How mount an iPhone in a FV?

[fv9]

WIth today's announcement of the new iPhones, I am buying one. I also want to use one of the iPhone lapping apps (uses GPS and accelerometer for live timing, lap counting, speed, etc). The problem is I cant thnk of a good way to mount it. I could use the steering wheel, but I oculd lose the accelermoter features since it would not be stable. I assume the gps features would still work (timing, lap counter, etc). THat may be enough. Any thoughts? If I cant find a place to mount it, I may just mount an aluminum iPhone case to the steering wheel and put the phone in it. Sugggestions are appreciated!

Thanks,
Quinn

[rickjohnson356]

Would mounting on the steering wheel have an effect on the accelerometer? I don't know how a-meters work, but wouldn't the continuous left-right motion mess with the sensing device inside?

It may help to have a picture of the cockpit and a picture of the phone so we could see the relative sizes and maybe give alternate suggestions for placement.

[Matt King]

I'd use heavy duty velcro and mount it to the dash panel above the steering wheel so you can see it over the gauges. That's how I have my AIM mounted in my car and it's very sturdy and helps damp out vibrations.

[fv9]

I'd use heavy duty velcro and mount it to the dash panel above the steering wheel so you can see it over the gauges. That's how I have my AIM mounted in my car and it's very sturdy and helps damp out vibrations.

The only problem is I have a P3. There really is no room on the gauge panel. Add to that the fact that I am 6'3", 220lbs and you get the picture.

Looks like I may have to go with heavy duty velcro on the steering wheel and forego the accelerometer features (not that they are all the extensive anyhow).

[GeoffRain]

I’m an iPhone developer … The accelerometer can be a bit difficult. We have seen differences in calibration from unit to unit not just in the zero offset but also in sensitivity. Also, it’s a 3 axis device which is nice, but when you mount it you’ll want to get it as close to the recommended angle (probably flat / parallel with the track and facing forward) as possible. Avoid any software “corrections” to allow you to mount the device at an angle, as your error will increase as you start to introduce the third axis into the equation. Yes, Accelerometer readings are out the window if you mount it to the steering wheel.

Another area I’d be concerned about is vibration. There are a few subroutines being shared around the dev community to set thresholds and filter out vibration noise from the true G reading, but they aren’t great. Hopefully whoever wrote your software has come up with a better one that is too good to share!

One more thing, the phones are well made, but not fully potted in epoxy – buy the insurance!
Geoff

[fv9]

I’m an iPhone developer … The accelerometer can be a bit difficult. We have seen differences in calibration from unit to unit not just in the zero offset but also in sensitivity. Also, it’s a 3 axis device which is nice, but when you mount it you’ll want to get it as close to the recommended angle (probably flat / parallel with the track and facing forward) as possible. Avoid any software “corrections” to allow you to mount the device at an angle, as your error will increase as you start to introduce the third axis into the equation. Yes, Accelerometer readings are out the window if you mount it to the steering wheel.

Another area I’d be concerned about is vibration. There are a few subroutines being shared around the dev community to set thresholds and filter out vibration noise from the true G reading, but they aren’t great. Hopefully whoever wrote your software has come up with a better one that is too good to share!

One more thing, the phones are well made, but not fully potted in epoxy – buy the insurance!
Geoff

Thanks, Geoff. Nice to have someone who REALLY knows what they are talking about. Do you think that, at the very least, the gps functions should be ok (lap counter/timer)?

This is the app I was thinking about: http://www.firstclass.com/~ron/Lap_Timer/Main.html

[rocost]

Thanks, Geoff. Nice to have someone who REALLY knows what they are talking about. Do you think that, at the very least, the gps functions should be ok (lap counter/timer)?

This is the app I was thinking about: http://www.firstclass.com/~ron/Lap_Timer/Main.html

Hi Quinn,

I am also an iPhone developer responding from Apple's World Wide Developer Conference. I am the author of the Lap Timer app you are referring to. I have a older Reynard F2000 I converted to FB spec with a GSXR-1000. I used this car at Mosport to do some of the testing in the development of Lap TImer. I also had a limited amount of space on the dash, as I use the stock GXSR bike dash and it takes up pretty much all the space. What I did was rivet a 3x5 piece of aluminum onto the top of the Reynard dash and fix the iphone to that with a rubber case I bought for the phone. The phone was just above the top of the steering wheel and did not really inhibit my vision down the track. I tried to glue some velcro on the back of the rubber casing but eventually just riveted the rubber case onto the aluminum panel.

I also did some testing in one of my street cars that used a suction cup holder against the windshield which worked well.

Good luck and let me know what you think!

Ron

[DanW]

Greg Mercurio builds these cases for the iPhone.

http://www.speckproducts.com/product...e?device_id=50

Small world, eh?

