Flex-fuel mileage?

[Lotus7]

Has anyone run E85 in sufficient quantities in their truck to definitively say that on a $/mile basis it is better or worse than 'regular' gas?
Either towing or not, just trying to quantify the myths and stories.
Thanks.
(BTW, please identify your truck if you have data).

[reidhazelton]

Has anyone run E85 in sufficient quantities in their truck to definitively say that on a $/mile basis it is better or worse than 'regular' gas?
Either towing or not, just trying to quantify the myths and stories.
Thanks.
(BTW, please identify your truck if you have data).

I bet if you google your specific truck, there is a forum for it and a whole thread (or fifty) on E85 mileage. I remember once I was helping a friend in college with his car and we googled something for it - I was amazed at all the forums for early 2000's Cavaliers. Real hot rods, those things.

[steve zemke]

Back when I was working and driving a company car we were required to put E85 in the tank. They were paying, so I really did not care. There are quite a few less BTU's in a gallon of E85 than in a gallon of "Oxengenated" fuel, i.e.up to 10% ethanol. So financially, it really depands on how much less the E85 costs than regular fuel. You will get less MPG with E85 than with regular. You can make lots of power with E85, but you have to run really rich mixture. Drag racers are converting to E85 in some sportsman classes.

[Lotus7]

Thx, I understand the tradeoffs, and while I can price out E85, I'm looking to find out what those real-world mpg reductions are.
(I can't afford to run $1000's through the tank just to learn the hard way that it's less economical LOL)

[pakracer]

Rule of thumb is 10%-15% lower mileage with nothing altered to the engine. same with power, I,e: 10-15% less. So the determining factor is the financial spread between regular gasoline and E 85. Also not easily available available in certain states.

[dd46637]

I had a 2012 f350 with the 6.2 gasser.
Used e85 3 times.
Lost 4 mpg unloaded and 6 mpg towing a 8.5 x 20 box traler.

Never tried that again.

[Lotus7]

I had a 2012 f350 with the 6.2 gasser.
Used e85 3 times.
Lost 4 mpg unloaded and 6 mpg towing a 8.5 x 20 box traler.

Never tried that again.

That's the engine I have; were the three tries long enough distance to be truly representative?
thx

[2BWise]

Rule of thumb is 10%-15% lower mileage with nothing altered to the engine. same with power, I,e: 10-15% less. So the determining factor is the financial spread between regular gasoline and E 85. Also not easily available available in certain states.

15% is pretty much the exact cross over point for when I switch. I bought my truck (Dodge 4.7L w/FF) in 2009 when gas prices were very high. I ran nearly E85 exclusively during the warm months. The fuel mileage loss was right around 15% on average, so if the cost delta was 15% or better I'd fill with E85. In the winter the E85 price spikes and the separation is usually less than 15%. The caveat was that this only worked if I wasn't towing. I saw further decreases in mileage if I tried pulling the race car around.

[Jerry Kehoe]

Great deal for corn farmers, not so hot for the rest of us!

[Daryl DeArman]

Great deal for corn farmers, not so hot for the rest of us!

It's roughly 30% cheaper in LA, and SD counties of Southern California right now. If I could just find a station selling it that didn't cause me to burn 5 gallons and take an hour to get there and back.

[leftwingorange]

Another issue to consider when making comparisons is that the perccentage of ethanol in E85 varies. 83% is the max, but in winter months, there is less ethanol, possibly down to 51% in the coldest climates and months. This is to help cold weather driveability and starting, so you will probably get better fuel economy in those colder months.

As another note, Saab had a package called "Biopower" which was a turbo engine specifically tuned to take advantage of the properties of ethanol and if I remember correctly was quite effective and efficient.

Phil Y

[t walgamuth]

was set up for the E85. Ran really well. No issues. No concern about mileage.....maybe four runs per gallon?

