Flagtronic in car warning light system

[DaveW]

5x12 with the same LEDs and minimized form factor with a flying lead that should be able to exit right or rearwards. We will likely offer the same inversion logic we do for the FT200 (it can mount upside down and there is a mode to flip all text and graphics) which means that the wires could also come out to the left too with the same mechanical packaging.

Yes, the long skinny piece on the right is a prototype housing for a remote display. Final dimensions not yet determined. The FT200 dimensions are shown a few pages back and we'll publish the drawing and a solid model step file or similar soon.

I'm almost certain that with this configuration I'll have room to mount the display where my GPS-2 box is currently mounted (top center of the dash panel), and move the GPS-2 box elsewhere.

[Arbitrary]

You have an entire dash that seems occupied by things that being duplicated by your AIM unit. Get rid of those and you have a whole dash for the FT unit

As mentioned by someone else, it is just a Solo 2 DL. Could move only the tach to it. And I could also get a 2in1 oil pressure and temp gauge.

It's certainly not impossible to come up with a solution. It just takes my time and money and I don't like being mandated to spend either of those when there is virtually no real benefits from doing so.

Really hoping to see a remote, flat mount solution sooner than later so I don't have some janky angle bracket holding the whole unit on the dash.

[cjahn]

Here is my attempt to fit it to my car (may be premature considering the new version that I see now.....SHT....) I tried three different spots and it interfered with my hands steering, or the wiring wouldnt work due to the hoop.... This is the third attempt. Only about 1/2" taller than the OEM rollhoop cover. Making my own harness next weekend or so depending on if connections arrive. Its a test but will see how next year goes.

[Steve Demeter]

Looks like a ton of work for what?? I know the what is somewhat controversial so do not flame me anyone. That is a very neat job. Now if that space was already not taken up by other things and if I could raise the top of the cowling a half inch and still see over it....

[cjahn]

Looks like a ton of work for what?? I know the what is somewhat controversial so do not flame me anyone. That is a very neat job. Now if that space was already not taken up by other things and if I could raise the top of the cowling a half inch and still see over it....

Yea, I will let my flaming opinion pass on the requirement but I am buying a spare cover just in case. I couldnt find anywhere else to put it as they all interfered with my hands. Its a tad bit taller than what was there but my new seat raised my but an inch so will see.. (Not to mention I am short.....) Yes. Not a simple implementation or bolt in but I did what I could under the circumstances. I should have waited for GEN2 shown above! That would have worked a lot better! Lesson learned.

[BrianT1]

I dont want to read through 12 pages of this, I think I have it figured out but can someone answer my questions.

1. Flagtronics is required only for the 2024 SCCA runoffs and beyond?
2. If you have an Aim Evo4s with a Formula Wheel what do you need to buy or do to get it to work through your wheel display?
3. If you want to buy a stand alone system and not run through the AIM, it's better to wait until the smaller unit is built? when will that be?

Thanks in advance,

Brian

[romoman]

I dont want to read through 12 pages of this, I think I have it figured out but can someone answer my questions.

1. Flagtronics is required only for the 2024 SCCA runoffs and beyond?
2. If you have an Aim Evo4s with a Formula Wheel what do you need to buy or do to get it to work through your wheel display?
3. If you want to buy a stand alone system and not run through the AIM, it's better to wait until the smaller unit is built? when will that be?

Thanks in advance,

Brian

What engine do you have?

[John LaRue]

I dont want to read through 12 pages of this, I think I have it figured out but can someone answer my questions.

1. Flagtronics is required only for the 2024 SCCA runoffs and beyond? That is the current plan - they "might" be required for some HST events.
2. If you have an Aim Evo4s with a Formula Wheel what do you need to buy or do to get it to work through your wheel display? As I understand it the unit can be run through the CAN BUS and the information will display on your dash. I would speak with the AIM people or Flagtronics for specifics.
3. If you want to buy a stand alone system and not run through the AIM, it's better to wait until the smaller unit is built? when will that be? That would be your call. The existing units are really quite small. The biggest issue I see with them is that the wiring comes out of the back side which is not conducive to mounting them on a dash such as we have in the formula cars. They are better suited for sitting on a dashboard. That being said, a small slot in the dash would resolve that issue. I have a Motec dash and can run through it as well.

