Hand Tools (Wrenches, Sockets, etc) - What brand?

[BeerBudgetRacing]

Well, it's Christmas time and my son has some new hand tools on his wish list.

We have a full complement of the Lifetime Craftsman (I believe they are made by SK).

Decent but he bot himself a CDI torque wrench (Snap-on) last year and now see's the difference.

So, I started to look into what's what in the market and quickly spun-out...
Snap-on, Williams, Cornwell, Wright, Mac, Matco, etc....

I've read complaints about the handles of Snap-on's being too thin and Cornwell & Wright of have the best handles.

What's your pick and why?

[rave motorsports]

I have some Snap On but the majority are Matco. Quality has been good but a little less cost then Snap On. Just my opinion

[Spengo]

I'm a big fan of GearWrench. They made the original ratchet wrenches and are very high quality tools for the price they ask. Lots of clicks, good finish, good tolerances, and definitely doesn't feel all cheap and **** like Kobalt or anything. They are like the Snap-on of Taiwan, I prefer them to the Craftsman stuff I have.

[SEComposites]

Take a look at BETA too.

[BeerBudgetRacing]

Take a look at BETA too.

Italian tools? Do they work everyday?

I'll keep them in mind....

[dc]

We have a full complement of the Lifetime Craftsman (I believe they are made by SK).

I may be wrong, but SK is made in the US (here in Illinois actually) and there are almost no Craftsman tools made in the USA anymore. I don't think SK makes anything for Sears. I'm pretty sure Sears don't have Lifetime on anything anymore, either, and might not even warranty the old lines. They are a hot mess.

Having said that, SK tools are fantastic, and made in the US. Not terribly easy to find, though.

I like tool truck tools, but not being a mechanic, I don't have access to a truck, so they can all suck it and their 300% markups.

If I'm spending my own cash, I'm sorry, but I love European tools. Hazet, Stahwille, Felo, Wiha, Wera, PB Swiss, NWS, Knipex, Gedore, etc. Hard to get, and expensive, but then again so are Snap-On, and then you're paying for the name and brand with S/O.

So yeah, bad answers to your questions—none of them are easy to get your hands on. At least, not for easy gifts.



Now, for a set of tools as a gift, if you want easy access, decent prices and Made in the USA (hard to find today), the Mastercraft line of hand tools from Menard's is a dark-horse surprise winner in my book. Really good selection of tools, you can buy onesies and odd balls right off the pegs at your local Menard's. They make a nice product.



I like tools.

[Pi_guy]

In the Snap On camp. Stuff from 40 years ago warrantied no issues.
My favorite example is the chrome universals, I have never used an other universal and I have used them all that matches the Snap On ones in range of motion and a inability to get locked or bound up. I have a 1/2 air drill with close to 40 years in service.
The only real thing I would not buy of Snap On is the welders, Miller is the way to go with welders

[Nardi]

I am also a gearwrench fan, just missed a killer sale on more.....not that I needed them but I have found I prefer them. Aside from that, I have worked with just about every name brand of hand tools and genuinely like the feel of craftsman the best.
Of course, now that arthritis has consumed my hands and most of my other joints, I don't like working with tools like I used to.

[BeerBudgetRacing]

I may be wrong, but SK is made in the US (here in Illinois actually) and there are almost no Craftsman tools made in the USA anymore. I don't think SK makes anything for Sears. I'm pretty sure Sears don't have Lifetime on anything anymore, either, and might not even warranty the old lines. They are a hot mess.

Pretty sure that is wrong. Craftsman has a rebranded Gearwrench and they do have their full polish line with lifetime warranty....

Some Made in US - Some in China - Lifetime Warranty
http://www.sears.com/craftsman-3-pc-...4&blockType=G4

Made in US - Lifetime warranty:
http://www.sears.com/craftsman-premi...&blockType=G31

This is the problem with Craftsman - no guarantee you'll every get the same product twice....

