engine can't even make it to the start, and a Renault gearbox-engine (take your choice) can't make it to the start either, and you can't refer to an engine anymore since its now a PU. And some of them are FU-PUs

I've had this rant before - the FIA has completely screwed up F1, and the ACO LM prototypes have got it spot on - however the equivalency is decided. Frankly the prototypes are more closely aligned to road cars of the future than these F1 contraptions.

As I said in an earlier post - how are the NBC boys going to deal with the next 19 races.......? And no I didn't watch the race - got the result from Autosport and saw it would be a complete waste of time.

JeffW

A lot of SCCA club racing is a much better show than the JOKE that F1 has become.

where else in the world of racing can you see an oh-so-exciting race like this one followed up by a washed-up ex-film star, former gubernator asking insipid questions of the victors....

"tell me nico, how does it feel to get your butt handed to you on a silver platter by the guy who handed it to you last year?"

plus you get to see the reigning world champion wannabe rap star nearly mess his pants when he finds out his celluloid hero is in reality a vertically challenged chemically tanned dimwit?

c'mon people this is the pinnacle of motor racing!!

you're obviously just jealous 'cuz you're not part of it!!

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by marc sproule

....wannabe rap star nearly mess his pants when he finds out his celluloid hero is in reality a vertically challenged...:rolleyes:

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Schwarzenegger is 6' 2".. that's vertically challenged?? What are you 7' 5"??

While we are on that type of subject, did you know there's a MAXIMUM weight for Formula One drivers. Yes no more then 163 Lbs.

One more reason why I'll never make it to the F1 show :(

I always thought they were weighing the driver and cars to be sure they made minimum weight but no, once again there's a "MAXIMUM" weight on the cars.

Luckily those that don't like it can always not watch it.

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Originally Posted by SEComposites

Luckily those that don't like it can always not watch it.

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I love F1, I just don't like whatever it is they are televising. ;)

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Originally Posted by rickb99

limit of 4 engines for an entire year of gp racing. What's that all about? It's not like these engine designs are ever going to hit the streets so that level of reliability gets you nothing as a car manufacturer.

No testing except during designated testing days.. Come on, how do you expect other teams to improve and catch mb?

What we need are new rules for engines that bring bmw, alpha romeo, cosworth, maserati, and company's like weslake back in to the game. Expand the available grid slots to 36 and see what that brings.

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Alfa Romeo

the race would have been more fun with the Saubers having been confiscated by the court

i am not a big NAZKAR fan but it is fun to see 40 plus colorful and loud cars blasting by you on the opening laps at the loop

Alonso will show his professional acuity by sitting this out............F1 is long dead

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Originally Posted by rickb99

Schwarzenegger is 6' 2".. that's vertically challenged?? What are you 7' 5"??

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Arnold is actually closer to 5' 10"-11" range he isn't that tall.

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Originally Posted by Jim Nash

Maybe they should go to a spec engine for everyone?

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Honestly, at this point maybe it's not a bad idea? Engines are so damn expensive and what is the benefit to the sport of having different engine manufacturers? Yes there are some cool developments with the latest generation of power units, but at what cost? Maybe they can expand the engine lease/buying program as one potential solution.

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Originally Posted by Jim Nash

MB has done a great job and you think they should give that up because the show is not good? Do a better job and catch MB.

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This made sense when you could actually "do a better job" and catch up. Two things here - too much cost to catch up and rules preventing you from catching up

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Originally Posted by Jim Nash

I am wondering. What part of the rules are a joke?

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The "token system" which allows you to change some of your engine parts within a limited budget. It was intended to contain costs but it also reduces the ability to catch up. Here's a quote from the FIA's own press release last year:

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To control costs over the life cycle of the new formula, development will be subject to a series of restrictions over a seven-year period. These restrictions have been developed to form a defined path that will allow manufacturers to fully develop the Power Units.

“The most efficient way to reduce development cost is to stop it. This is known as a ‘freeze’,” explains Lom. “This was partially done with the V8 engines. It works well with mature technologies but could be risky when imposed on new technologies, as it can lead to a team/manufacturer whose initial product is superior, leading to them achieving a dominant position from the outset and this domination would then naturally persist for the duration of any development freeze. Therefore, we have set out a schedule that will keep costs down but still permit development.”

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Surprise surprise, MB is dominating. They can keep using their tokens to stay ahead, and the rest of the field is using their tokens to try and catch up. Unfortunately, their closing rate is not fast enough and the fans are punished.


Bottom line is Formula 1 is too expensive. I understand the need for open formula. I understand the desire to have Formula 1 be on the constant edge of development, but the cost of those goals is just way too high. The amount of cars finishing on the lead lap is laughable.

Was it really more expensive to allow the teams to develop the engine of their choice? Each team could try to develop whatever engine gave them the best chance to be competitive in their budget. This isn't saying that each team would actually be competitive but atleast they could do what they could afford instead of being required to purchase these enormously expensive PU's.

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Originally Posted by SEComposites

Luckily those that don't like it can always not watch it.

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I agree whole-heartedly.

