Picking up a Van Diemen RF01

I recently won an RF01 H on BaT - chassis 2883 - it is powered by an R1 motor and has an Enterprises SR body on it. The seller was a dealer and has less information than what I'd expect an owner to provide. The car was last raced in 2021.

I've been lurking here for years and have for some time concluded that an SR platform will be the most bang for the buck in terms of performance and fun, and through some conversations feel it will be easier to solo-maintain or at least access components than a tin-top. The downside is that some car platforms are very well supported via forums, while SR type vehicles are more rare.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/20...omments-anchor

The car will travel to the Boston area, and I intend to use it as an HPDE car along with a cohort of Radical drivers.

This type of platform is completely new to me. Some really basic questions:

- I'd like to get you guys' take on how to check over this vehicle before taking it out for a shakedown
- any thoughts you may have about the vehicle's specifications / and origin - like is the motor type original to this vehicle, is the body? there were many speculations in the auction comments
- Where do you guys source spares? Where do you source consumables?
- Who are the race shops in New England who may help support such a vehicle?
- How would you describe ease to work on / maintain these vehicles?
- I have a few leads on vehicle transporters and any additional suggestions will be appreciated.

Thanks,
CCbb

Take it completely apart, clean everything, check every fastener for proper engagement, good threaded holes in castings, etc. Clean up the wiring, any odd packaging decisions, odd mechanical work-arounds, etc, put it back together and now you'll understand the car.

For all Van Diemen parts contact Brad Baytos at Primus


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by Rick Kirchner

Take it completely apart, clean everything, check every fastener for proper engagement, good threaded holes in castings, etc. Clean up the wiring, any odd packaging decisions, odd mechanical work-arounds, etc, put it back together and now you'll understand the car.

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I never really own a car until I take it apart

Well it'll be a steep learning curve it sounds like... I also don't feel bonded to / trust a car unless I've worked on it a lot but to go from receiving to taking the whole thing apart is a different scope of work altogether. I need to dive in...

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Originally Posted by jrh3

I never really own a car until I take it apart

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And put it back together again. With no 'spare' parts left over. ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chittychittybangbang

Well it'll be a steep learning curve it sounds like... I also don't feel bonded to / trust a car unless I've worked on it a lot but to go from receiving to taking the whole thing apart is a different scope of work altogether. I need to dive in...

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My recommendation is to:
1 Check it to make sure it's safe. Take the body off. Clean, inspect, get familiar but don't disassemble.
2 Drive it to get a feel for the car, likes, dislikes and what might need changing for you. Seat, pedals, controls.
3 Make a list of what you want to change, what needs updating, replacing.
4 Then, time the disassembly for when you can do all the changes and put it back together again.

You might get to step 3 and decide - this is too much work or it's not the car for you.
You might get to step 3 and say - this is awesome - exactly what I want - totally jazzed.

If you disassemble first thing, it becomes a project car and may never get done.
If you disassemble after being totally jazzed, it won't be a project, it'll be a priority and you'll enjoy it all and it'll get done.

Too many people buy a car and turn it into a 1-2 year project when it should be a 1-2 month off season refresh.
or even worse it goes for sale in boxes after 3-4 years.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BeerBudgetRacing

My recommendation is to:
1 Check it to make sure it's safe. Take the body off. Clean, inspect, get familiar but don't disassemble.
2 Drive it to get a feel for the car, likes, dislikes and what might need changing for you. Seat, pedals, controls.
3 Make a list of what you want to change, what needs updating, replacing.
4 Then, time the disassembly for when you can do all the changes and put it back together again.

You might get to step 3 and decide - this is too much work or it's not the car for you.
You might get to step 3 and say - this is awesome - exactly what I want - totally jazzed.

If you disassemble first thing, it becomes a project car and may never get done.
If you disassemble after being totally jazzed, it won't be a project, it'll be a priority and you'll enjoy it all and it'll get done.

Too many people buy a car and turn it into a 1-2 year project when it should be a 1-2 month off season refresh.
or even worse it goes for sale in boxes after 3-4 years.

