Fuel cell size and placement

[aero_eight]

I'm working on getting a Lola T-440 back race ready and I'm trying to sort out what I should do for a fuel cell. The car came with an original style fuel cell down the right side of the car. It's never been used and looks perfectly serviceable, but it's old (1996). I posted the question to a facebook group and a number of people recommended an ATL FC140 wedge cell. That's a 4 gallon cell. It seems a bit small to me but I have no idea.

How much fuel capacity do I need?

If you've converted a Lola over to a wedge cell, what's that do for the drivers position, and would you mind sharing photos?

If you kept the original side pod cell what did you do to enclose the cell in aluminum? Any photos?

Thanks in advance.
Morgan.

[DaveW]

I looked in the GCR to see if a fuel cell outside the frame was allowed. IIRC, 30+ years ago, that mounting was deemed dangerous and no longer allowed. The Zink Z10 I had from 1974 through 1980 had two cells, one on each side outside the frame. After I sold it in 1981 I think it was converted to a wedge cell behind the seat. However, I couldn't find a current GCR reference to anything that explicitly said that fuel cells mounted outside the frame are no longer allowed.

I also just did an online generic search and didn't find anything useful on that subject.

[R. Pare]

I think that the car would come under the pre-1985 rules,and nothing is stated there about the cell placement.

Been quite a while since I looked, but I don't remember anything in the GCR mandating the cell placement - only that it must be in a metal container.

[DaveW]

I think that the car would come under the pre-1985 rules,and nothing is stated there about the cell placement.

Been quite a while since I looked, but I don't remember anything in the GCR mandating the cell placement - only that it must be in a metal container.

That's what I saw going through the GCR today. It surprised me that being inside the frame did not seem to be required.

[R. Pare]

Knowing how well the GCR is f'd up,the rule was most likely included way back when but managed to get lost along the way before it got digitized.

[aero_eight]

I reached out the the VRG tech inspectors. VRG rules require the fuel cell to be enclosed in metal (which I knew). One of them raced a Lola T-440 with a wedge cell and mentioned that the ATL-FC140 is the go-to size for wedge cell conversion. It's a stock fuel cell with an enclosure available. It's going to be more reasonably priced than a custom cell, will pass tech, and has enough fuel capacity for a race. It's the direction I'm likely to take.

[Lotus7]

FWIW, don’t be stingy with wedge cell volume…. a club ford at the AARC ran out of fuel during both the Sat and Sun races. (Yes it was full, even topped up on the false grid).

[bob darcey]

It will vary some from track to track, but I generally burn about 1 gallon per 10 minutes run time.

[s800racer]

FWIW, don’t be stingy with wedge cell volume…. a club ford at the AARC ran out of fuel during both the Sat and Sun races. (Yes it was full, even topped up on the flat grid).

Either those were really long races, you're running SUPER rich or you've got a leak somewhere. I've been running the 4 gallon wedge cell for a few years now in vintage. Sessions/races are never more than 25 minutes and I've never had a fuel issue.

[Lotus7]

Either those were really long races, you're running SUPER rich or you've got a leak somewhere. I've been running the 4 gallon wedge cell for a few years now in vintage. Sessions/races are never more than 25 minutes and I've never had a fuel issue.

none of the above; long story, was just offering some input to the OP

[billtebbutt]

none of the above; long story, was just offering some input to the OP

If you have the room, put in a larger fuel cell. Nobody guarantees their cell to pick up every last drop, and near empty it is possible to get surge in/out of corners/under braking. It would be an expensive waste of a weekend to run low/out of fuel for the sake of not putting in a 5 gallon cell if room permits......

best,
bt

[Roland V. Johnson]

Before you buy a wedge cell, make a mock up from the dimensions, install it, and sit in the car. Make sure you can adjust the pedals and steering wheel and be comfortable in the car. Also make sure you can get at least 2+ inches of roll bar over your head and get the top of your helmet under a line drawn the top of the front and rear roll hoops. I have not done a 440, but the 340 can be very tight with someone with very long legs.You do not have to buy a container with it. You can make some aluminum pieces to surround and protect it. The rules do not require the container to be water (fuel) tight.

[S Lathrop]

The wedge cells will work but I think they are the worst option. To use one, you have to make a major change to the roll bar and the driving position. neither of these options are desirable.

I am working with Fuel Safe to build a couple furl cells that are duplicates of what I used for the 84 Citation FV but will fit in any of the older Citation and Zink chassis. The cell is a wrap around the driver's rib cage and the inlet ports are on either side of the driver. The driver's seating position is unchanged and in the case of my cars, the driver's shoulders are still against the fire wall.

If interested send a PM with you email and I will send you a drawing of the cell.

[Bob Neumeister]

I have a 440 with the FC 140 cell. It does not affect height to roll bar. My seat bracket that I believe is stock is about 4" away from firewall, so there is room for cell. The 1 gallon for 10 minutes is correct, so plenty of gas for vintage. PM me if you want pictures of my setup. I am 5'10" and can barely push clutch far enough to disengage when going to grid

[problemchild]

Road Atlanta is a high fuel consumption track. With the modern cars, the longer Sunday feature race was always a concern, especially if it ran green all the way. Although 15-25 min sessions are much more common these days, I think you need to have a cell that will easily let you run 30 min sessions,

[EACIII]

Did a 27 lap race at Thompson this summer. With pace and cool down lap we were out there for over 40 minutes. Not sure 4 gallons would have made it.

Ed

[scott fairchild]

I used to campaign a RP3-A in vintage races. It had a 4 gallon cell without a surge tank pickup. Brimming it meant I had exactly 27 minutes of 'on-track' run time. Ask me how know (more than twice). This meant topping off before heading to the grid. Was the '5 minutes sign' really 5 minutes or more like 10?

I'm also pretty heavy on the throttle compared to many, so factor that as you see fit.

I currently run 5 gallon cells in our cars as it's also convenient ballast.

Good luck!