Advice for a non-driver vehicle/team operator

[runawaybend]

Driving isn't necessarily top on my list, for various reasons, but at least supplying a vehicle and crew, depending on the class, is something I would at least like to do, with funds and support to try making it happen.

Does anyone have experience with supplying a car or even at the karting level but does not actually do the driving? What's it like trying to find drivers and sustaining this model of team operations w/o being the driver, especially being new?

[John Nesbitt]

https://www.heskethracing.co.uk/

[runawaybend]

https://www.heskethracing.co.uk/

I don't have Lord Hesketh money, and I have some race vehicle engineering and karting background, but that is a very good reminder! Also, I love the fact that there's a site dedicated to the story! Thanks for sharing

[problemchild]

It is no different than starting any other business derived from a hobby. Do it as a volunteer and shift into a business if things go well. Doing it as a sideline, while maintaining your "day job", is how many people start. Making the jump to "earning a living" is a huge step.

You need to be very good at working on race cars, but you also need to have good business skills. Customers without money to spend, are really not customers. Attracting new business is key, so now-a-days, you need to be well versed in social media too.

[runawaybend]

It is no different than starting any other business derived from a hobby. Do it as a volunteer and shift into a business if things go well. Doing it as a sideline, while maintaining your "day job", is how many people start. Making the jump to "earning a living" is a huge step.

You need to be very good at working on race cars, but you also need to have good business skills. Customers without money to spend, are really not customers. Attracting new business is key, so now-a-days, you need to be well versed in social media too.

I think my early weaknesses will be more on mechanic skills. I'm not your star when it comes to turning wrenches, as much as I'd like that to be true and will certainly keep up that learning. In such cases, at least early on, is it the way to go to hire out some of that skill set?

In terms of customers without money, is it even possible to find anyone with money when you're new yourself to offering a ride? I never see anyone brand new, always more established with "x decades of experience".

[JoshuaJustice]

Of course you've got to get into this somehow. What's your angle? If you're not a mechanic, are you a top notch driver coach? If not, what are you bringing to the table? Are you driving a semi to haul cars to and from tracks and want to run the rest of the business? It is totally possible to do this if the only thing you're bringing to the table is a giant bucket of money and spreadsheet skills but that means you have to hire out every single non-organizational role - mechanic, semi-truck driver, etc.

If you want to prove yourself in this space the way to do so is to have cars for rent. That's the "hook" you can use, the "catch" is you storing the customer's car, maintaining it, doing race prep, coaching, etc. All for a fee, of course.

It's the same as starting any other business. The idea means squat - execution is everything. Especially for something like this where it isn't even an "original" idea. There are tons of guys out there doing race car rentals and race car prep. Why should I (or anyone) come to you instead of them? Of course this goes double if you're new. As for finding drivers - advertise. It's pretty common fare for rental drivers to put who they're renting from in the sponsor slot of the race sign-up sheet. A car sponsored by "RunawaybendRentalRacecars.com" will get people curious about driving a different racecar and first-timers to look into what you're offering... a very basic website with some contact info and descriptions of the cars will suffice, you don't have to be a web dev (and frankly a super basic website built on Wix or something is already above and beyond what a lot of race shops currently offer!). You may have to do a race or season yourself just to spread word of mouth. Obviously you chitchat at the tracks you go to.

If you really want to get into this business - the best way is probably going to be to spend some time working at a race shop or two yourself so you can see what the business looks like from the inside - and frankly that advice applies for entering into any "established" type of business. You wouldn't open a restaurant if you've never worked in a kitchen, right?

Obviously, the easiest "in" for getting a new race shop established is if you can be one of the first guys setting up shop in the vicinity of a new or newly-reopened race track, but those opportunities are few and far between.

[runawaybend]

Of course you've got to get into this somehow. What's your angle? If you're not a mechanic, are you a top notch driver coach? If not, what are you bringing to the table? Are you driving a semi to haul cars to and from tracks and want to run the rest of the business? It is totally possible to do this if the only thing you're bringing to the table is a giant bucket of money and spreadsheet skills but that means you have to hire out every single non-organizational role - mechanic, semi-truck driver, etc.

