Marking 1st timers

[PRS56]

I was speaking to another driver who is going to the 40th and the subject came up as to the number of cars and those drivers who have never driven RA or are dustng off their helmets after being away for a few years.
I made the comment that because you will have drivers who have run RA on a consistant basis and will start out being be exceedingly faster, it might be a good idea to put some sort of a large mark (X or other character) on the rear of rookie RA cars.
This way when someone who is on a hot lap and comes up on slower traffic they will know they should be really careful before making a pass of a car marked in this fashion.
People will be learning the track and faster drivers cannot count on the fact that initially everyone will know which side to make a wave by on.
Run this marking for the test day and Friday. After that, remove it for the rest of the weekend.
Just a thought. Does anyone have an opinion?
Regards,

Greg Kokolus
PRS #30

[ric baribeault]

good idea. thought of it myself, but was too lazy to post it. an X is good, just like karting. i'll be a first timer myself and don't much like the idea of driving in my mirrors. it makes it a bit easier if you know the guy behind you knows you're unfamiliar with the track.

[Dave Harmison]

Brilliant idea. One of my great fears is coming up on someone in the Kink and finding him hitting the brakes.

Has anyone posted notes on how to drive RA?

[Gary_T]

I'm hoping the TOCA video game is a decent representation!

I'd be willing to 'X' up the back of the reynard if it'll keep one of the fast guys out of my hewland - good thought guys.

Would also love to see some notes from expierenced RA guys.

Gary

[Mike Allison]

It's been 20 years since I raced at Road America. I also need to bed new brakes on Thursday. I think I'll put a bright "X" on the tail of my Zink.

Mike

[JHaydon]

Fortunately, RA isn't that tough a track to learn, compared to something like Grattan. (I don't mean learning to go fast -- just learning which way the track goes and which corner is which.) I'm sure I've shared the track with drivers who have never been there before, but I never noticed it.

But anyway...

My only concern about using an X is that rear bodywork on FFs is often so minimal that a graphic may not be visible.

Some circle track organizations (sprint cars & midgets) attach a ribbon to the rollcage on rookie cars. I have no idea if this would work well on FFs, especially cars where the rollbar outlines the air intake.

Yellow tape on the rear axles??

[thewarehouse]

Would also love to see some notes from expierenced RA guys.

Gary

Watch out for the huge bump when exiting the track. Near the scales. I hti it in May and it just about knocked the whole sidepod off!!

Jp
www.curebrianna.com
All hail "El Piporro!"

I like the yellow tape on the axle idea, probably the easiest to pick-up. Although it could be kinda hypnotic if done correctly...

[gord leach]

Yellow tape on the rear axles??

I like that Idea, consider it done.

Gord

[JHaydon]

JP, do you mean the alignment pad at the end of the false grid, just before you enter the pit lane?

For those who don't know, the grid has a bit of a slope to it. Actually, it undulates up and down along its length. The right lane, roundabout where grid spot #3 is, they put in a perfectly level concrete patch. The slope up to and out of that patch is too steep for some FFs. You'll see a lot of drivers avoiding it like quicksand when they pull out for a session.

1 is faster than it looks, but work up to it (obviously).

2 is not a corner, just a flag station.
Dtto corner 4.

The "straight" from 3 to 5 ain't. BE AWARE that some of us follow the edge of the track, but some of us take a straight line from the Sargento bridge to 5. It looks like we're pulling out to pass, but don't be surprised when we end up on the right side of the track again before the braking zone. If you want someone to pass you, I recommend staying to the right.

5 is slower than it looks but faster than it feels. No, I haven't figured it out either. Just stay off the rumble strips on the exit. They are DEEP. If you lose it under braking, there's enough runoff that you should be able to get it under control. Just resign yourself to going straight, relax, and get the car turned around and get back on when it's safe.

6 you can't see until it's almost too late. Lots of us brake before the crest of the hill because we don't have time between the car settling back down and the turn-in point. Maybe we're doing it wrong, but it works for me.

7 is flat out.

8 is a great place to outbrake other cars, but it's downhill so it's also a great place to lose it. Rumble strips on the exit are deep enough to hurt your back.

9-10 (Carousel) is anywhere from 2/3 throttle and hanging on for dear life to pretty darn close to flat, depending on the car. A really good car can pass on the outside if the track is still clean.

