Swift DB3/Honda Conversion

[Sean Maisey]

We are revving up the DB3 conversion project. Will be supplying weekly updates here on in. See our progress and project notes at http://carneydb3.blogspot.com

The plan is to have the car out for the 2016 season.

Sean

[S. Frebert]

Awesome to see the progress on this! Looking real good!

[racerjon1]

Awesome - I just put a DB3/Honda in my garage today in Manassas.. (picked it up in Colorado Wednesday) - good to know there is another one sort of close.

[Sean Maisey]

S. Frebert,

Thanks! We actually finished up the frame repaint this afternoon and will probably be able to move forward on reassembly tomorrow afternoon. The repaint turned out quite nice and far exceeds the finish and appearance of the Eastman Chassis Black. I appreciate the positive feedback. Look for more pics and notes over the weekend. Hope to see you at Summit Point or VIR in the coming year.

RacerJon1,

Is the car that you bought the former Russ McBride car? His is the only DB3/Honda that I am aware of. I know he sold it a couple seasons ago. As I recall it was a really nice car.

On another topic, your profile indicates that you are in SC, but you have the DB3 in your garage in Manassas. Are you instructing at Kershaw or the BMW facility. Just curious? Hope to have an opportunity to meet you in person in the coming season as well.

Cheers,
Sean

[Jon Jeffords]

I own the DB1 that your father Bill converted to Honda. I enjoyed reading his blog on the conversion process of said DB1, and now look forward to your progress on the DB3. By chance, is this one of the famed '89 designs?

[teamwalker]

Sean,

I have the former Russ McBride car. Looking forward to seeing your dad and you at SP. My DB3 needs some work.

[racerjon1]

S

RacerJon1,

Is the car that you bought the former Russ McBride car? His is the only DB3/Honda that I am aware of. I know he sold it a couple seasons ago. As I recall it was a really nice car.

On another topic, your profile indicates that you are in SC, but you have the DB3 in your garage in Manassas. Are you instructing at Kershaw or the BMW facility. Just curious? Hope to have an opportunity to meet you in person in the coming season as well.

Cheers,
Sean

Hey Sean, as you see, nope not the McBride car. I got this one from David L who is in Colorado. (79Royal is his screen name here).

I have SC listed here still because it's where I lived until two years ago when I moved to savannah to manage Roebling Road for a year, and when that ended I moved to Manassas to be with my GF and just haven't updated anything. I have instructed at Kershaw, but not BMW. This year I have worked support for World Challenge and event manager for SCCA Track Night In America.

I raced FF in my 83 Van Diemen from 98-01, and this is my re entry into the class.

[ewcmr2]

This year I have worked support for World Challenge and event manager for SCCA Track Night In America.

All the cool kids have F Fits and run TNiA!

[S. Frebert]

S. Frebert,

Thanks! We actually finished up the frame repaint this afternoon and will probably be able to move forward on reassembly tomorrow afternoon. The repaint turned out quite nice and far exceeds the finish and appearance of the Eastman Chassis Black. I appreciate the positive feedback. Look for more pics and notes over the weekend. Hope to see you at Summit Point or VIR in the coming year.

I have to run VIR for sure. Always wanted to race at that track. Cant wait for that....

I'm throwing around some wild ideas of where I want to go from here, not too sure honestly.

Love watching other peoples builds and sharing my own.

[Sean Maisey]

In no particular order...

Racerjon1, great to hear there is another one in existence. Hope to see you and the car at VIR or Summit in the coming season.

Mr. Jeffords, That is a great car. After my near fatal motorcycle accident in 2009 dad lured me out for a test day. I didn't think I was physically fit to race ever again and fitting into the tight Swift cockpit was downright painful. Then I won both races and my awareness of the pain subsided. In retrospect we should have kept that car. But I like my Citation an awful lot and now that we have it sorted the Crossle is probably the best car for dad.

Shane, You NEED to go to VIR. One of, if not THE best tracks in the nation. On my book Mid-Ohio, Road Atlanta. and Road America are tops too. I will always have a soft spot for Summit too since I did driver's school and most early racing there...

Oh, yes Dan's car is one of the legendary '89s. That is why we're doing it.

Sean

[Sean Maisey]

So there will be three Swift DB3 Hondas campaigned out of the DC suburbs this coming season.. What are the odds? We could have some really great fields...

Time to start building up the war chest.