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Can't say I disagree with anything here. I just assumed in making the purchase the guy was ready for the challenge. Reading back over the original post, he needs to find someone to go over the car initially. If he's running with some Radical guys, one of them or whatever shop they use should do.

OP - pay attention to brakes, fuel system, and controls. Problems there can get you hurt in a hurry.

You asked about maintenance. It's a formula car with a body. The body and big sidepods makes it a bit harder to access stuff, although they do give you a multitude of places to mount stuff that the original formula car didn't have. If you are alone, usually taking off the nose and tail sections is a bitch. Saw a Sports Toyota a few weeks back where the owner sacrificed some aero to rivet on some hefty handles to make one-man removal much easier - especially in the wind... Under that body is a formula car. Formula cars are an engineering exercise in packaging. Expect to need at least one more joint between your wrist and elbow. A lot of the access on the later model VDs is easier than on the earlier ones, the question will be how much the bike engine mods changed things and how well they were done.

Guys, some sage advice here. I don't want to end up with a project car in boxes for sure. With lots of things going on the car usually takes last priority and oftentimes I'll get the idea to make an upgrade and order parts, and the thing sits up to months at a time before installation. I'm glad there's a community of folks to lean on both on Apex and in person locally.

If you had to put a percent on it, what % of time do you guys wear the mechanic hat and what % of time do you wear the driver hat in your own car endeavors?

In my experience, with a well built and developed car that doesn't have major issues every time it goes out - 10 hours in the shop for every hour on the track.

That's clean it, change gears for the next event, nut and bolt, and fix any small things/improvements from my notes, and put it back in the trailer. YMMV.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rick Kirchner

In my experience, with a well built and developed car that doesn't have major issues every time it goes out - 10 hours in the shop for every hour on the track.
YMMV.

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Maybe a little less, but not much. Certainly at least 6 hours per event. Plus time when things don't go well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chittychittybangbang

Guys, some sage advice here. I don't want to end up with a project car in boxes for sure. With lots of things going on the car usually takes last priority and oftentimes I'll get the idea to make an upgrade and order parts, and the thing sits up to months at a time before installation. I'm glad there's a community of folks to lean on both on Apex and in person locally.

If you had to put a percent on it, what % of time do you guys wear the mechanic hat and what % of time do you wear the driver hat in your own car endeavors?

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The advice on this forum is golden. I have owned an RF00 with a 2.0L pinto as an FC config for a little over 1 year. I have driven the car for 8 minutes. It took the past year to learn, fix, change it for those 8 minutes. Then I realized how many more small issues the car had. Probably 10 to 20 hours left before I'm back on track at the end of May.

It gets easier, but at first it's climbing a mountain. Post questions here, show up to in person events and ask for help. Welcome to the deep end.

Ok, I've been working slowly and also started a fire.

- replaced centerlocks - 3 were cracked
- replaced lifeline tank and lines - tank was 24 yrs old and PO had inserted 6mm into 8mm hose as a "union"
- pouring foam seat next week (old seat was carbon, when "fitting" myself to the car, I placed the carbon seat loose into the tub and created an electrical fire / short circuit on the battery post.... (ouch, the scab has almost healed )
- Anze is rebuilding the dynamics suspension
- want to replace suspension bolts and herein lies the question:

I purchased the 97+ van diemen bolt kit from primus. A full set of AN hex head bolts arrived. The majority of the suspension bolts on this car are socket cap sae, grade unknown. Is it more likely that (1) the bolts came from the factory as socket caps, and the primus kit just didn't capture later-year variations - there are places where a hex head does not look like it'll fit - or (2) a prior owner at some point replaced the bolts with socket bolts? I hope the primus kit just works but fear i need to get some fractional calipers and put together a detailed set of measurements...

Some photoshttps://www.apexspeed.com/forums/att...d=115531&stc=1https://www.apexspeed.com/forums/att...d=115532&stc=1https://www.apexspeed.com/forums/att...d=115533&stc=1

I only use AN shear bolts on suspension arms and links. Cap screws holding the floor pan are fine but those on the upper a-arm wouldn't be put on my worst enemy's car. I find it hard to believe it was raced like that.