11 - The Kink. DON'T LIFT IN THE KINK. Feel free to lift going in, but once you're in, you have to stay committed. Ideally, it's flat out in 4th. Again, work up to it if you need, but nobody should need to slow down so much that they have to drop to 3rd gear.

11a/11b (Thunder Valley) Again, be aware that most of us try to combine the multiple bends into one long, gentle curve. Don't assume someone is giving you room when they move over -- they'll be moving back again! And to those of us who are doing the moving: CHECK YOUR MIRRORS!! Especially if you can't go flat through the Kink. Someone behind you could have a lot more speed coming out.

12 (Canada Corner) Faster than it looks. The speed through Thunder Valley makes you want to over-slow the car. 12 is uphill and a little banked.

13 (Where the bridge used to be) There's no bridge there anymore. Nothing to hit, but the track drops away just after the apex, so it's easy to get out of shape. Fortunately, the exit is fairly wide. It also leads to the access road, so you could have a little more asphalt if you're on the right path.

14 I seriously have absolutely no idea how to take this corner properly. It is the bane of my existence. It's way too easy to run out of road at the exit and lose all your momentum for the front straight hill. I've tried following a lot of cars through there, but I still don't think I've ever done it right.

The pit lane is about 6 miles long and 2 miles wide... and the entry is uphill. If you lose power in 13, you will not make it up the hill. Hit the brakes and pull off behind 14.

[formulasuper]

Being a 1st timer at Rd America (I have to write it out or it just seems wrong being Rd Atlanta is my home track), I totally agree with marking the back of my Lola because the last 8 months of restoration work was too much to lose by getting run over.

[thewarehouse]

JP, do you mean the alignment pad at the end of the false grid, just before you enter the pit lane?

For those who don't know, the grid has a bit of a slope to it. Actually, it undulates up and down along its length. The right lane, roundabout where grid spot #3 is, they put in a perfectly level concrete patch. The slope up to and out of that patch is too steep for some FFs. You'll see a lot of drivers avoiding it like quicksand when they pull out for a session.

John, that's the spot. There is a seam there like you described. When you exit the track you can either make a hard right and go back along the end of the pit lane or you can take a soft right and go by the alignment pads. If you take the soft right stay to the left!

Nice description on getting around.

[SStadel]

You are not supposed to make the hard right anymore. All traffic is supposed to make the soft right and go past the scales. The lane along pit lane is for southbound traffic only (now clockwise, used to be counterclockwise). Its tough for some of us that have been running there for over 20 years to suddenly have it change, but it makes sense. I wish they would enforce it better. Nothing worse than a GT1 car coming off the track, making the hard right and ripping up every extension cord with its hot/sticky tires as it exits the wrong way.

[thomschoon]

I like that Idea, consider it done.

Gord

How about just running your rain light? Right in front of you and easy to see.

[JHaydon]

How about just running your rain light? Right in front of you and easy to see.

Not a bad idea, except if it rains... or if it's too sunny. Some rain lights (like my little 15-watt incandescent) aren't quite visible in bright sunlight.

If we could hand out Afterburners to all novices... now THAT would be visible!

[dc]

How about the orange whip flag I had on my Big Wheel in 1977?





Rain lights are a good idea, but I like the tape on the axle idea best. I have a roll of high visibility fluorescent lime green racer's tape I would donate to the cause. I'd even volunteer to be the official tape applicator, too.

[JHaydon]

I so want to go with the orange whip flags. Make a deal: If the first-time visitors run the buggy flags, then us regulars who are just plain slow will run the orange "slow moving traffic" triangles.

[racingflyboy]

My $.02. Hope this helps someone

The "straight" from 3 to 5 ain't. BE AWARE that some of us follow the edge of the track, but some of us take a straight line from the Sargento bridge to 5. It looks like we're pulling out to pass, but don't be surprised when we end up on the right side of the track again before the braking zone. If you want someone to pass you, I recommend staying to the right.

>Very good point John. Anyone taking the straight line will appear to be weaving.

7 is flat out.

>Yes it is, but ONLY if you drive it correctly. That is, don't miss the apex and/or get wide on exit. It's notorious for snapping you back across the track into the wall on (what was anyway) driver's right. It's a very fun turn, just be a bit careful to get it right. (I can show you pictures of what happens $$$, and I knew better)


11 - The Kink. DON'T LIFT IN THE KINK. Feel free to lift going in, but once you're in, you have to stay committed. Ideally, it's flat out in 4th. Again, work up to it if you need, but nobody should need to slow down so much that they have to drop to 3rd gear.