One of the reasons I stuck with Craftsman the past was the lifetime warranty. My house burnt down in 1990. I literally took a melted toolbox to the store and walked out with a whole new set of tools.

Not sure that would happen today though.....

[Albatross]

Sounds to me that he is old enough and perhaps would be proud to pick and choose for HIMSELF. Give him money in a nice father to son Christmas card.

[BeerBudgetRacing]

He's 25 - so yeah

Was considering buying 2 or 3 3/8 rachets of different brands to compare.

Problem is they are all mail order....

[Shanerc]

If he is enrolled in a school, Snap On has a program that you can buy the tools through the school at a very substantial discount. I am sure other companies do that also but I am familiar with the Snap On program. You can also get around the mail order situation by calling the corporate office of Mac, Matco, Cornwell, Snap On, etc, etc and give them your location and they will put you in contact with a local dealer truck. That is what I have done in the past, just setup time and place to meet the Snap-On man at one of his stops on the route.

Last week my neighbors wife bought him a Craftsman tool set for his birthday. It was one of those box sets. 250ish piece, sockets, wrenches, ratchets, metric & sae in a plastic molded box. Well about 30% of the wrenches didn't have any points in the boxend part of the wrench, just a round hole. Also over half of the 3/8 drive sockets would not connect to a ratchet because the square was so distorted. I have never seen anything like that before. In the 80s craftsman was good top of the line stuff and has gone to crap in recent years. My neighbors tool set lets me know it hasn't gotten any better.

[TimW]

I like tool truck tools, but not being a mechanic, I don't have access to a truck, so they can all suck it and their 300% markups.

So yeah, bad answers to your questions—none of them are easy to get your hands on. At least, not for easy gifts.

Snap On has a not very usable website (the search is terrible, as is the faceting-double UX hit) but will sell to anyone. Its list prices and the trucks will often discount a bit, but they do have free shipping up to $500 (i.e. no free shipping on toolboxes, but pretty much all hand tools) and everything is available there and orders ship out the next day usually (but often best to find the part number elsewhere or use site:store.snapon.com in Google search)

[DanW]

May not always be what you think.

Brands buy and re-brand for themselves. I bought a "Blue Point" 1" dial torque wrench for $50 on fleabay. It shipped from the manufacturer in SoCal. The identical wrench is branded Snap-On in their catalog.

Example:
Stanley/Black & Decker own Proto, DeWalt, Vidmar, Lista, Facom, Aerocom, MAC, AeroScout, Bostich and others.

Craftsman was a great brand, but has fallen because of KMart ownership. I predict it will be acquired by Stanley when KMart goes bankrupt. There is no more Sears as a company, its just a front brand for the ownership group.

Regards,
Dan

[Daryl DeArman]

There are plenty of quality hand tools out there that don't cost a fortune.

Snap-On, Mac, Matco all made their fortunes on selling image. Some of their tools are superior quality to others but not many. Same with their boxes. It's an industry full of keep up with the Jones and tool box envy...all where a guy can buy a $10,000 box on payments of $50/week. I know, I have family friends that made their living owning a tool truck.

I have a Craftsman set that I got for my 16th birthday (over 30 years ago) and another partial set that I inherited that is at least 60 years old. The only tools that haven't stood the test of time are 1/4" and 3/8" drive ratchets and screwdrivers, maybe a set of side cutters.

I have replaced those ratchets with Snap-On because I prefer their fine tooth ratcheting mechanism. My allen wrench set is Bondhus. My torx set is Snap-On. My side cutters and pliers are Klein.

Simple 6pt sockets and 6pt combination wrenches don't have to be top dollar items to fit your hand and be made with very good tolerances.

Plenty of Snap On tools are made in China...not to say that others are not. I know many of them are. Just don't be mislead into believing that because you are paying a premium that you are getting a premium product.

[BeerBudgetRacing]

If he is enrolled in a school,

He's graduated college and is a Realtor. This is hobby stuff..

