Engine Decision Help

[Earley Motorsports]

Hi all. Thanks for all the help and assistance given when I asked for help identifying my frame and body. I have researched the car back 5 owners to 1984 and still have not found out what the actual frame is. Interesting past though. Apparently the car was pretty well sorted out as it has quite a few wins under it's belly pan which includes Sears Point, Laguna Seca and Portland as well as Autocross and Hillclimb records so it is worth building it back to what it may have been. Anyway, my decision is what to put in the back and that is where I need some help. I do not plan on doing any national events, just want to run some club events and have some fun. The car originally had a Cortina 1600 X flow in it but they are getting really hard to find and quite a few dollars also. I have to admit, I do not have an open check book so I am trying to build a fun car on a budget. My thing is what club event class/es could I run without going back to original. For instance, if I put a Toyota in the back, what could I run in? This is just questions. The car was apparently built around 1970. I have a lead on a 2.0 Pinto motor also but the car would not be competitve with an 80's VD or something similar. So after all that dribble, I am just looking for some advice. I am new to this game but I also love slicks and wings. Here is a picture of the car in it's pride and glory days to show what it was. Thanks for any and all comments.
Graham..

[RussMcB]

Does the car have a Hewland transaxle and bellhousing/adapter? If so your checkbook will suffer the least if you get an engine that will bolt right in (like a Kent, Cortina or Pinto). Putting in something else will be a big project - lots of things to figure out and fabricate. Keeping it somewhat original will probably pay off in the long run. It will be much easier to get help and parts, and probably worth more when you sell it.

[Earley Motorsports]

There are no mechanicals at all, not even a bolt.
Graham.

[marty7]

Hi Graham, Martin here from Kiwi land.

The car was a FF, return it to a FF. If you want a 1600 pushrod I can pull one out from the shed. Cheapest FF car to buy is a runner. You will spend more returning this one to running condition. However it is always a shame when a FF is robbed of its parts and the frame eventually dumped. Get it going if you can.

If the rules are relaxed you can run a standardish 1600 but fit a non FF cam, get the required 100hp via cam - save a lot of money. You can use a VW trans. Save your money. You can always swap out the trans at a later date. Email me and I can offer some specific names on where to get bits. A guy here in NZ makes cheap close ratio kits for VW trans. Some FF cars run these over here.

Also if the car is in FF spec you can run it in FF races in the future should you decide. You can also bring it to NZ and run in one of our festivals :-) . I am a big fan of FF as the cars are very similar performance wise so good close racing. Mind you we get told off occasionally for our racing racing ways over here.

Marty - VDRF80c, Lotus 69 FF

There are no mechanicals at all, not even a bolt.
Graham.

[DanW]

To help you find who built the chassis, or at least some history:

I did a google search on Pulver Racing and found the following:

www.pulverracing.com/

admin@pulverracing.com

Also try:

http://www.facebook.com/people/Doug-Pulver/1676837422

googling doug pulver racing gets several older web pages. Contacting someone might provide a lead.

If you look at some of the photos and videos there are several FFs, including what might be be a PRS

You might try the SF Region Archivist and ask them for any info too.

There may be a roll bar number on the roll bar near a drilled 3/16" hole. The number is usually xx-xxx for that age of car. That number can get you a replacement log book for a nominal fee from that region.

norpacarchivist@comcast.net

The car was built for a Cortina/uprated Kent. Complete uprated kents are available if you are patient. Look for a complete "carb to clutch" motor to save time and money.

Its likely the car had a Hewland Mk9 or Mk8. Only difference is brake location. Mk9 brakes are mounted on the gearbox side covers.

If you can dig up its full history back to 1970, it will likely be vintage eligible and you can seek acceptance into vintage groups that accept vintage Formula Fords.

Good luck with your search.

[marty7]

Hi Graham,

Forgot to add, you can get an early FF to be competitive agains tthe later cars. I have pedaled the Lotus 69 to identical lap times as the VD. We have a guy over here with a very rapid Paliser. A lot of it is driver.

You can do a lot to the cars, ligthen the hell out of everything (I can email you) I don't want to give too much away as I know a few Kiwi FF guys read this board, and I don't want to give them too many hints on how to go quicker ;-) You can wide track the car too. Just think laterally.

Marty

[Blah]

Keep talking Lotus man, I am listening

[marty7]

Hi Fly boy,

I hope we have the pleasure of your company again next season. There are far too many damm Lolas out there. Got to go faster to beat them.

The VD is having a bit of a diet. I have a list of items to attack but for competitive advantage I will only hint at a few. New alloy floor, removed the old steel one which was hardly being held on. Simplified main battery cables and saved a lot of un-necessary cable - and statrer solenoid. Will foam up a new seat to provide a couple of small improvements ;-) .

Attacking the Lotus too. After Bill modified my nose cone the replacement is 1.5 kg lighter. Have new alloy water pipes (Stainless ones are gone). Have some other areas to attack. I am agonising over rims. If I go to alloy rims they will save weight but I like the uniqueness of the steel Lotus cortina rims. If I have time I will attack a few more components on the Lotus but time always an issue.