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Originally Posted by chittychittybangbang

Some photoshttps://www.apexspeed.com/forums/att...d=115531&stc=1

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If it's the same as an FC, there are bolts in the front lower A-arms to come up through the floor.

You want the 12pt AN bolts with the flanged head/reduced drive size.

https://www.specialty-fasteners.com/...olts-s/571.htm

Garey can you please elaborate? Are all cap screws bad inherently in terms of fatigue / max tension?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Garey Guzman

I only use AN shear bolts on suspension arms and links. Cap screws holding the floor pan are fine but those on the upper a-arm wouldn't be put on my worst enemy's car. I find it hard to believe it was raced like that.

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That's a lot of beer per bolt! My lower A arms are fastened like this as well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BeerBudgetRacing

If it's the same as an FC, there are bolts in the front lower A-arms to come up through the floor.

You want the 12pt AN bolts with the flanged head/reduced drive size.

https://www.specialty-fasteners.com/...olts-s/571.htm

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For suspension, you typically need shear strength, not so much tension. MIL-spec, also commonly known by the older term "AN", has specifications specifically for shear. I can't think of a tension bolt on the suspension of any of my race cars but I also don't have total recall. Also, I think I've heard of some on VDs but I've never owned one.

Carroll Smith wrote some great books to help us learn, including one called "Nuts Bolts Fasteners and Plumbing Handbook". I'd suggest getting all his books as they are written by a great engineer who knew his audience would not be engineers! As I recall, "Prepare to Win" also had some basic guidance.

A great source of parts I have used a lot is Aircraft Spruce and Wicks. Here's a link to the Aircraft Spruce site for Bolts:
https://www.aircraftspruce.com/categ.../ha/bolts.html

Note on the top right is a shear bolts with a long enough shank to take ALL the shear of the joint being fastened. One bolt to the left is an "internal wrench head bolt", which is a better design. Don't be afraid of buying this stuff - the one shown is a giant specialized IWH bolt and just shows that there are properly designed bolts for every application.

Also note that regular AN/NAS bolts are very robust. These aren't parts you will likely ever need to replace unless they break in an accident so this expense is, by and large, a one time thing (although I visit Aircraft surplus stores and buy cool extras, just in case!)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chittychittybangbang

Garey can you please elaborate? Are all cap screws bad inherently in terms of fatigue / max tension?

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Thanks Gary, I'll look up that nuts and bolts book. I never dove into bolt specifications quite like this before. I've gained appreciation for the purpose of AN bolts and their quality control. Finding the correct vendor is so important here as well as you guys have suggested.

Looking at an rf02 that was on BaT seems to show a very similar usage of socket cap bolts leading me to think they are designed this way.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/van-diemen-rf02/

I will call primus and maybe VD for clarity.

If you get that 12 point bolt for the lower front A Arm, you’ll need a deep socket 3/8 to fit in from the top. Took me a while to figure that out. Can also do 1/4 drive.

https://www.homedepot.com/pep/TEKTON-3-8-in-Drive-x-3-8-in-Deep-12-Point-Socket-SHD13210/310621017?source=shoppingads&locale=en-US&pla&mtc=SHOPPING-BF-CDP-GGL-D25H-025_001_HAND_TOOLS-NA-Multi-NA-PLALIA-NA-NA-NA-NA-NBR-NA-NA-NA-Hand_Tools_Priority&cm_mmc=SHOPPING-BF-CDP-GGL-D25H-025_001_HAND_TOOLS-NA-Multi-NA-PLALIA-NA-NA-NA-NA-NBR-NA-NA-NA-Hand_Tools_Priority-22470249349-176141765697-2391144885493&gclsrc=aw.ds&gad_source=1&gad_campai gnid=22470249349&gbraid=0AAAAADq61UfJdOire6h8bqxEG qE0KA1b3&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI0sT_wv3RjQMVjPzjBx0M9Sj DEAQYASABEgJWyfD_BwE

I spoke with Brad @ Primus - the bolts were originally socket caps, he replaced them with ANs in his bolt kit and will also share a bolt map with me.