Sean

[Swift17]

....Oh, yes Dan's car is one of the legendary '89s. That is why we're doing it. Sean

From a prior post about " ... legendary '89s ...":

"History - The original db-3s came with a suspension just like a db-1 - as to the body (a) different nose as the wings were for the down force (b) the same mid sections, the end of the nose flair'ed to meet the lower body flair BUT (c) the tail was modified to include in part, the internal snorkel piece mounted on the left side for the 2 Liter carb, the rear opening slightly larger AND the tail shortened to end before the rear wing support. The roll bar was still covered. The engine side covers were longer due to the longer wheel base.

When these "original" db-3s were take to Canada for the pro series, they initially were NOT approved because of the rollbar being cover - some cars actually cut down the scoops but cooler heads prevailed and the db-3 were --- ignored on that issue --- provided the nylon strap was in/on the car to attached to the roll bar to "lift the car" if needed.- the exemption was short lived.

Now to the point, (I am reasonably sure this is correct) - the last six (6) db-3s a/k/a the "'89ers" have revised and close to the future db-6 type suspension geometry; specifically the front leg of the front lower a-arm was raised "about an inch", Doug Learned knows exactly , the width of the attaching points for the heims on the bottom of the rear upright was reduced with the of course different rear upright and, consistent with the front revisions, the front leg of the rear lower a-arm was raised in the module and obviously the distance between the heims to the upright reduced. Since it was a two (2) liter car it was about 1.5 inches longer in the wheelbase; it still had a Mk9-

Further as to the body work, it still had the db-3 nose, mid section, engine covers and tail BUT this time the Canadian pro series would NOT let them run with the covered roll bar, [first time shame on you, the second, shame on me] - so apparently only six (6) of these cars were built -- Bruns then produced the db-6 (exposed rollbar, pushrods, Staffs and all .......)

Of the five remaining "89ers" (one was to have been written off) we thought three have been converted to FF - and the last car built, is still in 2 liter trim and traveled around the country in its new delivery crate for years - an another story for another time but it is in Washington still as a FC with marchsv/Tom the owner.

John Benson traded his db-1 for a db-3 '89er about 2+ years ago and loves it. Apparently the longer wheelbase, the revision of the dive and squat are all good. He has won multiple Majors and Nat'ls here in the Southeast.

In no particular order:

1) Doug Learned has one (F/C);
2) Ian Ashdown has another (FF)
3) David Livingston (FF)
4) John Benson (FF)
5) Written off [?]
6) Tom/marchsv (FC)

I believe Doug sold several "kits" to make "original db-3" owners who wanted to converted their cars into '89er spec.

Maybe
(a) the writing off of the sixth was a "premature" statement
(b) the providing of roll bar numbers could share some light on the issue

[racerjon1]

Racerjon1, great to hear there is another one in existence. Hope to see you and the car at VIR or Summit in the coming season.

So there will be three Swift DB3 Hondas campaigned out of the DC suburbs this coming season.. What are the odds? We could have some really great fields...

Time to start building up the war chest.

Sean

Yeah, I wasn't sure how many their might be, good to know there are a few of us, even better to know that we are all close, I agree with your, "what are the odds..." statement.

I am not sure what races I will end up running this year, I'd *like* to go to the Runoffs, but I will have to wait to see my own work schedule before I can see if a Majors or Regional qualification attempt will work best, or if I will just do a few warm-up races with the car as I get ready for 2017.

[RussMcB]

I have fond memories of my DB-3 Fit project. IIRC, it went pretty smoothly with the HPD DB-1 kit, except for the front engine mounts (which weren't too difficult to fab). It was kind of nice having an extra 1.5" to work with in the engine bay. Maybe it just seemed easy after the RF94 F1000 conversion. :-)

I also remember lusting after the special DB-3/89's. David Livingston has one sitting in his garage (I think, since he's upgraded to a 21st century FF). Cool cars. Still impressive what a major leap those Swifts were at the time.

[Sean Maisey]

Mostly wiring and packaging work today...

carneydb3.blogspot.com

Sean

[racerjon1]

Sean, looking good today and happy to see the progress.

Some questions.

My DB3 also has the ECU at drivers left hip, so that seems pretty common. The previous owner also wrapped it in insulation as he had a couple of (what he felt) were heat-related failures.

From reading on here it does seem like the ECU could be a weak link - either through heat or vibration - when you say industrial Velcro you do mean actual Velcro and not dual lock right? (We saw some vibration issues with data systems mounted on dual lock in World Challenge this year.)

Also - with your switches (Ignition, Fuel, Rain, Start) I am guessing you're going to power on your dash with the Ignition?

