New FB builder Hurley Race Products
For those who do not know, I am getting a former DSR converted to FB by Hurley Race Products. I wanted to share some of the pictures of the great work that Mike Devins is doing on my car. I'll be using a 06 Suzuki for now while I get back to racing after being out since 05, Later next year I may plan to replace the 06 with an 08 model.
Last edited by Mike Holland; 03.16.12 at 7:42 PM. Reason: forgot a pic
very slick, what did it start life as?
Before
It was this car, that had a very tragic end.
Started out life as a RF-98 FC - I did the conversion on it when it became a DSR.
This will be a one off since the NOVA conversion pretty much takes care of the late model VD conversions. Side pods and diffuser will fit the NOVA conversion.
Good to another one coming on line!
The side pod extensions look good and a little familiar.
So when is the targeted first time on track?
Looks good. When do you think you are going to take it to the track?
I like it....Devins does nice work
Anyone with a Nova conversion needs a set of those pods, floors, and diffuser. Nice packaging Mike.
Gary Hickman
Edge Engineering Inc
FB #76
F-B
Car looks great.
Great work that Mike Devins is doing on the car.
Post some pictures when it is all done, we would all like to see it when it is completed.
Best of luck.
Mike
Last edited by Malfred; 03.17.12 at 10:27 PM.
Oil cooling
More pictures on the oil cooling duct
Are those a pair of oil coolers
from a FD RX7?
Also known as the devided double pass oil cooler.
I was there yesterday as Mike is helping me with a front attenuator for the Formula Ford. Mike is very knowledgeable and helpful. The FB looks beautiful. Mike craftsmanship is second to none
Awsome work Mike , I would not expect anything less,,,,,,, what happened to the dsr .. I really did like the oringial body you made. Super..... i almost bought that car
The coolers are distributed by Summit, B&M SuperCooler (made by Long - Tru-Cool).Originally Posted by glenn cooper
I have been using these for years in an 11" x 11", these are 5.5" x 11".
BTW one 11 x 11 is what is in the LSR II that went to Australia, tested earlier this month in 100 degree heat with a built DSR spec motor and no cooling issues.
Last edited by Mike Devins; 03.24.12 at 8:46 AM.
Cool
How big is the water rad on the DSR compared to the FB?
It looks like the pair in paralell/series/konectid tuh-getha like that will offer plenty.
I'm diggin' the custom duct - it looks The Business!
17 x 10 for the DSR 170 sq/in
20 x 8 for the FB 160 sq/in
The DSR rad is a thinner core 1", VD rad is 1.75" so the cooling area for the FB is actually larger.
Can someone please translate "series/konectid tuh-getha oil cooler" to German. I came up with this from the internet Reihe angeschlossenen ölkühler apperat but I really think that Mike Holland deserves one of those 80 letter words to describe this thing.
Diffuser looks familiar
Wren, help ---
-- curious about the diffuser... and its familiarity. Where have you seen it prior? Curious, because it looks to be of such high volume -- and without strakes.
Thanks,
Chris
diffuser
Chris, I'm not positive but I think that's the same diffuser he built for Brandon.
Jerry
Diffuser
Here is the posts on the diffuser.
http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37720
Thanks, fellas ---
I suspected it was the Dixon diffuser. Interesting in that there are no internal divisions in the thing.
As said before, it's a great looking car, Mike.
Regards,
Chris
Yes, it is the diffuser that Brandon designed.
That diffuser is often run with strakes....
The diffuser definitely came out of the same mold that the citation diffuser uses. There is a loose piece added because the front is shorter for the VD.
I had built it for Brandon and he owns the mold, he gave permission and he is being compensated for the use of the mold. Strakes can be added if Mike would like, Brandon has molds for those as well.
70 to 80% on the molds in my shop are owned by customers, we don't copy with out permission.
Question ---
Is this diffuser's exit slope a bit more aggressive than, say, the Pennon unit as used in) FC? I believe the Citation FC has a slight step in the chassis -- maybe allowing a more air under the car and a more aggressive diffuser approach.
Has anyone tried different exit-slope angles (and widths, I guess) on-track to compare things like ride-height differential at speed (to see how much negative pressure each design seems to be producing)?
So hard to know much about this area other than to watch what successful others have done. You can't even see yarn-strips in this literal "black hole" of aero-design.
Any thoughts or insights inappreciated!
There is a 1" step at the front of a Citation chassis, which is the same for FB/C/F. That step is filled with a 1" rub block though, so it ends up being functionally flat. It is to protect the underside from damage. The FB diffuser shown is more aggressively sloped than the Citation FC diffuser or a Pennon unit. I am heading to the shop in a bit where I have 3 Citation frames and multiple flavors of diffuser if you would like to see more pics.
Citation Diffuser
The diffusers for the Citation FC and FB are made to the same side view profiles. The differences is that the FB is built to the full width for diffuser exit width. The FC is about 4" narrower. The length of the diffuser is varied depending on the amount of down force and other considerations.
The profile of the diffuser is an evolution of the FW07 Williams F1 car of the late 70's. Ed Zink was involved in an Indy car project and had access to the Williams designs for that project. Ed used the shape on the 1978 Zink Z16. FF rules were changed shortly after we first ran the car. I adapted the profile to the FC flat bottom diffuser.
Weitzenhof and I did several tests with diffusers in the late 70's and 80's. The Indy Lights with the Lola chassis provided a lot of insight into how flat bottom ground effects works. I just adapted what I thought I knew something about.
I know that Brandon has given permission, I just don't agree with him.
Correct. It has been run with several styles.
FB diffuser rules are very different than FC rules. There is lots of work still to do.
Thanks Steve-Josh-Wren ---
And Josh, I'd love to see more pics!
Again, thanks guys ---
Chris Crowe
More pictures....
http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51138
also a great view (the one most see) of Brendan's diffusser is on the back of the 2012 calendar being sold.
http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/show...light=calendar
Closest to farthest:
Citation FC diffuser
Citation FB diffuser
Early Piper FB diffuser
FC diffuser from Primus, not 100% sure who makes it
Pics
Terrific ---
You guys are great. Now. If I may... say, the Brandon-Citation diffuser... which we know works very well for certain. What is that unit's basic-average angle of the incline... if measured from the front of the rear wheel to the point of exit? Also, what is the depth of the exit?
This may be getting, I dunno... pushy -- but if someone could provide us with this good starting point, it'd be greatly appreciated.
Thanks for everything even if no one wants to go any further!
Chris
Chris:
The surface is a constantly varying curve. So I can not answer the question you ask. A streight line across the tire slopes at 9+ degrees.
Chris - Use the concept of a NACA duct.
Roger, guys ---
And the NACA duct profiles may be a good place to start.
Again, thanks ---
Chris
[FONT=Times New Roman]A large radius? …. or exponentially increasing curve, like in French curve... [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman]trying to think like an air molecule just made my head explode … [/FONT]
Layers of carbon
Just curious as I see no sandwich material on the vertical sides. Is this due to lack of height or how many layer of what oz cloth is used to make it stiff enough
Thanks
Header Work
How about seeing how the exhaust system is done.
5 ply of 7725 on the sides.
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