GY's vs. Hoosiers

[R.DeVoe]

Hey Everyone,

Now that the first F1600 weekend has come and gone, I was hoping to get some feedback from those drivers who previously ran goodyears and had their first Hoosier race experience. My 93VD is still in many pieces in the garage, but I'm planning to make my way to pocono in the beginning of May.

Do the Hoosiers require a stffer spring package? Do they have a sweet spot (temperature and camber wise)? Do they crown or fall off after 10 laps?

Every car is different, so I'm just looking for some general feedback that would help my set-up.

Thanks!

-Ross

[Bill Valet]

Hi Ross,

You're going to have to make a pretty comprehensive change to the car. The hoosiers are much different from the goodyears in almost every respect. The key one to look out for is the different front tire diameters compared to the goodyears. Expect to have different camber, springs, etc as well. Remember that the spec tires are harder than the goodyears you're used to, so that will affect the type of changes you will need to implement. Sorry I can't get into specifics, hope you understand.

As for the tire compared to the sticky goodyears on track, they aren't much slower once you get the set up close. The hoosiers are not at progressive as the goodyears from what I've found, in that they'll grip and grip, and then suddenly let go, while the goodyears I've found to have a more gradual fall off when you overstep the limit of grip. What is neat is the slip angles you can carry with these tires. There was more than one occasion when I felt like I was going to die, but the car somehow was able come back to me, even with significant rotation. With the goodyears I'm certain I would have been backwards in those situations.

You will slide, and slide, and slide...did I mention you'll slide? It's a heck of a lot of fun driving on these tires. We found they would last about 6 heat cycles when driven hard. For Sunday's race we ran the same 4 tires we ran in Q1, R1, and Q2 and ran times which were not far off from my Q1 time.

Hope that helps and hope to see you at one of the F1600 races this year.

(Edit: It was brought to my attention that my description of how the tires worked were confusing. To help clarify, where the goodyears would progressively slide and let go, they would not allow for much rotation past that before you got in trouble. The hoosiers would suddenly SNAP and let go, but allow for more rotation before you got in trouble. It's hard to explain I suppose.)

-Bill Valet

[SOseth]

To add to what Bill has posted...

the F1600 tire is a fair amount harder than the normal Hoosier club tire. While the construction is the same the standard "club" compounds are softer and have corresponding higher grip levels. There are 2 standard Hoosier compounds available for FF. 35's and 25's with the lower number being the softer of the 2.

Hoosier does make a FF tire with a 60 compound as a spec tire in some CFF regional series.

SteveO

[jimmyracer]

This is what we had for Saturday's race.

camber F -.75
camber R -.40

springs F 300
springs R 500

Tire pressure cold F 14 hot 17-17.5
Tire pressure cold R 15 hot 18

hope this helps.

Jim Goughary

[starkejt]

Jim, are you running the 3rd front spring on your Piper? Just curious, as that affects what springs you need pretty significantly.

[Tom Valet]

I spoke with Tim, the Hoosier engineer at VIR, on both Saturday and Sunday. I was so impressed with the F1600 tire that I wanted him to know how happy we were and also I wanted to learn more about the tire.

First, it is the same R45 compound tire that Hoosier already makes, in addition to the R24 and R35 that Steve mentions. It just has a different name molded into the side for the Pro Series. The R45 compound is also used as the spec tire for FE.

Second, what Tim told me was that the tire itself is not a "harder" compound or at least we should not refer to it as a "hard tire." The compound is engineered to react differently to heat, so that when you subject it to a heat cycle, it is made to better withstand the heat and not lose its original properties as quickly. The trade-off is slightly less overall grip, giving you the sliding that Bill talks about, but a tire that can last many more heat cycles than a standard FF tire.

Tim said that the difference in grip level between the R25 and R 35 is much greater than the difference in grip level between the R35 and R45.

[jimmyracer]

No third spring, yet...

Jim

[starkejt]

Might give that 3rd spring a try, we found pretty significant time by using it. You will probably find that the car feels better without it but is faster with it.

[jimmyracer]

We are talking about it. This is all very new to me and it is a lot to digest right now. Steep learning curve at the moment trying to get the car to handle.

Jim

[starkejt]

Well, it would appear your car can't be handling too bad!

Unfortunately, I don't have any experience with the new F1600 tires, but if you want the setup that we used when Tom won the runoffs in the Piper in 2006, I don't keep any secrets. I also have the setups from the Piper that Pritchard won a lot with. Of course, this was mostly on R35s and occasionally R25s, but we found the 3rd spring to be worth about 0.5-0.7 sec.

[jimmyracer]

I would love to look at that info. Thank you!

jimmyracer@yahoo.com

...and no we are not too far off but we can certainly be better

Jim

[swiftdrivr]

I have to second what Bill said. These tires slide a lot, but man, they were fun to drive. I didn't change my setup much, just dropped my rear and stiffened the shocks, but I was able to almost match my best time ever at VIR. [Nose to tail drafting might have something to do with that.] If they fit my DB-1 better, I'd be tempted to keep on using them.---Jim

[R.DeVoe]

To all for the replies and the specifics. I think my plan is to order a set of R35's tomorrow and crank in the preload on my lonely front shock....

Is anyone going to Pocono in May?

[jimmyracer]

I have a set of 3 heat cycle 45's for sale, a set of 4 heat cycle 35's for sale and a set of 3 heat cycle Goodyear 160's as well. All are at VIR for the double National this weekend.

Prices :

45's 350.00
35's 300.00
GY's 200.00

Fell free to call me if any interest.

Thanks,

Jim Goughary
561 801 0200
jimmyracer@yahoo.com

[Mike Scanlan]

Another thread was running about wheel clearances, but I'll pick it up here. We figured out at VIR why some people had clearance issues and some not. The tires appeared to be moving laterally relative to their centerline and every time we changed rear tires the clearance to the DB-6 camber block would change, sometimes it would change even with the same tire from session to session. It got to the point where we were mix and matching wheel spacers every session so as to maintain a consistent gap to the block. This condition would not really be noticeable on a car model where the clearance is an issue. Anyway, it's something to keep an eye on with the Pro tire.