CDL requirements for big conversion motorhomes
I have been researching truck chassis to build a motorhome conversion on. It seems like the right choices are trucks with a front axle rating of about 12,000# and a rear around 24,000#. That puts the GVW into CDL requirement. Does that mean that most people with the larger conversion trucks and toterhomes at the track all have CDLs, or is there a way of avoiding it?
I think the common way around that is that they are classified as RVs, which don't have the same rules.
You generally need a CDL if the vehicle is owned by a business or used in business of any kind, including private racing for prizes, contingency, or a track support business. If the vehicle combined weight is over 26K lbs or the trailer is over 10K lbs in many states you need a Class A license but it can sometimes be non-commercial for RV use. You need to figure it out for your state - driver's licenses are reciprocal across all the States and Canada, but the vehicle has to be legal in the location it's being driven in, weight, length laws, axle requirements, etc.
A lot of people pretend their commercial toter-homes are RV's but get ticketed regardless. The horsey crowd is the same, they pretend their horse trailer with a little sleeping area is a travel trailer. Some places it's legit - in Ontario you can legitimately license a toter-home as an RV because it meets the rules, but you still need a Class A license to drive it.
Brian
I would avoid getting the CDL if possible. Once you have one, you are required to follow the requirements regardless of the vehicle you are in (blood alchohol limits, points, etc).
I converted A freightliner FLD 120 80,000 gvw to an rv no cdl to drive it. Had the title & registration changed to rv. All states have rules on conversions . Here in south Carolina they have a home built rebuilt affidavit that lets you do conversions. You do your conversion and have it checked by a highway patrolman to verify the changes you made stated on the affidavit.
Asphalt is for Racing Grass is for Passing
CEC Racing RF96 #97
Chuck Cecil
What Brian said ^^^^
In addition to Brian's comments - one more thing that isn't reciprocal is the requirement of inspections. If your home doesn't require a particular inspection (6 month on power unit, or trailer if not air-brake - like Saskatchewan for example), but the location you're travelling to does (say, Ontario) - you had better get it inspected before you leave.
Gary Tholl
#24 BlurredVisionRacing
The idea that people are allowed to drive these things as RVs with an ordinary driver's license and no CDL training is scary.
I've had a Class A CDL for nearly 40 years. The training is minimal. Ditto the physical. It's all about the individual, not the licensing... Same for Dr's, Engineers, Police, Used Car Salesmen, Race Car Drivers...
"An analog man living in a digital world"
be warned they have been working to close the RV loop hole for a couple years. Best bet is just get the CDL and be done with it.
Kevin Firlein Autosport,Inc.
Runoffs 1 Gold 3 Silver 3 bronze, 8 Divisional , 6 Regional Champs , 3x Drivers of the year awards
Not as scary as being on the track with 1/2 the folks who hold scca racing credentials .......Originally Posted by Tom Valet
Regardless of what you decide to buy or build, study the CDL literature and take the Class A endorsement exam (no driving exam at least in GA). With the 'heavy vehicle' endorsement, you are in MUCH better shape should you be stopped or involved in an accident. The additional "expectations" for CDL seem absurd to me, so I prefer not to have one, since I really don't NEED it. Make sure your vehicle (if not 'RV LIKE') is clearly marked NOT FOR HIRE, but if it resembles a Tractor Trailer rig (like TOTER HOME), best that you pass through all of the interstate weigh stations. Just make sure you are well under the limit in all states you pass through.
No promises, but ...
I also put NO "company logos" on my trailer (towed with my 36' RV).. looks too much like COMMERCIAL stuff.
Steve, FV80
In fact, they are not really "allowed" to drive them with a standard license. In MOST (if not all) states, if you drive anything that's over a certain weight limit (probably varies by state) - like 20,000 lbs or so - you BETTER have an endorsement on your license if you get stopped... for ANY reason - seat belt chk? random license ck?
I'm certain there are MANY out there driving these heavy things without that endorsement, but they shouldn't. There ARE things on the test that you SHOULD know beforehand.
Steve
Steve, Federal law draws a line in the sand at 26,000 GVWR for 2 axle vehicles.
As you've pointed out "For Hire" throws you into commercial status.