In fact, I thought the race was pretty good. Even though Mercedes was way ahead (good on them for doing a better job than the others) the rest of the field was much closer than it has been of late. Impressive new drivers (although I give a rat's patootie about how old Verstappen is) that showed very well. Toro Rosso with their act together for the most part - Sainz would have been much further up the order except for a botched pit stop. Williams third on the grid. Vettel and Raikkonen quite close in performance, Sauber doing well with some good racing towards the end.

Some people just want to gritch. They want to focus on the negatives (of which there are several) and ignore the positives (of which there are several.)

I have to agree about Leigh Diffy, though. Pretty weak and hyper-excitable. Hopefully someone like Roku will start showing the BBC feed.

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Originally Posted by Charles Warner

I agree whole-heartedly.

In fact, I thought the race was pretty good. Even though Mercedes was way ahead (good on them for doing a better job than the others) the rest of the field was much closer than it has been of late. Impressive new drivers (although I give a rat's patootie about how old Verstappen is) that showed very well. Toro Rosso with their act together for the most part - Sainz would have been much further up the order except for a botched pit stop. Williams third on the grid. Vettel and Raikkonen quite close in performance, Sauber doing well with some good racing towards the end.

Some people just want to gritch. They want to focus on the negatives (of which there are several) and ignore the positives (of which there are several.)

I have to agree about Leigh Diffy, though. Pretty weak and hyper-excitable. Hopefully someone like Roku will start showing the BBC feed.

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I think I'm just grumpy about how much of a let down the race was (IMPO) when I've been looking forward to it all winter and so I am piling on all the problems I see with F1 both big and small while venting my frustration. I felt like I was fast forwarding through the whole race because of the ads and when the race was running full screen there wasn't much to see except all the problems the teams were facing which were numerous.

Sure, it is easy to see it as complaining about everything I can but it really was a very unimpressive event. Not a single lead change in the top several cars the whole time except for when they pit.

Hell, even the drivers and team owners are complaining out loud for the media to hear which is unusual in such a closed door kind of process F1 wields these days.

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Originally Posted by dsmithwc04

Was it really more expensive to allow the teams to develop the engine of their choice? Each team could try to develop whatever engine gave them the best chance to be competitive in their budget. This isn't saying that each team would actually be competitive but atleast they could do what they could afford instead of being required to purchase these enormously expensive PU's.

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Problem is even a backmarker budget is completely unsustainable. How many people are willing to burn hundreds of millions of dollars for the privilege of fighting to make 107% or to score a point? The turnover at the back of the grid is the main thing that is hurting Formula 1 right now and it's a symptom of the rules and distribution of money/power.

And a USA team is planning on joining that fiasco? :eek:

How about an "Inverse Token System"?

Everyone starts the year with a certain number of tokens.
If you finish in first, you receive 1 token for development and/or testing time.
If you finish 20th, you receive 20 tokens for development and/or testing time.

F1 has a reputation for developing new crazy looking cars and awesome sounding engines. While the relevancy to modern road cars is great, that does not play to the fans. Sure there are some diehard fans that love the technology and stay tuned in for it. But I think a lot of people used to tune in and root for their favorite driver, or to see if the 6 wheeled car would work etc. Now its about as exciting as going to your local track and watching a lapping day.

If the racings stays boring and predictable, eventually the fans will stop watching, and maybe the powers at be will take notice.

With the previous engine rules, when someone came up with a clever aero solution, (double diffuser, exhaust blown diffuser, F-Duct) it got outlawed to keep the cars close. With the new engines, they are keeping the status quo.

Paul

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Originally Posted by PaulT

With the previous engine rules, when someone came up with a clever aero solution, (double diffuser, exhaust blown diffuser, F-Duct) it got outlawed to keep the cars close. With the new engines, they are keeping the status quo.

Paul

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The question then becomes how do they go about equalized performance? With constant development/improvement all season, it will be a never ending exercise in sandbagging to try and get a slight advantage.

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Originally Posted by Ty_Handke_83

The question then becomes how do they go about equalized performance? With constant development/improvement all season, it will be a never ending exercise in sandbagging to try and get a slight advantage.

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Sad thing is that would likely be more interesting than the current set-up

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Originally Posted by Ty_Handke_83

The question then becomes how do they go about equalized performance? With constant development/improvement all season, it will be a never ending exercise in sandbagging to try and get a slight advantage.

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I'm not sure you can equalize the different engines. There are too many variables (fuel rates, etc) and too many components (hybrid/KERS, etc) for there ever to be an apples to apples comparison now.

How did they do it with the last engine formula? During the last stint they got the engines close, way closer than they are now and it only took about a season. If I remember correctly, Renault lagged that time too.

I realize that now the engines, sorry PUs are more complicated.

Paul

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Originally Posted by PaulT

How did they do it with the last engine formula? During the last stint they got the engines close, way closer than they are now and it only took about a season. If I remember correctly, Renault lagged that time too.

I realize that now the engines, sorry PUs are more complicated.

