Is P2 dead?

[patman]

Anyone know what happened to all the P2 guys?

Last year we had decent numbers. This year I think I might be the only p2 driver who has turned a lap in the northeast conference. I was the only one at Summit Point. Nobody went to vir. I was signed up for pittrace but nobody else was going so I cancelled. Same with Pocono. Now looking at Watkins glen hst in 2 weeks and no p2s there either.

If anyone is willing to come to the glen and race please let me know otherwise I guess I will skip that one too. Not worth the money on my budget to run by myself.

I thought P2 was growing and then all of a sudden it disappeared. Does anyone know what's going on? Should I just buy a Miata and get used to going slow?

[Purple Frog]

Well we know all the P2 guys didn't move to FC.

[rockbeau25]

There are 12 registered for the June Sprints.

[924RACR]

...and we had 5 runners (not just entries!) at Mud-O the other weekend...

Very regionally specific... the FA turnout for Sprints is amazing, and I'm glad we're in a different group!

We'll have 12 each in P1 and P2... 17 FAs...

[lowside67]

It seems like a lot of the higher end classes are doing fewer if any local races but a fair number will show for big marquee events such as June Sprints.

I suppose it makes a little sense to me as the costs and effort to run is so high, a lot of guys are reducing the number of weekends per year they race, and so majors and super tours are better chances of competition for their money.

-Mark

[patman]

RA is a bit of a hike for me, but I'll start looking at some more races in OH and MI. Vaughan if you are going to mid Ohio any particular time please let me know.

[924RACR]

Cheers; we usually try to make the Mid-O Majors with the P2, and sometimes get the 924 to the Divisionals.

Jack Baruth is also local there, usually runs those races...

I desperately want to get back to Pitt, just as much as I desperately want them to move the race from winter to spring...

[avoidablecontact]

Looks like there are four -- FOUR! -- P2 cars for the May Majors at Mid-Ohio.

I have to decide whether I want to get my old carbureted stock-Busa Radical stomped by you guys in P2, or whether I want to run my SR8 in GTX against tin-tops.

Leaning towards supporting our class and letting the GTX fellows have a decent race, even if that means I come in DFL.

[Mike B]

There are EIGHT P2s registered for the Blackhawk Majors on May 4-5.

[924RACR]

Should have at least one more P2 signing up for Mud-O...

[avoidablecontact]

If I can get some crew, I'll come up for that. There's always a chance someone could run out of gas during the race and elevate me to "Alex Albon" rather than "Logan Sergeant".

[patman]

I don't have time for racing this year really, and unfortunately I think my GSXR is getting weak. But since everyone is going to Mid-Ohio, I will do my best to come too!

[924RACR]

Now up to 5 for Mud-O... but I see 9 entered for Blackhawk in a little over a week!!!

[Marty Nygard]

Sorting out old paperwork yeaterday and found that the 2006 RunOffs had 36 DSR entries. Seems like SCCA messed with a good thing and now Prototype classes are circling the drain.

[924RACR]

Sorting out old paperwork yeaterday and found that the 2006 RunOffs had 36 DSR entries. Seems like SCCA messed with a good thing and now Prototype classes are circling the drain.

Actually, no. In point of fact, after massive downturn from the pandemic and subsequent economy flailing, P2 seems to be on a substantial resurgence for this year, as evidenced by the entries for the two events I mention above. I can't remember the last time I saw a field of more than 5 P2's outside of Sprints or Runoffs.

Climbing back out of the drain, maybe, but not going downward any more. Rather, interest in P2 seems to continue to increase. Lots of cars being bought online, it seems. Looking forward to seeing how turnout at RA is in October...

[Marty Nygard]

Sixteen of the entries were Stohrs (Way to go Lee!); Pit lane gossip suggested the highest investment of any one to be ~$75,000. My (unsponsored) car (19th overall finish) had a max investment over 5 five years of <$15,000 - a stock 2004 GSXR-1000 - a Yosh ECU (the driver was afraid to use the shift-without-lift feature) and 18 month old tires. I stayed in a hotel, Steve slept in his van. Does anyone remember that the Italian built Gloria was also there with Davide Rigon (Then a Ferrari test driver)?
So, fast forward a few years. Good Stohrs had carbon springs and brakes and the per car cost began to approach $100,000. Big trailers, motorhomes and pro-crews predominated. We sold our car.
Not long after, Tucker showed up with the turbo Multimatic car. Faster than Donohue in the Penske 917-30K at Road America. Rumored cost ~$1,000,000.
SCCA reacted.
Since then, the hoped for inclusion of S2000 cars in P2 has not occurred. I admire the efforts of 924Racr but don't see any of the grass roots support for P2 that made DSR interesting.
Hope you prove me wrong.
M

[924RACR]

Well, I suppose we each have a choice to make: do we wallow in the problems of the past, or push forward with enthusiasm to what the future could hold?