[racerjon1]

From a prior post about " ... legendary '89s ...":

...so apparently only six (6) of these cars were built --

...Of the five remaining "89ers" (one was to have been written off) we thought three have been converted to FF -

In no particular order:
1) Doug Learned has one (F/C);
2) Ian Ashdown has another (FF)
3) David Livingston (FF)
4) John Benson (FF)
5) Written off [?]
6) Tom/marchsv (FC)

I believe Doug sold several "kits" to make "original db-3" owners who wanted to converted their cars into '89er spec.

Maybe
(a) the writing off of the sixth was a "premature" statement
(b) the providing of roll bar numbers could share some light on the issue

Looking around the web (researching ways to qualify for the Runoffs and what it actually took this year) I found a guy named Chris H in the Northeast Division/Conference has an 89 Swift DB-3/Honda listed as his car both in National/Conference points and on his YouTube videos.

It looks like it makes another DB-3/Honda for sure, but maybe it's an 89 conversion and not one of the original six? Or, was he renting it from one of the known ones?

[andyllc]

Looking around the web (researching ways to qualify for the Runoffs and what it actually took this year) I found a guy named Chris H in the Northeast Division/Conference has an 89 Swift DB-3/Honda listed as his car both in National/Conference points and on his YouTube videos.

It looks like it makes another DB-3/Honda for sure, but maybe it's an 89 conversion and not one of the original six? Or, was he renting it from one of the known ones?

He is bad fast! Would have been a great dark horse pick at the Runoffs had he gone. I have seen the car and it is nice but I am not sure what year it is.

[Sean Maisey]

Latest here:

http://carneydb3.blogspot.com/2015/1...-progress.html

There are a couple of areas where I am asking for advice and or comment so please feel free to weigh in.

Regards,
Sean

[RussMcB]

The project is looking great - very nice and clean.

I see you're in the middle of deciding LD19 or LD20 brakes. IIRC, going with LD19's may allow more wheel options.

I assume your fire pull is mechanical, right? I've always liked the configuration where you have two pulls - one near the dash for driver and one on the exterior for corner worker. That's easiest with an electrical firing mechanism, but can be done mechanically, too, with some extra thought. In my last car I bought a system from SafeCraft that had two pulls (a little expensive), but I think I've seen people simply drill a second hole in the bottle's handle for a second cable.

Good luck.

[Jon Jeffords]

This may be my OCD talking, but I like to mount the fuel tank check valve in an easy-to-reach location so that I can give it a flick with my finger every now and then to make sure it still rattles (ie, it hasn't stuck shut).

[Sean Maisey]

A little more progress today.

http://carneydb3.blogspot.com

See the end of this post for a discussion of our thought process (so far) on DB3 as a FF Brakes. A lot of options to consider. I appreciate any thoughts.

Sean

[S. Frebert]

looks awesome!!! glad to see the progress!

[Sean Maisey]

https://carneydb3.blogspot.com

Dad was working solo today and sent these along.

[Swift17]

This is a great shot that shows the change/conversion from a standard db-1 ~ db-3 style 'front lower leg front suspension attachment point' to a '89 er setup -- if possible and if you have time to share, a picture of the 'front lower leg rear suspension attachment point' to see the 'point' would be interesting .............

[Sean Maisey]

Not the greatest of images, but it high res so you can zoom in on the rear pickup. Yesterday's update has a pic just like in your post above of the front Pickup Point.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-03f6tZfW76...0/IMG_6731.JPG

I'll scroll through the rest of my pics this afternoon for something better.

Sean

P.S. I don't have any good ones. Just one other that shows the right side partially from the top. We'll get a pic next time we are in the shop and post it here.

[Swift17]

...........it would be the one on the front of the module (lower front for the rear) we believe the module is actually different for an ''89 er - a mode was made to the casting mold

EJ

[Sean Maisey]

Here are to photos that show each side of the car. The are high res so can zoom in pretty close on the pickups.

Both side show evidence of the mods you mention. They appear to have been welded over and slightly relocated. Both side seem the same so I am pretty sure this was a deliberate mod not crash repair.

Also the rear lower crossmember appears curve up on either side I think this is different than the earlier DB1/DB3 unit that was straight across (?)

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-QeDeMS4S8V...0/IMG_6835.JPG

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-R-lrrOqwRT...0/IMG_6834.JPG

Sean

[Sean Maisey]

Today at: http://carneydb3.blogspot.com

About ready to hang the suspension and scare the neighbors

More today 12/21/15...

[S. Frebert]

Progress looks good! Lot of nice parts!

Can't wait to see this at the track!