Budget questions: Tin-top or Club Ford.

[Alex Zeller]

Hello, I am currently examining how I will begin my amateur racing career. I got another year and a half before I can even think about racing but I would like some coming to terms with the most cost effective way to go club racing.

It seems to me that there are 3 ways to go club racing on a budget; Club Ford, IT cars, or Formula-V/First. Each defiantly has financial advantage. I was wondering what you guys thought of the topic? And what you find cost effective about CF? Does anyone have any real life cost comparisons of running one car over the other?
For now I guess it will be lapping days.......Oh well.
Cheers, Alex Zeller

[John Green]

Here is my 2 cents worth after 20 + years and running CF,FF,S-2000,Kelly American, FA,IMSA Firehawk,FC: go with a light weight purpose built racecar. While they might be a little more expensive to acquire initialy, you can operate them on just about whatever budget you have (this will determine your overall position in the field but not the level of fun!)
Production cars converted to racecars are heavy and will eat parts at an alarming rate, i.e. brake pads, rotors, bearings etc....
I would recomend a CF or CFC as a start. They will teach you everything you need to know about setting up a car and I saw on the F2000 site an 84/86 Reynard with spares for $7000.
I don't think a decent IT car would cost less!!!
John

[Todd TCE]

I don't know of one driver who went from open wheel to sedan and was happy about it really. I do know a number of drivers who went from sedans to OW and would never go back.

[ccambern]

You might want to consider F500 and karts as well. Lots of bang for the buck.

-Clark Cambern

[EYERACE]

most cost effective ? ......remember it's about a thousand dollars per second to reduce lap time, so ask yourself.....how fast do you want to go ? and you can always outspend your income is a fact, we'll let you. the cost effective thing starts when you decide to run your current tires another weekend, or when you decide to not pull the head and redo it but run another event and be slower because the head is getting old, or when you run AV gas instead of the gas at the track, or when you bring your own sandwiches instead eat out all weekend, when you sleep in your van at the track and not at the motel - you can bathe in the sink at the track, or when you don't buy new brake pads 'cuz they're half worn down, or when you ....you get the picture? IT guys will outspend you - so will CF guys, so will everybody else so be prepared.....do it for the fun of it and learn to drive the wheels off the car, not covet the next trick part

[John Green]

EYERACE has it right. Years ago I defined MY racing as " pass the guy in front and keep the guy behind.....behind" Where you are in overall position is usually a function of money. I used to race a dominate S2000 competitor in the CENDIV
(I won't name him) but he not only out spent most of us, he beat us all too. But you know what? I bet I hade more fun racing for 10th place than he did not "racing" anyone, just lapping the field!

[BrooksHall]

I've owned and raced ITC,ITA,FF and now an FC. I've also raced both 125 shifter karts and 250 IC/E road race karts but the budget for those is a whole different story. By far the ITC was least expensive car to run (allthough the body repair bills seem to add up faster in tin tops). It was also the slowest and at tracks like Willowspring, a very fast track, it was rather boring. The ITA car was also very inexpensive and uncompetitive. If I had had a competitive ITA car the cost would have been more but still less than the FF or FC. The cost of running a FF is virtually the same as running a FC (minus crash damage) and I really enjoy driving the FC much much more. If I were still on the IT budget I'd rather have the FC and race it less than an IT car and race it more.

The cost of racing a FC: More than a IT car

The size of the smile I get when I walk into my garage and see my FC: Enormous

The feeling I get when I drive my FC: Priceless!

[Daryl DeArman]

I've raced karts, CDCRA cars, IT and Prod cars and now a CF/SF. It has been my experience that no matter what I race I will spend the same amount of money every season (as much as I can scrape together and manage to avoid divorce court or sending the kids to school in last years' clothes).

Seriously, IT cars and CF costs aren't far off. You can get into either fairly inexpensively or you can spend a small fortune. As far as bang for the buck...depends on how You define bang. Fast cars or big fields? Or are you lucky enough to live in an area where there are big fields of fast cars?

I'd rather race a barstool at the National Barstool Championships than "race" a FAtlantic against myself. That's the racer in me. The driver in me, obviously, would rather drive the FA. But the smile/pucker factor will subside with each lap. Many laps later....how much fun is that spending all that money to drive around by myself?

[dawrayme]

Hi Alex: I'm just getting started in ametuer racing myself at age 55. The guys on the site here have been helpful to me in getting me in touch with some local racers to help educate me about what car to buy on a budget. I'm going to look at a formula 2000 shortly and also a couple of vees. I'm just out to have fun trying my skills(or finding out if I have any). Although you may have a year and a half to go before getting started don't let anything especially money or the lack of it stand in your way. Life is short and looking back wishing you would have done something is no fun at all. Do you have any comma racing in your area?
Dave

[J Mabee]

Hey Dave,
I see you're from springfield, I live in liberty and I'm also starting racing this comming season. FSCCA car will be here in Jan, I'm sure I'll see ya at Topeka!
Jason

[dawrayme]

Hi Jason: Yeh it would be good to see the old Forbes Field. I was stationed there in 1968. I guess SCCA utilizes some of the building on the field? I will look forward to meeting you.
Dave

[JAC]

My thought on the subject has always been the labor on a production based car. Most people I know build them. They build in all the racing stuff on a productions car, a purpose built racing car has all that engineered into it. So count your labor.

I much prefer pulling the engine on my formula car over pulling an engine from a sedan.

2nd you can tow with a car or small truck pulling a formula car trailer. As you move up to bigger production cars you need bigger equipment.

I think if you going to race, race a real race car. That could be a formula car, or an oval track modified. Leave street cars for the street.

[Stu Pidd]

Alex,

Since you loive in Ontario, you really only have 3 choices if you want to 'race' with someone and not just drive around by yourself.

F-2000, there are only 3 or 4 racing in formula libre, same thing for Formula First only 3 or 4 cars last year.

Sedans there are plenty and there will be plenty of competition in the GT races.

For my money though you will learn real racecraft in either a F-Vee, generally 15-18 car fields with CASC, however they are a bit of a 'cobbled' together car without that sophistication you would get with purpose built racers such as F-1600.

In Ontario/CASC there is an excellent series for FF running 3 seperate classes of FF's in 2004. Expect fields of 23+ cars this year. You will learn more about racing in 1 year with these guys than you would in several seasons trundling around in a Suzuki Swift.

You can likely pick up a decent 'B' car for about 10-12 CDN. The spec Dunlop tires will last for at least a full season.

Check out the website http://ontariof1600challenge.freeservers.com/
then give Britain West a call for some free advice.

Formula Fords are real racecars and there are plenty of opportunities to race them up here in the Great White North.

[Alex Zeller]

Thanks for the responses.

My Dad knows Mr. Clubine quite well from back in the day. I am quite familiar with Club racing in Canada and to a lesser extent the US. What we have lost touch with is the escalating cost of racing since we have been out of it since 1985. Before we get back in to racing again we really go to get a handle on who has what, what is winning, tires, engine 'tricks', etc etc. A lot of things have changed since the 80's especially entry fees!!!

There also must be a pile of cars sitting in people garages all over Ontario. Racecars can’t disappear, although they seem too. I won’t be racing for at least another 2 seasons, but I don’t want to be caught with my pants down.