[Lotus7]

was set up for the E85. Ran really well. No issues. No concern about mileage.....maybe four runs per gallon?

thx, but trying to get a handle on the economics of using it in tow vehicles

[Ken Lawrence]

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Ethanol

Ethanol is a renewable, domestically produced alcohol fuel made from plant material, such as corn, sugar cane, or grasses. Using ethanol can reduce oil dependence and greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions. Ethanol fuel use in the U.S. has increased dramatically from about 1.7 billion gallons in 2001 to about 14.4 billion in 2016.¹
E10 and E15

E10 and E15 are blends of ethanol and gasoline. The number after the "E" indicates the percentage of ethanol by volume.
Most of the gasoline sold in the U.S. contains up to 10% ethanol—the amount varies by region. All automakers approve blends up to E10 in their gasoline vehicles.
As of 2011, EPA began allowing the use of E15 in model year 2001 and newer gasoline vehicles.² Pumps dispensing E15 must be labeled (see example). A vehicle's owner manual may indicate the maximum ethanol content recommended for it by the automaker.
Ethanol contains about one-third less energy than gasoline. So, vehicles will typically go 3% to 4% fewer miles per gallon on E10 and 4% to 5% fewer on E15 than on 100% gasoline.³
E85 (Flex Fuel)

E85, also called flex fuel, is an ethanol-gasoline blend containing 51% to 83% ethanol, depending on geography and season. Summer blends tend to have more ethanol while winter blends have less.⁴ E85 can be used in FFVs, which are specially designed to run on gasoline, E85, or any mixture of the two. FFVs are offered by several automakers. We provide a brief guide to help you determine if your vehicle can run on flex fuel.
MPG. Due to ethanol's lower energy content, FFVs operating on E85 get roughly 15% to 27% fewer miles per gallon than when operating on regular gasoline, depending on the ethanol content. Regular gasoline typically contains about 10% ethanol.⁵
Cost. The cost of E85 relative to gasoline or E10 can vary due to location and fluctuations in energy markets. E85 is typically cheaper per gallon than gasoline but slightly more expensive per mile.
Performance. Drivers should notice no performance loss when using E85. In fact, some FFVs perform better—have more torque and horsepower—running on E85 than on regular gasoline.^6,7,8
Availability. More than 2,800 filling stations in the U.S. sell E85. Visit the Alternative Fueling Station Locator for service station locations.

Advantages	Disadvantages
Domestically produced (reduces oil dependence) Lower emissions of some air pollutants More resistant to engine knock Added vehicle cost is negligible	Can only be used in flex-fuel vehicles Lower energy content (lower gas mileage) Limited availability

[dd46637]

That's the engine I have; were the three tries long enough distance to be truly representative?
thx

The towing trip was 500 plus miles.
I had made the same trip earlier that season and those were the number differences that I saw.
Mostly flat terrain with some gentle hills. It was enough to convince me that there was no real savings in using the e85.

[Lotus7]

Thx for that, but anything from the government is with a grain of salt for me ...
"fuel mileage penalty of 15% to 27%..." is way too wide a window for decision making.

Likewise, an earlier reply suggested online forums ... so I checked, and yes, all those internet experts vehemently disagreed with each other that the mpg penalty for my F350 was anywhere from 5% to 35% LOL

hence my request to apexspeed (a true exception to the usual internet dross), for real-world-user data :-)

[Daryl DeArman]

Thx for that, but anything from the government is with a grain of salt for me ...
"fuel mileage penalty of 15% to 27%..." is way too wide a window for decision making.

Likewise, an earlier reply suggested online forums ... so I checked, and yes, all those internet experts vehemently disagreed with each other that the mpg penalty for my F350 was anywhere from 5% to 35% LOL

hence my request to apexspeed (a true exception to the usual internet dross), for real-world-user data :-)

Even if it's a wash (same cost per mile as regular unleaded gasoline) the dilemma then is less dependance on petroleum vs. concerns about air pollution differences. I can't help but wonder about the effects of running ethanol-based fuels, especially in high humidity areas, and its corrosiveness.

[t walgamuth]

Thx for that, but anything from the government is with a grain of salt for me ...
"fuel mileage penalty of 15% to 27%..." is way too wide a window for decision making.

Likewise, an earlier reply suggested online forums ... so I checked, and yes, all those internet experts vehemently disagreed with each other that the mpg penalty for my F350 was anywhere from 5% to 35% LOL

hence my request to apexspeed (a true exception to the usual internet dross), for real-world-user data :-)

I'll try to do better.