Paul

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The V8s kind of equalized themselves and they were pretty much at the limit when they capped the RPMs. And any 'disadvantage' was probably around 1-2% or so.

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Originally Posted by allof6

Red Bull Has threaten to exit F1 if something isn't done to rein in the MB.

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I'm pretty sure that's not true. Where's you hear/read that?

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Originally Posted by RussMcB

I'm pretty sure that's not true. Where's you hear/read that?

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http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/re...90864/?v=2&s=1

Sadly it is true. Christian Horner completely ignoring the years his cars dominated. Now that the shoe is on the other foot he's not happy.

http://m.crash.net/f1/news/215593/1/...gulations.html

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Originally Posted by SEComposites

Sadly it is true. Christian Horner completely ignoring the years his cars dominated. Now that the shoe is on the other foot he's not happy.

http://m.crash.net/f1/news/215593/1/...gulations.html

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Not Christian Horner as he has no power to take Red Bull out of F1. The Billionaire owner is the one making the threat and who knows how much out of context his words were taken or how serious he was. Never trust media who relies on sensationalism to sell copies...... AKA all media.

whilst the on-track show put on by the f1 circus has declined in many peoples' eyes at least the off-track product is becoming increasingly more entertaining.

at least in a more and more absurd way.

these people amaze me with their tunnel vision.

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Originally Posted by PaulT

How did they do it with the last engine formula? During the last stint they got the engines close, way closer than they are now and it only took about a season. If I remember correctly, Renault lagged that time too.

I realize that now the engines, sorry PUs are more complicated.

Paul

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The engine formula was very simple with an RPM limit. Worked very well imo.

All F1 needs is about 900 to a 1000 hp and who cares how you get it. Make the cars light and powerful without too much Df and give them big tires and people would flock to the races and watch on TV.

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Originally Posted by Jnovak

The engine formula was very simple with an RPM limit. Worked very well imo.

All F1 needs is about 900 to a 1000 hp and who cares how you get it. Make the cars light and powerful without too much Df and give them big tires and people would flock to the races and watch on TV.

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Sounds good to me:thumbsup:

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All F1 needs is about 900 to a 1000 hp...

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Nascar small block Chevy should do it then.

I seem to recall that four teams have Mercedes engines. If you believe that they are all of equal spec (large grain of salt, but they said that is indeed the fact) then the Mercedes car has to be given a large part of the responsibility for the performance. Williams shows signs of being close, but Lotus and Force India are in the also-ran category, even with the best engine. So I think the Mercedes package - PU and car - is the reason for the superiority, and having two of the four or five best drivers doesn't hurt...:greenflag:

Brian

F1 is woderful!1 love it!! of course just like any sport it can be a boring race at times same as a boring Hockey game,soccer,football etc,etc......unless you are talking curling of course:o;)

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Originally Posted by Rolling Stone

F1 is woderful!1 love it!! of course just like any sport it can be a boring race at times same as a boring Hockey game,soccer,football etc,etc......unless you are talking curling of course:o;)

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Curling YESSSSSSSSSSSSSS that is exactly what F1 reminds me of, why i do not watch

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Originally Posted by BLS

Nascar small block Chevy should do it then.

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You want the F1 to consider using small blocks from Chevy? :(

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Originally Posted by provamo

Curling YESSSSSSSSSSSSSS that is exactly what F1 reminds me of, why i do not watch

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I'm reporting you to Bernie AND the Curling Association HA!take that;)

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Originally Posted by Rolling Stone

I'm reporting you to Bernie AND the Curling Association HA!take that;)

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funny aside.....i recently drove cross the states and saw an ad for curling club in some unlikely Great Plains state like Missouri or somewhere out there..........freaked me out

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Originally Posted by provamo

funny aside.....i recently drove cross the states and saw an ad for curling club in some unlikely Great Plains state like Missouri or somewhere out there..........freaked me out

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"Today there are over 15,000 curlers and 135 clubs in the U.S., most in the north central US. but also in about 20 or states. Still more clubs are forming in the wake of the Olympic popularity."

They may be "freaked out" that supposedly intelligent human beings waste their time and a lot of money driving around race tracks in noisy outdated cars.

A little consideration for others' choices of activity?

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Originally Posted by Charles Warner

"Today there are over 15,000 curlers and 135 clubs in the U.S., most in the north central US. but also in about 20 or states. Still more clubs are forming in the wake of the Olympic popularity."

They may be "freaked out" that supposedly intelligent human beings waste their time and a lot of money driving around race tracks in noisy outdated cars.

A little consideration for others' choices of activity?

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like i said i was freaked out, no disrespect implied

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Originally Posted by Charles Warner

"Today there are over 15,000 curlers and 135 clubs in the U.S., most in the north central US. but also in about 20 or states. Still more clubs are forming in the wake of the Olympic popularity."

They may be "freaked out" that supposedly intelligent human beings waste their time and a lot of money driving around race tracks in noisy outdated cars.

A little consideration for others' choices of activity?

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I would be freaked out if there was an auto racing organization near the south pole. Doesn't mean I don't give consideration to those poor souls who would attempt such a thing. :)