Where to learn about shocks?

[romoman]

What are some good resources to learn about shocks? I have the book by the JRZ guy, but it's pretty much unreadable because of the spelling and grammatical errors.

Where have people found good info?

[mike g.]

Some good info here:
http://www.auto-ware.com/techref/lib_index.htm

And, the Carroll Smith books

And... Fred Phun's handling book: can read preview on g-books here:
http://books.google.com/books/about/...d=cr4IyD5l1NQC

[David Ferguson]

Need more details. What do you want to learn? Which way to twist the knobs on adjustable shocks to solve a problem? How to change the valving? How they affect vehicle dynamics?

I might suggest the manuals (available online) from Ohlins and Penske, or Milliken Race Car Vehicle Dynamics -- depends on your needs.

Some other good reads:
Optimum G (See Springs & Dampers Series on this page): http://www.optimumg.com/technical/technical-papers/

Or if you prefer to watch:
Dyson engineer on their inerter dampers:
Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAlqiLNMhLA
Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwS9ce0dR9w

[S Lathrop]

2 places to start are Milliken/Milliken "Race Car Vehicle Dynamics" and Dixon "the Shock Absorber Handbook".

I would recommend that you read any of the publications from the manufacturer of the shocks you are working with.

But I have not found any written material that has been very helpful.

Most of what I think I know about shocks has come from testing and seeing what works and what doesn't. Every type of shock works differently and those differences make or break your setup.

Each driver will have his own comfort preference for shock settings. As an example, I have built a particular model of shock that is available with 2 different size pistons. I can build 2 sets of shocks and for all purposes they measure the same but to the drivers they are night and day different. Ohlins shocks will give a different feel than Penske, even though the dyno curves are close to identical.

I have also done testing where I have been able to make very significant improvement in lap times with the driver unable to tell me how I changed the car. That particular test took us to 1 sec. below the track record over one hour of testing.

Good Luck

[Jon Jeffords]

This is an interesting read:

http://www.shock-shop.com/Thoughts_o...ock_Tuning.php

[romoman]

Need more details. What do you want to learn? Which way to twist the knobs on adjustable shocks to solve a problem? How to change the valving? How they affect vehicle dynamics?

Good questions. I'm interested in how/why people choose different pistons and valving. How do you go from car data (shock positions, velocities, histograms, etc) to choosing a shock dyno graph? How do you relate a certain dyno graph to car performance?

2 places to start are Milliken/Milliken "Race Car Vehicle Dynamics" and Dixon "the Shock Absorber Handbook".

I would recommend that you read any of the publications from the manufacturer of the shocks you are working with.

But I have not found any written material that has been very helpful.

Most of what I think I know about shocks has come from testing and seeing what works and what doesn't. Every type of shock works differently and those differences make or break your setup.

Each driver will have his own comfort preference for shock settings. As an example, I have built a particular model of shock that is available with 2 different size pistons. I can build 2 sets of shocks and for all purposes they measure the same but to the drivers they are night and day different. Ohlins shocks will give a different feel than Penske, even though the dyno curves are close to identical.

I have also done testing where I have been able to make very significant improvement in lap times with the driver unable to tell me how I changed the car. That particular test took us to 1 sec. below the track record over one hour of testing.

Good Luck

Thanks! I have the Miliken book and will read through the shock sections. I've read most of the manufacturers literature on shocks and how they work, but that doesn't really relate to how to set them up for a particular car or track. That is where I've found a major lack of info. Then, maybe rightly so, the folks who know something about it are not willing to share. I don't completely blame them because I know they have spent significant time and money to gain their knowledge, it just leaves the rest of us in the dark.

[David Ferguson]

I'm interested in how/why people choose different pistons and valving. How do you go from car data (shock positions, velocities, histograms, etc) to choosing a shock dyno graph? How do you relate a certain dyno graph to car performance?

The Optimum G articles (referenced above) will give you one perspective on how you can determine what the shock forces (shock dyno graph) you might be targeting. The manufacturer catalogs & simulation programs can give you insight into what parts will help you get the curve you are looking for.

Experience putting shocks together and running them on a dyno will be invaluable in selecting components such as pistons, or needle valve angles (which control how much adjustment range vs. precision you have).

The Jorge Seegers book "Analysis Techniques for Racecar Data Acquisition" probably has the best written info on interpreting shock speed histograms. This gives you a direction to try for adjusting and/or valving.

As Steve has said, the stop watch & possibly driver feedback are the only way of relating the dyno graph to car performance.

Another approach is simulation. I'm sure you've read many of those Danny Nowan's articles on simulation in Racecar Engineering. Well he has created some youtube video's with some of his insights. Check out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcUmzJP2jS8

Another resource, Roehrig Engineering (industry standard damper dyno) have several interesting articles: http://www.roehrigengineering.com/Te...ion%20page.htm

Hope that helps.

[RobLav]

The complete version of the Ohlins TT44 manual is by far the best read I've ever seen.

[Brian C in Az]

What are some good resources to learn about shocks? I have the book by the JRZ guy, but it's pretty much unreadable because of the spelling and grammatical errors.

Where have people found good info?

Try this link:
http://shock-shop.com/Penske/Pen-Road.php

[cleaver racecar engineering]

Hi,
You guys are talking Ohlins or Penske what about Koni??
Where can you get data and parts to rebuild eg. piston, shafts, seals, the two places out here who do them are no help and they know how to CHARGE.

[S Lathrop]

Koni shocks: I used Anita Millikan at Earls Supply Indy for years. She has retired but they are a good source for parts. www.earlsindy.com

[Tim Mourlam]

I also second what David suggested, the Optimum G tech tips on dampers. Lots of good info in a quick read on their website.