Last week my neighbors wife bought him a Craftsman tool set for his birthday. It was one of those box sets. 250ish piece, sockets, wrenches, ratchets, metric & sae in a plastic molded box. Well about 30% of the wrenches didn't have any points in the boxend part of the wrench, just a round hole. Also over half of the 3/8 drive sockets would not connect to a ratchet because the square was so distorted. I have never seen anything like that before. In the 80s craftsman was good top of the line stuff and has gone to crap in recent years. My neighbors tool set lets me know it hasn't gotten any better.

Geez - must have been a Friday set? (Never buy a car made on what day?)

I have that same set and it's fine. Bot it after several discounts.

[Swift17]

FYI -

Tools w/ Storage/Boxes ~ I have long been a buyer of used Snap-On hand tools (including many that came in three used boxes, one being a KTL 722 - all bought from an aftermarket stereo installing company going out of business NO GREASE !!!) and on occasion, a specialty new hand tool (1/8" 1/4 drive socket allen, by example) having chased a truck down to get them OR to/for exchange; a pain at best. I have been told by the driver that policy may change as some have bought used broken tools from pawnshops and flea markets and swapped for new. (Bad Karma)

I also have a Mac 8100/8200 combo that came with Mac tools. Interestingly, also bought from a aftermarket stereo installing company going out of business and again NO GREASE !!!

These Mac and Snap-on Tools have served me well (as did my first set of Macs bought w/ a box from a pawn shop 1977 and my ORIGINAL Craftsman tools set (1970)

Now IF the need to supplement, I use Craftsman Professional Series, GearWrench, etc from Sears (note - on a recent trip to an ACE store in Detroit -after lunch @ Vinsetta's Garage, , that store had a full Craftsman tool section)

Tool Storage/Boxes ~ I bring this up and many of these boxes came from Waterloo Industries from Iowa and Sedalia, Missouri - these included Craftsman - Mac and some Matco - was well as many others other - I believe some Snap-On's as well - Waterloo now sells there own line .. It appears for ALL companies, that ALL lower line boxes are from China.

For us weekend warriors the medium to high grade from Sears/Craftsman, Lowes/Kobalt, the occasional sale and stainless steel ones from Costco and then Northern Tool/Homak or some may say the high-end ones from Harbor Freight (especially when on sale) are all you need. Ball Bearing positive latching drawers a big plus.

Tools for Son - I recently bought some new tools for Jason as a (one of many) house warming gifts to supplement other prior tool gifts and these all have been Craftsman "Professional Series" tools. But based upon my experience, and for Christmas this year I went on the afternoon of Black Friday and purchased a 32 piece rachet'in MM SAE wrench set from Sears by GearWrench which came with a tool box tray insert (I see Northern tool had the same set for $20.00+ with a different but better tool box insert tray)

Important to me Now - On the rare occasion when I need to exchange a broken tool it is very easy, no question swap at the local Sears which is less than 10 min. away.

Whew.......

P.S. Ummmm - at my they'll need a truck just for the tools YIKES

[924RACR]

Just got turned on to this guy, a fellow enthusiast selling stuff (no affiliation):
http://www.motorsport-supply.com/

He sells Williams tools... as I've now given up on Craftsman sockets, starting with all Allen bits, I've ordered up a set and look forward to seeing how they are. Not quite ready to commit to the really spendy Euro stuff. Yet. We'll see... seemed like a decent balance of price and quality, I hope...

[BeerBudgetRacing]

My son found these today and believes them to be a necessary addition to the kit.


http://www.mactools.com/en-us/Gifts-...teak-Knife-Set

I don't think I can disagree....

[marshall9]

Pretty sure that is wrong. Craftsman has a rebranded Gearwrench and they do have their full polish line with lifetime warranty....