[Daryl DeArman]

Wow! Nice cases and selection. Have to bookmark that, my next phone may be an iPhone.

[fv9]

Hi Quinn,

I am also an iPhone developer responding from Apple's World Wide Developer Conference. I am the author of the Lap Timer app you are referring to. I have a older Reynard F2000 I converted to FB spec with a GSXR-1000. I used this car at Mosport to do some of the testing in the development of Lap TImer. I also had a limited amount of space on the dash, as I use the stock GXSR bike dash and it takes up pretty much all the space. What I did was rivet a 3x5 piece of aluminum onto the top of the Reynard dash and fix the iphone to that with a rubber case I bought for the phone. The phone was just above the top of the steering wheel and did not really inhibit my vision down the track. I tried to glue some velcro on the back of the rubber casing but eventually just riveted the rubber case onto the aluminum panel.

I also did some testing in one of my street cars that used a suction cup holder against the windshield which worked well.

Good luck and let me know what you think!

Ron

THanks, Ron. I will let you know how it goes if I ever get it mounted! I dont have room above the wheel as my hands sit just below the bodywork. It is looking more and more like I will just have to go with the gps functions and a steering wheel mount. I will find a case to velcro/bolt to the wheel.

[GeoffRain]

Quinn, You can't do much better than getting the original developer for advice right here on ApexSpeed!. I'd imagine the GPS would work well; a lot of the new DAQ packages use GPS for lap times / splits etc. I actually just installed one but haven't gotten to try it yet.

Geoff

[rocost]

Quinn,

As Geoff mentioned the GPS data acquisition will still work even with the phone rotating in the steering wheel. Of course the acceleration data will be messed up. However, if you can get the phone to sit vertical the longitudinal or transverse acceleration should still be somewhat accurate.

I just had a good chat with the Apple engineer here at the conference responsible for GPS location data on the phone and he mentioned there may be a solution for external GPS units in the works that would allow more accurate positioning due to an external GPS running at higher frequencies. Right now on the phone it is really marginal at around 1.2 Hz, as that is quite a distance on the track. If the support for external units comes out I will rev Lap Timer to take advantage of this. This would allow the iPod Touch to run Lap Timer as well. At that time, I'll put in an option to leave accelerometer data off, which would conserve battery life. Speaking of that, you should wire this to a 12V adapter in the car if you can.


Gotta get one of Greg's hard shell covers.

Ron

[fv9]

Quinn,

As Geoff mentioned the GPS data acquisition will still work even with the phone rotating in the steering wheel. Of course the acceleration data will be messed up. However, if you can get the phone to sit vertical the longitudinal or transverse acceleration should still be somewhat accurate.

I just had a good chat with the Apple engineer here at the conference responsible for GPS location data on the phone and he mentioned there may be a solution for external GPS units in the works that would allow more accurate positioning due to an external GPS running at higher frequencies. Right now on the phone it is really marginal at around 1.2 Hz, as that is quite a distance on the track. If the support for external units comes out I will rev Lap Timer to take advantage of this. This would allow the iPod Touch to run Lap Timer as well. At that time, I'll put in an option to leave accelerometer data off, which would conserve battery life. Speaking of that, you should wire this to a 12V adapter in the car if you can.


Gotta get one of Greg's hard shell covers.

Ron

Ron,

How accurate will lapr and split times be? Will they be as accurate as an AIM system with a beacon? I dont know how spot on the gps is. Within a hundreth? Tenth? Thanks!

[Wren]

Greg Mercurio builds these cases for the iPhone.

http://www.speckproducts.com/product...e?device_id=50

Small world, eh?

Those are some cool cases, I wish he had some for the blackberry I use.

[DB4 Tim]

Don't answer it if it rings.....

[rickb99]

Ron,

How accurate will lapr and split times be? Will they be as accurate as an AIM system with a beacon? I dont know how spot on the gps is. Within a hundreth? Tenth? Thanks!

Some guys used the Google Android Phone last weekend at Portland International:

http://trackmaster.trackaroo.com/welcome

Lap times were within 0.05 seconds of the AMB times.

Here's how they set it up:

http://www.icscc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=416

Looks like you can do it on Google Earth or a Track Walk. Yes Track Walk. Remember the days when we actually WALKED the entire track before a race??

[fv9]

Some guys used the Google Android Phone last weekend at Portland International:

http://trackmaster.trackaroo.com/welcome

Lap times were within 0.05 seconds of the AMB times.

Here's how they set it up:

http://www.icscc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=416

Looks like you can do it on Google Earth or a Track Walk. Yes Track Walk. Remember the days when we actually WALKED the entire track before a race??

Interesting. Thanks.

I dont know if I will run Conf this year or not. My dad runs his CF in Conf. I run it once or twice a year at PIR.