Add more cost please.

[Purple Frog]

Now that we have to reweb every two years.....

At least two seat belt companies were displaying a new design of belts for HANS devices.

It consisted of two shoulder straps for each side. One under the HANS, one over the HANS. It also meant that you had to have an elaborate belt mounting system behind the driver with wizzy nylon bushings etc. A not-minor chassis redesign. The Italian F1000 car on display had the whole deal installed.

I did not get to speak to Jim Downing about what he thought of this issue.

It looked like overkill to me.

[RacerDave51]

Oh please, don't get me started on the belts. I had to replace a set that were totally used up after 6 weekends. But of coures, one has keep in mind, they were improperly stored in my airconditioned garage...

A very Bummed out DaveK

[DaveW]

Now that we have to reweb every two years.....

IIRC, FIA belts are good for 5 years...

[RacerDave51]

FIA belts are good for 5 but SFI are only good for 2 years.

Blood pressure is back to normal DaveK

[Daryl DeArman]

HANS is apparently working with a few manufacturers to continue to improve their product 'package'.

Belts came off the device in certain sled tests. Over time they have made improvements to their design as well as modified their installation instructions in an effort to minimize the likelyhood of them coming off in the real world. As more people use the device and more accidents of varying impacts and angles occur eventually the real world accident will duplicate the sled tests. If they (HANS and Belt manufacturers) have not made enough progress in improving the device and the belts come off...

You know there are other options.

Daryl "proud ISAAC user" DeArman
www.isaacdirect.com

[Bob Coury]

I assume Froggy is referring to the type of belts shown in this document:

http://www.fia.com/resources/documen...HANS_Guide.pdf

[RacerDave51]

Well, here I go again showing my ignorance and at the risk of being overly simplistic--why not just cross our existing ‘body’ belts behind our back? In addition to planting the belts in place through the scissors action, this alternative would also help those folks that have harness mounts a bit too far apart (as many of the older cars have). I'd planned to do that before I decided to move the mounts. At the time, I thought that installation might freak the tech guys out but now that HANS & FIA have come up with the idea, it’ll be OK.

More Penurious than Purple DaveK

[Gregg Baker]

These belts don't add any safety, with the exception of a pure frontal impact at 200Gs--at which point you will be having other problems.

Coulthard thought up this design for comfort reasons and manufacturers are hoping to make a sale because all the cool kids at school have one. Last I heard, Hubbard/Downing, Inc. was not recommending them, so apparently they do not address the slippage issue either.

Save your money for Santa.

[Rick Kirchner]

The first thing that would be nice would be for the chassis manufacturers to look at some human factors and put some adjustability in their seat belt mountings. The curernt generation of VD mounts would be pretty easy to accommodate - just add more tubes for the clevis bolts - but the earlier cars are pretty much a bitch to change.

The old indy cars used to have a couple of long angle brackets on each side with holes for a cross-bar drilled every inch or so. Of course, back then we had Jaques Villeneuve (Sr) wo was only about 5'2 and you had Chris Kneifel who was over 6'5. Jaques had a 85 March with the tub cut down about 3" so he could see out, and Chris had to have a Primus chassis built just for him (was that associated with Baytos anyone?). AJs cars had a tub an inch or two wider at the bottom.

It's nice that our cars are a lot sleeker than the chassis that are designed for the "arrive and drive" crowds - I've always thought the Russell, Barber, and Mazdas looked too bulbous for a formula car, but it seems that a little more room and adjustability could be added in without making it a whale.

[Larry]

...while we are ranting about safety, can anyone tell me if they have developed a crush box for the FSCCA car? It's interesting that one wasn't included in the original design.

Larry Oliver

[Eric Cruz]

Larry,
The 2006 GCR references a new footbox. Haven't checked on availablility.

d. Enterprises foot box part # WM180020J may be installed.

Best regards,
Eric

[Ted Idlof]

I need new belts and my pit crew is Christmas shopping, so any real quick advice would be appreciated. Is Schroth the logical choice for HANS specific belts? Any reason not to go with the FIA cert? Anyone out there discounting Schroth HANS belts?

TIA

[Gregg Baker]

HANS is not recommending anything other than a standard 3" harness system. The best one out there is from Hooker.

[Greg Mercurio]

Hey Ted: I put Schroth in the FC this year and really like them. Easy to put on, and fully adjustable, even the anti-sub strap have adjusters. Will be adding a set to the FF as well. Good luck on the discount though.

[Ted Idlof]

HANS is not recommending anything other than a standard 3" harness system...

True, but they are not recommending against the 2" belts either. They have not tested the 2" belts, so logically (from a legal standpoint), the 3" is all they can "recommend." With their high profile and legal vunerability, few and guarded statements are to be expected.

I put Schroth in the FC this year and really like them. Easy to put on....

Good enough, I'm going with the comfort and convenience factor of the 2" as well.

[racer27]

I've never heard of Hooker Harness for race cars. I'm looking at new belts, does anyone have a web site they can direct me to?

[Daryl DeArman]

I've never heard of Hooker Harness for race cars. I'm looking at new belts, does anyone have a web site they can direct me to?

Here ya' go:

http://www.hookerharness.com/default.htm

[John Robinson II]

Racer, you might also want to look at safequip belts. They have a 2" system that is basically a 3" belt with the sides folded and sewn in. It allows them to use standard thickness webbing, whereas my 2" schroth belts use a thicker webbing to meet the standards. Cole uses a set of the safequip belts in the FC, and he has tested them multiple times this past year...lol. But you will have to change the shoulder mounting points to bring the belts closer together.

John

[SteveG]

Hey Ted: I put Schroth in the FC this year and really like them. Easy to put on, and fully adjustable, even the anti-sub strap have adjusters. Will be adding a set to the FF as well. Good luck on the discount though.

So Greg, which set did you put in? Looks like Schroth has a few different models and price points.

Thanks
Steve

[Gregg Baker]

I've never heard of Hooker Harness for race cars. I'm looking at new belts, does anyone have a web site they can direct me to?

Hookerharness.com, but you have to call and ask for the earth-bound version. Some of their customers, unfortunately, have flown their product into the ground at 500 mph.

[racer27]

I don't know if I buy it, seems counter intutive, but intresting article here on merits of 2" belts:

http://www.schrothracing.com/tech/10

I'm running a fresh HANs specific Schroth 6 point belt, that I no londer see listed. My belts all all 3", looks like the full Schroth HANS line is now 2".

[Ted Idlof]

So Greg, which set did you put in? Looks like Schroth has a few different models and price points.

Greg mentioned "fully adjustable" which would be the Hybrid or the Profi II-6 or III-6. I just ordered the Profi II-6H from HMS Motorsport. They gave me the formula style bolt in hardware instead of the snap in ends.