If you want to prove yourself in this space the way to do so is to have cars for rent. That's the "hook" you can use, the "catch" is you storing the customer's car, maintaining it, doing race prep, coaching, etc. All for a fee, of course.

It's the same as starting any other business. The idea means squat - execution is everything. Especially for something like this where it isn't even an "original" idea. There are tons of guys out there doing race car rentals and race car prep. Why should I (or anyone) come to you instead of them? Of course this goes double if you're new. As for finding drivers - advertise. It's pretty common fare for rental drivers to put who they're renting from in the sponsor slot of the race sign-up sheet. A car sponsored by "RunawaybendRentalRacecars.com" will get people curious about driving a different racecar and first-timers to look into what you're offering... a very basic website with some contact info and descriptions of the cars will suffice, you don't have to be a web dev (and frankly a super basic website built on Wix or something is already above and beyond what a lot of race shops currently offer!). You may have to do a race or season yourself just to spread word of mouth. Obviously you chitchat at the tracks you go to.

If you really want to get into this business - the best way is probably going to be to spend some time working at a race shop or two yourself so you can see what the business looks like from the inside - and frankly that advice applies for entering into any "established" type of business. You wouldn't open a restaurant if you've never worked in a kitchen, right?

Obviously, the easiest "in" for getting a new race shop established is if you can be one of the first guys setting up shop in the vicinity of a new or newly-reopened race track, but those opportunities are few and far between.

This is great, and love the energy! Thank you!

[EYERACE]

A key to your venture is knowing how to 'set up' whatever car you'll offer. You may find a funded driver wishing to rent your car but do you expect the renter to tell you what are to be the suspension settings, gear ratios to use and other details? Many of your renters will be expecting you to have the car well prepared on such issues because they won't know specifics for the various tracks. You'll need to have your suspension extra pieces preset to much the same because when/if early in a weekend your renter tears up a corner of the car, they'll expect you have the car soon thereafter repaired and have a set up on the car that's ready to go.

Do remember what the 'Captain' said years ago....if you want to have a big pile of money from racing, first you start with a bigger pile.

[runawaybend]

A key to your venture is knowing how to 'set up' whatever car you'll offer. You may find a funded driver wishing to rent your car but do you expect the renter to tell you what are to be the suspension settings, gear ratios to use and other details? Many of your renters will be expecting you to have the car well prepared on such issues because they won't know specifics for the various tracks. You'll need to have your suspension extra pieces preset to much the same because when/if early in a weekend your renter tears up a corner of the car, they'll expect you have the car soon thereafter repaired and have a set up on the car that's ready to go.

Do remember what the 'Captain' said years ago....if you want to have a big pile of money from racing, first you start with a bigger pile.

That makes a lot of sense, great points

[E1pix]

IMHO, you’ve already made a good start here in being open-minded and responsive to comments.

Everyone has to start somewhere and I wish you the best!

[runawaybend]

IMHO, you’ve already made a good start here in being open-minded and responsive to comments.

Everyone has to start somewhere and I wish you the best!

Thank you! As previous people have noted, it's about some kind of plan and actual execution. I'll take all the advice and perspective I can get. This is more like a 5-10 year potential endeavor, so it's great to see where I'm woefully under prepared and where I might have a little strength. Realizing it's a hard thing (and how could it not be?) is a strike to the ego, but that's a small price to pay for some learning

[problemchild]

In terms of customers without money, is it even possible to find anyone with money when you're new yourself to offering a ride? I never see anyone brand new, always more established with "x decades of experience".