I've made my choice; a number of P2 drivers in this thread have too, and so, clearly, have you.

[E1pix]

Not at all demeaning that a current P car could come anywhere close to the 917/30 — which is surreal! — Donohue ran a 1:57.5 in 1973 and Tucker was right at 1:59.

Regardless, a fair point you made, and utterly unbelievable!

I checked some records at the time from the ‘70s, when only about six classes were slower than D/SR, when its run group at RA included Bugeye Sprites!

So Yes, a mind-blowing advance from there to current P, and so much of that from the engineering of Lee Stohr himself — and of course from Mark Jaremko’s able feedback and *absolutely fiery* peddling.

[rockbeau25]

Not at all demeaning that a current P car could come anywhere close to the 917/30 — which is surreal! — Donohue ran a 1:57.5 in 1973 and Tucker was right at 1:59.

That car with a pro driver (Colin Braun) did 1:52s in testing. The time would've been good for the front row at the ALMS race that year. ALMS_RA_Qualifying.pdf

What's sad in general, and not unique to just P2, is that we have reached a point where 10 cars is a big and exciting field for any of the F/SR classes outside of maybe FV.

[E1pix]

Holy Moly, 1:52? I stand in inarguable defeat!

Wow, just Wow… and probably close to minute faster than a D/SR in the early Jeff Miller/Archie Onwiler days.

[avoidablecontact]

I made the mistake of racing NASA this past weekend. Was half a lap ahead of a 9-car Super Unlimited field consisting of the usual SR3s, Vipers, GT3 Cups... when a lapped Mustang wiped my nose off.

SO..

I have one Radical left, and I'm running it in P2 with you boys at Mid-Ohio! There are half a dozen of us! And you should all feel good about staying ahead of me, because it's gonna be easy!

Apropos of the other discussion, last year I ran my SR8 around Mid-Ohio faster than Chris Amon's best-of-race lap in the 1969 Can-Am. I'm 2.1 seconds off Donohue's best 917/30 lap, and expect to nudge up to it this year. Things have certainly changed.

[924RACR]

Damn, that sucks, my condolences Jack... I'm glad you'll be joining us, but not for the circumstances.

(Also, where's Ralph to say "I TOLD you so!!!")

Maybe after the weekend we can convince you to buy a fresh motor for it!

[avoidablecontact]

I'm 50% convinced I'll have a Stohr or Staudacher before I retire from this whole deal. That would be a better way to spend money than trying to push this very heavy and upright Radical onto podiums via power.

HOWEVER, I do have all six gears now, for the first time. In all previous seasons I've only had four working gears. I could be faster. Or slower. It's hard to say.

Looks like we have 7 P2 cars. My son does a lot of photography and videography for his Civil Air Patrol squadron. I'm gonna drag him up and see if he can make sure all of you get plenty of pictures to document this (by recent standards) historic event!

[924RACR]

Very cool! I used to be in CAP, a few years back... well, decades, really!

We gotta bother Niemeyer, make sure he doesn't miss the party too... He/Scott were making noises about it...

[avoidablecontact]

If we have nine cars...

Also, apropos of nothing, as some of you know, I live next to Mid-Ohio and share a property line with the track. Anybody who isn't coming because you don't have crew, or tools, or a place to camp... let's talk.

I was thinking about having a "P2 party" on Saturday night. Don't know if anybody would be interested. Would basically be pizza, beer, and everybody riding my literbikes, maybe not in THAT order.

[924RACR]

I like it! We're staying at the hotel, haven't sorted all our arrangements exactly... but I'd also suggest if anything making it all Prototype drivers and crew - not that many P1 guys, but might as well include?

[Mike B]

Will it include P2 wannabes?

[avoidablecontact]

I think it should include P2, P1, and anybody who is interested in them.

Doesn't have to be a big deal.... I can come up with a little bit of food, everybody can sit around and make fun of the extremely ad-hoc way I store and maintain my Radicals, anybody who wants to borrow a tool or turn a wrench can do it.