Some Made in US - Some in China - Lifetime Warranty
http://www.sears.com/craftsman-3-pc-...4&blockType=G4

Made in US - Lifetime warranty:
http://www.sears.com/craftsman-premi...&blockType=G31

This is the problem with Craftsman - no guarantee you'll every get the same product twice....

One of the reasons I stuck with Craftsman the past was the lifetime warranty. My house burnt down in 1990. I literally took a melted toolbox to the store and walked out with a whole new set of tools.

Not sure that would happen today though.....

No attorney here, but would think that if you bought Craftsman that were warrantied, they would have to honor it. I took three ratchets back recently and they replaced them . They were 20 years old and worn out internals. Not given new ones, but refurbished......

[patman]

I mostly buy either craftsman or European tools (particularly German when available).

There are always rumors that the craftsman warranty is gone, but it is still listed on all their hand tools and still works fine at my local Sears. That said a lot of their tools are made in China now and the basic ratchets are total junk. The professional (polished) ratchets are fine for me though. On the other hand IMO Craftsman tool boxes and especially floor jacks have gone down hill to the point I wouldn't even consider them. On a side note my local sears had an Allen branded 'zero-turn' ratchet the other day that was pretty cool, I almost bought one but it was China or Taiwan so I passed. It seemed like a cool idea though...

I will never pay rip-off prices for snap-on. Half of them are made in China now too anyway. If I see used snap-on I look into them, but as some have mentioned the guarantee isn't so great when you have to go chase down a truck somewhere to do an exchange.

I am surprised to hear y'all like GearWrench, I got a set of those for Christmas 10 years ago when they first came out, and they were some of the worst tools I ever owned. Maybe they have fixed them since then.

I have more HF tools than I care to admit, but they are for sure junk, I just buy ones that I wouldn't otherwise be able to own. A few things like their high end tool boxes and floor jacks aren't too bad, most of the other stuff I have has paid for itself but barely.

I have used some Proto tools in the past and been pretty impressed. They are cheaper than snap-on but still a little pricey.

The only other thing I can say is check out your local NAPA. NAPA has their own branded tools which in my experience are mostly USA and pretty good quality as well as sometimes they carry Williams or Cornwell. It really depends on the store whether they have a good enough selection though.

If anyone has used the new DeWalt hand tools I'd be curious to hear how they are. I have had great luck with their power tools but the hand tools look questionable to me.

[dereklola]

1 - Broke my 1/4" drive 1/8" hex key this morning - not one tool or set of such tools on sale in any of the dozen or more places in town. Wasted half the afternoon.

2 - Tried the internet - same result - does no one use these handy little tools these days? Not only that but (as already mentioned) most search engines are useless. One search engine wouldn't accept "special characters" like "/" in 1/4" etc. Oh dear - where are we headed?

3 - But I did find this beauty - full quote on its own page - no other info - "High Quality Auto and Industrial - $7.95 + $5.99 shipping". I wonder what it was!!!!!!!

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh.

[BeerBudgetRacing]

I stopped by Sears today to see what they have. Not a lot. Stock is dwindling.
Picked up several of their better tools - made in Taiwan.

They had a very big display of "axxess" tools. These are socket sets using a different drive system. The sockets are 2 sizes (both 10mm and 12mm in the same socket)
Picked up an extension - it was hollow. I can't imaging any of this stuff lasting a day.

Everything made in China or Taiwan... too bad bean counter destroyed a brand....
but then again, anyone that turns a wrench is a rare breed today....

[Purple Frog]

I've been sort of following this thread. Trying to think clearly about tools as gifts. Sort of stood in the middle of the shop and realized I probably have over $10K in tools. I counted 23 different hammers, and I know the differences. Ratchets and sockets make up maybe 4% of the inventory. The tools that are the money makers are the special ones. Special punches, vices that don't break with a hammer strike, picks, C-clip plyers, cleco plyers, taps. dies, easy outs, flaring tools, lasers, leak down gauges, ... the list goes on and on. Then... walk into the woodworking shop.
OBTW, I make a living using hand tools and power tools. I have the proverbial boatload of tools.