Have decided that if guys use Nitrogen then whey not try Helium ? This will be my next performance trick, Thinking it's lighter so will help, should get away with less of it too - maybe only 5psi needed. I will save some for you when you come across. Don't say I never help !

On a serious note I do plan to try a different brake pad as well as resolve understeer in both cars. Have a theory so watch out !!

P.S. Bunty the Rabit is still in pride of place at Bills home.

M

Keep talking Lotus man, I am listening

[LolaT340]

Race Steward: "Mr Lucas, can you please drive you car over here..."

Marty: "Er...where?"

Race Steward: "See these little shiny pads over here...got some 'lectrical wires coming off 'em..."

Marty: "Oh..ohhhhhhhkay...."

Race Steward: "Hrmmm....300kg...Mr Lucas, you HAVE been a naughty, naughty boy..."

[LolaT340]

Re helium, Marty...it diffuses through rubber easily (latex helium balloon will deflate faster than an air filled one), and it diffuses in metals, and thus makes them brittle. It also reacts with less stability when it comes to pressure/heat. Which is why nitrogen is used...not for weight saving, though it does give some, the volume of a tyre makes it negligible...nitrogen does not react to heat changes the same as good old air (nitrogen (78%), oxygen (20%), argon, CO2 and a few other gases (2%)), and thus tyre pressure remains stable...ie what you pump in the pit = what you have on track at operating temps.

As you can see from the mix of the air we breathe, if you fill with nitrogen, you are only replacing 22% of volume, the majority of which is oxygen. The specific gravity of oxygen is 1, nitro SG = 0.96...so a whopping 4% saving on 20% of volume, or 0.8% on total volume in the tyre. Which is very very very very very little weight saving.

So, fill the tyres with helium, which will cost more than FREE air, and more than nitrogen (helium being very rare inside the stratosphere, but abundant outside it), then when your tyres pop from the pressure increasing exponentially as the tyres heat up, we'll wave as we drive by, as the rims crack and break apart whilst you come to a rest in the grass.

But at least the car will be nice and light and we can help you lift it onto the rescue trailer so still a plus in there for you.

[Earley Motorsports]

Thanks for the responses so far. DanW, I have been in touch with Doug Pulver and he has been very helpful so far and is in the process of getting me some photos of when he raced it. He is as far back as I have been able to trace so far but are working on going further. Apparently the car was red when he got it and it came from Oregon. When I get that picture I will post it and see if anybody recognizes it. Thanks Dan

Marty7, that all sounds good and thanks. I am a former Kiwi and my brother Trevor races an 86 Reynard SF2000 down there. He is number 24. Good to hear about the VW trans parts also as I have a trans I was going to use as a mock up only. I will look further into that.

Once again, thanks everybody. Keep them coming at me.
Graham.

[S Lathrop]

How much do you have to spend getting this car on the road. To return this car to its original condition will cost something north of $10,000. You need an engine, transmission, bell housing, and drive shafts at a minimum. Your best option is to buy a wreck and salvage the parts you need.

How good a fabricator are you? Can you build the missing parts like engine mounts, water and oil system components?

The most value the car will have is if you restore it so it can be vintage FF eligable. I am certain that the car is a vintage eligable car.

If you want to just get to the track and don't care about the residual value of the car, then put a bike motor in it and run it as a FS. One problem is that the roll bars are not legal for SCCA. You will have to modify that as well.

Your least cost approach would be to find something else to race.

[Earley Motorsports]

Fabrication is not a problem. I have the equipment and knowledge for that, frame, suspension etc is not a problem. As for budget.. I don't really want to put more in it than it is worth. The other thing is I plan to do this over a period of a couple of years so I should be able to pick things up as I go. On that, is there swap meets or the likes for these in the mid-west?

[problemchild]

Your least cost approach would be to find something else to race.

Wise words. Complete FVs available for under $5K. Complete FFs available for under $10K. Even FC cars in the $10K range (being gobbled up for FFits). Buyer's market. Knowing any budget car will need some money spent, go shopping. Make somebody's wife happy by taking away some unused car for 30-50% what it should be worth.

[Earley Motorsports]

This is not my first time at bat as I have been racing all kinds of things over my many years. This is just my first time at Formula cars. This is what I have been playing with for the last 5 years.

Graham.

[marty7]

Hi Graham,

If you want any specific FF info drop me a line. We have emailed each other in the past. I built up a Leitch 23B replica. Trevor has my Escort Twin Cam.

Complete FF cars are cheap in the USA, pre 1972 cars go for a premium. The car would be worth more as a FF compared to a 'special'. Big ticket items are engine and trans. Bargans are around. As you well know the small stuff soon adds up to. Fortunately you are in the US and can get the bits at a reasonable price. When ever I came across I have a shopping list. Everything is half to a third the price compared to home.

If you do FF the car check the rules, some classes don't allow oversize pistons but you can run a tilton type clutch for example