Airbrakes require an endorsement.
Reportable quantities of HAZ-MAT require an endorsement.
The rest pretty much varies by state.
Log books/hours of service restrictions and all kinds of other b.s. really complicates things. If you don't NEED that type of vehicle don't bother, too much hassle unless your day job already dictates that you have a CDL.
Stevan,
Checked it several times here in KY. If it's commercial over 26000 lbs or you carry paid passengers (bus, taxi, etc). You need a CDL. If it is an RV, no CDL required. My Freightliner Toter is registered as an RV so it would not require a CDL. I asked about driving in other states and was advised this is reciprical. I don't know about any other states other than NC and it was also non-CDL there.
Al, According to this :
http://www.michigan.gov/sos/0,4670,7...3067--,00.html
you also don't need one as long as you get it licensed as an RV.
www.IRV2.com is the forum to go for discussion on this topic. They have a section on conversion vehicles.
Jim,
I agree - no arguments - Not COMMERCIAL, then NO CDL REQUIRED.. *HOWEVER*, as I said above if you have a vehicle/combination over a certain weight (varies by state), you best have a Class A endorsement on your license. It's minimal effort and maximal support if you get in "a situation" with a BIG RIG.
Better safe than sorry and .. MINIMAL effort. If you are involved in an accident as the driver of a vehicle > 20k lbs (regardless of 'RV' status), SOMEONE will ask you if you have an endorsement for a vehicle that large. Took me only 3 hours of study to ace the test at the local DMV some 20 years ago. Not logical to NOT be 'endorsed' IMHO. I did also pass the air-brake section, but at least in GA, there is no air brake endorsement (or hazmat, or anything else) for a Class A cert - only if it's CDL (in GA, as of 20 years ago)...
YMMV (but WHY take a chance??) I think the cert was FREE (at the time) and it added 5 years to my license. The CDL manual was also FREE - Class A is the EXACT same test as the CDL except for the logging and certification issues and possible endorsements (such as Hazmat) ... or WAS 20 years ago.
Steve
One more reason to leave CA
The non-commercial Class C here will allow you to drive over 26K RV but 40' max length.
The key is if you are commercial or not in the eyes of the trooper on the ground at the time. I know that circle track racers who race for prize money are commercial, and I know that contingency/start money, free tires, free entry next race, etc., can all make you commercial. I have heard that trophies have been considered commercial. Race team logo on the side of the trailer can make you commercial. If your business sponsors your racing effort, you can be considered commercial. RV's are subject to the exact same rules about commercial as any other vehicle, so licensing as an RV is irrelevant although good camouflage. Thank goodness the rules up here are easier to deal with, here it's purely based on weight, there is no CDL. Mind you I have to stop at weigh stations with my pickup truck in province, the weight limit is only 6600 lbs RGW.
Brian
Well, I thought ' Private, not for hire ' would let me skate on our race trailer. I already started the logo process... I think it best we all call our DMV & find out to be certain. I'm in Minnesota, they don't like fast cars here. I'm probably screwed. When I lived down South, the local Police, county Deputies & even State Troopers would all pull me over to check out my street rod. I'd just open the hood, let 'em hear the straight pipes roar, then, we'd have a little drag race outside of town, just to see if I really could out run 'em. Never got a ticket. Often times they called in for 'back-up', just so there buddy coulld see it run, too...I do miss those good ole boyz...
"An analog man living in a digital world"
And they don't always know the law. We had a guy at work have a huge problem on the side of the road in NM when he blew a weigh station and was pulled over and did not have a logbook or medical card, all of which was perfectly legal. It took hours to get everything sorted out.
Sure you are. Federal req't is 26k, most states go by that. Some are lower, but if your home state isn't lower, you're good in every state.
Heavier than 26k you need to have an endorsement or different class, but still I'd consider it a "standard license", ie not CDL.
I didn't think anyone here was arguing against getting the class A (if required for your vehicle). The argument was against CDL if you aren't commercial. The CDL test may be easy but maintaining it is a pain. log books, etc.
...and the trend appears to have states putting restrictions if you test in an AUTO trans you will only be licensed to drive a AUTO trans Class A.
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