But, back to post #1. I'd gift the newbie with an accurate measuring caliper. So much depends on understanding the accurate size of things. Beginners don't buy calipers. They buy shiny ratchets and sockets. But, measuring devices open up the whole world of learning what really is going on.

[TimH]

But, back to post #1. I'd gift the newbie with an accurate measuring caliper.

For working on our cars, what I really lack is a thread-checker. Some of us can eyeball metric vs. SAE but sometimes I sure can't.

[Swift17]

My son found these today and believes them to be a necessary addition to the kit.


http://www.mactools.com/en-us/Gifts-...teak-Knife-Set

I don't think I can disagree....

......

and these

[924RACR]

I counted 23 different hammers, and I know the differences.

Know how I know you drive a Ford? j/k

[stephen wilson]

I am surprised to hear y'all like GearWrench

I agree. I work in Industry, and have been using Armstrong reversible combination ratchet wrenches and they have been great. They are a Long Pattern, so you get more leverage than most of the competitors, and I've never broken one yet. Proto also has a very nice Long Pattern double box wrench, with a thick beam that's easy on the hand.

[stephen wilson]

1 - Broke my 1/4" drive 1/8" hex key this morning - not one tool or set of such tools on sale in any of the dozen or more places in town. Wasted half the afternoon.

I assume the hex portion broke? Often you can pull out the broken piece and make a replacement from a cut down L-key.

[Jim Edmonds]

Tim, For thread checkers I like the S&W wall mounted thread checker. I saw one in the local ACE. Ordered on line, one for my trailer and one for the garage. Google S&W wall mounted thread checker and pick your favorite tool company to order from. Jim

[Daryl DeArman]

Saw Snap-On branded stuff at COSTCO yesterday. Wonder how the discussion over approaching Costco went in the board room? One more step and they'll be in Target and WalMart....tool truck owner/operators must be thrilled.

[BeerBudgetRacing]

....tool truck owner/operators must be thrilled.

I've done a lot of reading online (all true - its the internet) and that is a chief complaint.
Maybe they feel they've saturated that market.
The feeling is Snap-on is banking on the name and going offshore.

They own other (Chinese) brands but never had the snap-on name on them. Now they brand everything snap-on....

The ones in Costco are probably Chinese..... after all, the US made production simply couldn't handle the size of the order Costco would want.

[patman]

Picked up an extension - it was hollow. I can't imaging any of this stuff lasting a day.

I know this isn't what you are referring to, but my wife got me a set of those Craftsman hollow sockets with the spline drive ratchets a couple years ago. I thought it was totally worthless until I started using it; now it is the set that goes in the truck with me everywhere. For a cheap present I would definitely consider getting someone that set. (note: this was the polished ones, not the cheesy black cheap ones, she's not that dumb.)

Also, as someone who uses thread gages on a daily basis, I like this set:
http://www.amazon.com/Uxcell-a101011.../dp/B00N41CX6G

Had to get those from a specialty place years ago, now Amazon has them. Really nice having metric and standard in one set; I just cut a place in the foam for them in the case with my calipers. The 55* whitworth is close enough to SAE that you can't tell a difference. Plug gages are nice but you can't measure pipe fittings or lathe-cut threads with them.

[john f]

1 - Broke my 1/4" drive 1/8" hex key this morning - not one tool or set of such tools on sale in any of the dozen or more places in town. Wasted half the afternoon.

2 - Tried the internet - same result - does no one use these handy little tools these days? Not only that but (as already mentioned) most search engines are useless. One search engine wouldn't accept "special characters" like "/" in 1/4" etc. Oh dear - where are we headed?

3 - But I did find this beauty - full quote on its own page - no other info - "High Quality Auto and Industrial - $7.95 + $5.99 shipping". I wonder what it was!!!!!!!

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh.

go to bottom of page.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#ball-end-hex-drivers/=10a5vq5