Thanks in advance,

Brian

See above in red.

[Hardingfv32]

Need a TFT display only found on the latest AIM products.

Brian

[BrianT1]

What engine do you have?

I have a zetec engine.

[BeerBudgetRacing]

Need a TFT display only found on the latest AIM products.

Brian

Yeah - the problem is the evo4S and evo5 only have monochrome displays (GS-Dash). The TFT stuff doesn't fit in most van Diemens because of the wiring connection (straight out the middle back) .

Unless you buy one of the new $3k wheels.... which was way overkill.

I have asked AIM about a color GS-Dash (basically the screen out of the wheel) - no reply.

[romoman]

Need a TFT display only found on the latest AIM products.

Brian

This is not correct. You can tie the FT200 into any current AiM logger with an ECU connection (S2DL, MXm, EVO4s, EVO5, MXL2, MXS, MXP, MXG, PDM08, PDM32, SW4). The display options on each of those change. The S2DL would not be able to make any indication of the state of the FT200. The MXm, GS Dash, and MXL2 would have to use the alarm lights flashing the color of the FT200 warning to give you the warning. The TFT displays could give you a full color screen along with alarm lights if you chose.

Yeah - the problem is the evo4S and evo5 only have monochrome displays (GS-Dash). The TFT stuff doesn't fit in most van Diemens because of the wiring connection (straight out the middle back) .

Unless you buy one of the new $3k wheels.... which was way overkill.

I have asked AIM about a color GS-Dash (basically the screen out of the wheel) - no reply.

There is not currently a color screen option for the EVO series loggers and none in the plans AFAIK.

[BeerBudgetRacing]

There is not currently a color screen option for the EVO series loggers and none in the plans AFAIK.

That's too bad. One of the reasons I have not upgraded from my MXLPista.
Even the small PDM screen is color.

[romoman]

That's too bad. One of the reasons I have not upgraded from my MXLPista.
Even the small PDM screen is color.

There are 3 screens for the PDM 5, 6, and 10". The small ones are based on the MXS and MXP. The 10" is unique.

[BeerBudgetRacing]

There are 3 screens for the PDM 5, 6, and 10". The small ones are based on the MXS and MXP. The 10" is unique.

But the small PDM screens are not compatible with the evo4s and evo5 - why did they do that?

I did consider the PDM08 but it's less capable than the evo4s/5 (does it even have CAN II?) and I didn't see a lot of value using it in a minimally wired open wheel car.

[romoman]

But the small PDM screens are not compatible with the evo4s and evo5 - why did they do that?

I did consider the PDM08 but it's less capable than the evo4s/5 (does it even have CAN II?) and I didn't see a lot of value using it in a minimally wired open wheel car.

The PDM screens are pure displays and have no extra capability versus what the G/GS Dashes did.

The PDM08 is more powerful. It has 3 CAN inputs (AiM and 2 user defined), 6 analog inputs, more advanced alarm programming, and all the power outputs. It also has all the power features (the PDM08 could power a Formula car / sports racer without problem).

[flattop414]

After seeing the closeups of the different mirrors on the f1 cars at COTA this past weekend, then seeing so many cars on the highway this morning with the blind spot indicator lights , got me thinking. So many of us use very similar simple formula car mirrors, and so many on this board are very talented with 3D printing, wouldn’t it be possible to print up a replacement mirror head that would incorporate both the flagtronics unit and a mirror? The harness could be cleanly shrink tubed to the stem and fed through a grommet in the bodywork. Non intrusive to the cockpit, and in full view of the driver 100% of the time.

just a thought …

[BeerBudgetRacing]