>Heed John's advice here, and as in 7, make sure you're on line, don't miss turn in or apex.

11a/11b (Thunder Valley) Again, be aware that most of us try to combine the multiple bends into one long, gentle curve. Don't assume someone is giving you room when they move over -- they'll be moving back again! And to those of us who are doing the moving: CHECK YOUR MIRRORS!! Especially if you can't go flat through the Kink. Someone behind you could have a lot more speed coming out.

>John's got this one right also - many times I've come up on slower cars (there are a few that are slower than me) that at first I think they are weaving all over the place, and then remember, that IS the line through here. It's actually three connected straights, and you can easily drive it as one continuous arc. Coming off the Kink, head for the center of the road ahead, and add just the slightest left steering, and if you get it right, you'll be perfectly aligned on the left side of the track going into T12 (Canada Corner)


If I ever figure out 14 really well, maybe I'll let you in on it!

Steve

[Vanquizor]

Yellow tape it is... maybe some John Deere Green intertwined so you remember I'm not only a RA rookie but a prarie boy too, I need enough room to put a combine through not just a racecar plus a coat of paint!

[JHaydon]

Can anyone think of a chassis where the rear axles are not visible? I haven't had a chance to look closely at "rare" cars like the ADF, Vestal, etc. But I think current design practice is to make the body as slim as possible, which leaves pretty much the entire axle exposed?

[Jon Jeffords]

"Can anyone think of a chassis where the rear axles are not visible?"

[JHaydon]

Wha... what the... ?? How does that thing move, with magnets or warp engines or what??? Good thing I've never been able to follow one of those for any length of time or I'd have driven off the road trying to find the axles.

Okay, so how about Stohr drivers visiting RA for the first time put yellow tape on their axle tubey thingies? (Will anyone be driving RA for the first time in a Stohr?)

[TrackBrat]

I like this idea of using tape or some other marker for ID of track novices. For the rear axles I think is a great place for the drivers to help ID and such. I was wondering if there was something that could be done for ID'ing the front of the car also. I working this event is going to be a little nuts so anything that can help us would be great. Not that I have a problem, keeping track of a lot of the cars while blue flagging.....there are people who are not as anal about details as myself, plus with over 100 cars in a group it will be hard.

Another tip would be to watch videos on youtube from incar. Look at the track and where the worker stations and cut outs are. Road America is big...really big.

you might have have experience on a track this size, and having to deal with issues at times can take time. Anything that help us minimize time needed for things all the better. Pulling off far away from a station makes it hard for us to see what you might need at end of session. Hand signals are very very useful here. If you are having a problem on the front part of the track, there is the access road at turn 5 you can take. Also if dropping oil or fluids and know you have a problem try to get off the track in a safe spot. Clean up always takes time, just for oil dry alone not including any incidents.

Also for practice and warm up sessions we checker at the end of session from Turn 14. Once the checker or black flag is out, please proceed to the pits. We lose a lot of time with cars that run the checker or black flags. Not only do you lose time but we do also, our day becomes longer and lunch break shrinks, which is never fun...plus we have to run a full national that weekend. Busy Busy.

This is just my two cents from the worker perspective. Any questions don't hesitate to ask. Or look for ones in white, we are always willing to teach you drivers a thing or two.

The 40th should be a blast!

[PRS56]

Hi:
It seems like the community at large likes the idea of marking your car if you are a novice at RA.
Since not everyone reads Apex or every post, I would suggest that the drivers that are following this thread share the information with other car owners that they are friends with.
I don't think it matters whether it is marking the axles in yellow or big x's on the rear engine cover, just something to get another drivers attention.
Also, it might be nice to have your crew member bring a roll of yellow or white tape to the grid in case someone next to you needs it.
The semi is on the road somewhere between PA and Milwaukee. Looking forward to seeing everyone there.
Cheers,

Greg Kokolus
PRS #30

[JHaydon]

Here's a link to one video. I figured it would be more useful than an in-car from an Indy car. With mine, you have a LOT more time to see the track details!

http://haydonracing.blogspot.com/200...ica-video.html