After seeing the closeups of the different mirrors on the f1 cars at COTA this past weekend, then seeing so many cars on the highway this morning with the blind spot indicator lights , got me thinking. So many of us use very similar simple formula car mirrors, and so many on this board are very talented with 3D printing, wouldn’t it be possible to print up a replacement mirror head that would incorporate both the flagtronics unit and a mirror? The harness could be cleanly shrink tubed to the stem and fed through a grommet in the bodywork. Non intrusive to the cockpit, and in full view of the driver 100% of the time.

just a thought …

See post #85 where this is first suggested with some small discussion.
https://www.apexspeed.com/forums/sho...l=1#post654323

[flattop414]

See post #85 where this is first suggested with some small discussion.
https://www.apexspeed.com/forums/sho...l=1#post654323

Sorry I missed it ?

[Rick Kirchner]

wouldn’t it be possible to print up a replacement mirror head that would incorporate both the flagtronics unit and a mirror? The harness could be cleanly shrink tubed to the stem and fed through a grommet in the bodywork. Non intrusive to the cockpit, and in full view of the driver 100% of the time.

Fairly easily done. My only concern would be that the additional mass out on the mirror lever arm might make it difficult to keep the mirror head firmly adjusted.

It would be likely a better place for a remote display, and likely visible to other drivers as well.

[Matt Clark]

out of curiosity, are there any updates or pics of the new, smaller form factor FT unit for formula cars?
now that SCCA has put out their release about it for 2024, the natives are getting restless.

[romoman]

Does anyone have an FT200 and Evo4s using the Fit protocol? I have a combined FT200 / Fit protocol to test.

[Bob Wright]

I talked to them at the PRI show- the new version (separate screen and unit) should be available in the latter part of the first half of 2024.

FRP will stay 'recommended only' until they are released. The system will be live at all our events shared with Trans Am (4-5 events) so it is 'highly recommended'.

Also, I noticed the entry form for the Sebring Super Tour askes for the FT200 serial number.

[vtjballeng]

out of curiosity, are there any updates or pics of the new, smaller form factor FT unit for formula cars?
now that SCCA has put out their release about it for 2024, the natives are getting restless.

The boards for the controller with Radio Antenna & GPS wiring are in hand. Enclosure should be done shortly.

Prototype PCBs for the display are in production. Enclosure prototypes in hand. We should have demo units in a month. Validation then volume production run a month after. These are rough estimates and subject to delays if there are any issues or rework required.

[Steve Davis]

Thanks, James. I consider that a pretty good response time considering the RFI/noise issues that probably had to be tackled once you started moving stuff out of that box.

Maybe see you at Sebring.
Steve, FV80

[cory mcleod]

Also, I noticed the entry form for the Sebring Super Tour askes for the FT200 serial number.

My reading of the Sebring Supps is that they're optional. Hope that's right because I don't have time before leaving for Homestead to buy one and figure out which non-visible location for mounting in my car. Hopefully the new formula car version will be small enough for visible mounting.

[Lotus7]

My reading of the Sebring Supps is that they're optional..

My understanding is that the Flagtronics system isn't mandatory until you get to the runoffs.

[Mike B]

My understanding is that the Flagtronics system isn't mandatory until you get to the runoffs.

Encouraged but not required until the Runoffs:

https://www.scca.com/articles/201805...ronics-in-2024

[Matt Clark]

The boards for the controller with Radio Antenna & GPS wiring are in hand. Enclosure should be done shortly.

Prototype PCBs for the display are in production. Enclosure prototypes in hand. We should have demo units in a month. Validation then volume production run a month after. These are rough estimates and subject to delays if there are any issues or rework required.

thanks for the update, that can't be an easy redesign.
any chance of pictures?
I am sure you have someone with a formula car helping, but considering that we will be forced to buy it, it might be handy for people to see it & perhaps give more feedback from a wider audience.

[Mark_Silverberg]

I used flagtronics in my production car this weekend and I would say that the system lived up to expectations an promises by the manufacturer.

I did have issues with the initial unit that I ordered which became apparent at Homestead (where the system was not active). I called Flagronics early the next week and they said they would inspect the unit at Sebring where they elected to replace the display unit. They came to my padock space and changed out the unit right at the vehicle.

The system worked well and there was one instance where i was able to avoid a pass under yellow issue when I was unsure of the flag condition as thought I saw a flag at the corner.

I think this system has great potential and I look forward to display units which are better suited to formula cars.

[rockbeau25]

Sounds like they have great customer support and are listening to our feedback and concerns regarding formula car applications. That definitely makes the additional cost of this unit an easier pill to swallow.

[924RACR]

Thanks for taking the time to give a live report on the ground... I agree, this helps a lot!

[Rick Iverson]

Gents:

I sent them an email to Flagtronic, suggesting a miniature remote lighted head similar to this is paramount to Formula cars.



A very cordial and articulate gentleman responded, is short, with:

”…….we are actively working on a modular based in-car system for Formula Cars. The public release is scheduled for this summer therefore the Flagtronics system will not be required for open-wheel and formula cars until the Runoffs in the fall. This new product will be tested in the new F4 chassis in April and May and if all goes well, will be released for sale in June. As a 3 module unit it will be more expensive than the base FT200 and I would expect the price to be around $550.”

This is very good news, and I will most certainly incorporate this system in my rebuild.

[Mike B]

As a 3 module unit it will be more expensive than the base FT200 and I would expect the price to be around $550.”

Wait, separating into 3 components is going to more than DOUBLE the price?! No thanks. This is where I figure out how to mount the current display into my car.

[BeerBudgetRacing]

Wait, separating into 3 components is going to more than DOUBLE the price?! No thanks. This is where I figure out how to mount the current display into my car.

Yep. I may just mount it under the shock cover. They say we have to have it, but does that mean we have to look at it?

[Matt Clark]

"I would expect the price to be around $550.”

whoa.... time out....
-now- I am starting to have more of an issue. I was ok with $250, but now that SCCA will be forcing people with small cars to possibly spend $550?
I have an AIM dash, so it sounds like I will be able to tie into that & keep some costs down... but this will cause a big problem for many budget racers (looking at this from a FV racer perspective).
How am I supposed to justify Club Racing to new people when they have another huge bill for all these new things, after buying a car to race?

[Ed Womer]

whoa.... time out....
-now- I am starting to have more of an issue. I was ok with $250, but now that SCCA will be forcing people with small cars to possibly spend $550?
I have an AIM dash, so it sounds like I will be able to tie into that & keep some costs down... but this will cause a big problem for many budget racers (looking at this from a FV racer perspective).
How am I supposed to justify Club Racing to new people when they have another huge bill for all these new things, after buying a car to race?

Welcome to club racing run by pro racing where cost is of no object!

Ed

[Hardingfv32]

I am starting to have more of an issue. I was ok with $250, but now that SCCA will be forcing people with small cars to possibly spend $550?

$550 is a fair price for a three unit system. You have to consider this is going to be a very low volume item. SCCA is not going to worry about the few when 95% of competitors can use the regular $250 unit.

Brian

[CheckeredFlag]

Spoke to the Aim guys at PRI back in December. The guy I spoke with seems to think they'll be able to display it on their dashes when equipped with an EVO5. Something about needing the second input that EVO4S and prior don't have. You'll still need the other components of the system, but the display won't be needed when their dash can do the job, saving space.

[romoman]

Spoke to the Aim guys at PRI back in December. The guy I spoke with seems to think they'll be able to display it on their dashes when equipped with an EVO5. Something about needing the second input that EVO4S and prior don't have. You'll still need the other components of the system, but the display won't be needed when their dash can do the job, saving space.

You can display the FT200 info on the AiM dash (They have a video on it and I've done it). For carbed cars, any current RS3 configured dash can do it. For an Evo5, MXL2, MXS, MXP, MXG, PDM08, or PDM32, it can be done with the ECU using the CAN connection. I believe we can do it on an Evo4s as well, but I need a tester.