If you don't have any expertise or experience to bring with you, then volunteering is where you need to start. At a typical club race, there are many "one-man-team" racers who will buy dinner and a hotel room for someone to be there who has basic skills. Since you are on this forum, find anyone with a SR or Formula car and offer to help. Keep your eyes and ears available and look for racers that need help most, or can afford it the most. Climb the ladder. Like anything in life, you will get out what you put into it. Even if it does not become a successful business venture, you may just find a whole new group of lifelong friends.

[EYERACE]

Let's try a hypothetical............

I'm at a race weekend by myself unloading my car and getting my paddock set up.....and you walk up to me, politely introduce yourself and say, "May I help you? I'm hoping to learn more about open wheel racing" I'd probably let you get the four 35 pound gas cans unloaded from the back of my pick-up while I don't bother to mention that I didn't bring my scales.........so you'll never learn much about how my suspension was set up. Then we might discuss what pressures I run in the tires while I check them because don't trust you, a total stranger, to set them for me. After that we talk about the gas I use (but remember there are so many other options) so now you know little about the gas to run in your own car someday. We talk about how I ran Formula Ford in the past and enjoyed the competition using examples. And then I go check into the local Hotel.....leaving you to come back the next day to maybe help me because I said that would be Ok too.

The next day you watch me climb into the car while I discuss seat belt expirations and how to put a helmet on with the HANS attached............you put the tech sticker on the car's roll bar because I asked you to do so just to give you something to do and after I fire up the car, you detach the jump battery from the car

the gist of it..........

you learned..... squat.

Here's a better idea.........you get an SCCA Novice Permit and rent a Spec Racer Ford 3.......you might learn more from the car/team owner than a total stranger........because you are a renter (who signed and got a copy of a renter's contract)........but that education cost about $2,500.

Not wanting to beat you up here, just some hypothetical........like you're being

[runawaybend]

Let's try a hypothetical............

I'm at a race weekend by myself unloading my car and getting my paddock set up.....and you walk up to me, politely introduce yourself and say, "May I help you? I'm hoping to learn more about open wheel racing" I'd probably let you get the four 35 pound gas cans unloaded from the back of my pick-up while I don't bother to mention that I didn't bring my scales.........so you'll never learn much about how my suspension was set up. Then we might discuss what pressures I run in the tires while I check them because don't trust you, a total stranger, to set them for me. After that we talk about the gas I use (but remember there are so many other options) so now you know little about the gas to run in your own car someday. We talk about how I ran Formula Ford in the past and enjoyed the competition using examples. And then I go check into the local Hotel.....leaving you to come back the next day to maybe help me because I said that would be Ok too.

The next day you watch me climb into the car while I discuss seat belt expirations and how to put a helmet on with the HANS attached............you put the tech sticker on the car's roll bar because I asked you to do so just to give you something to do and after I fire up the car, you detach the jump battery from the car

the gist of it..........

you learned..... squat.

Here's a better idea.........you get an SCCA Novice Permit and rent a Spec Racer Ford 3.......you might learn more from the car/team owner than a total stranger........because you are a renter (who signed and got a copy of a renter's contract)........but that education cost about $2,500.

Not wanting to beat you up here, just some hypothetical........like you're being

You're recommending being a driver to learn more about this stuff than helping a team?

The fortunate thing in my case is, I've raced karts, I spent 4 years in a collegiate motorsport program (Formula SAE, which is why I went to college to begin with), and had a few years of mechanical engineering study before bailing to focus on media communications, marketing, and PR (long story). These days I'm a software engineer who manages 10 engineers with heavy emphasis on data analysis. When it comes to actual racing years later, I'm sure none of that means a whole lot, and trust is hard to come by. But I have to imagine some of my background can be of value to someone, even if there's a hefty learning curve. Still worth approaching it from a driver perspective?

[problemchild]

You're recommending being a driver to learn more about this stuff than helping a team?

The key will not to work for someone like Stan, or myself, or many experienced racers on this site.

Volunteer for people that have a need for you.. Some drivers are awesome racers, but they are always forgetting little things ....... like torquing wheels, setting tire presssures, putting fuel in the race car, getting to the grid on time, etc. It will be much easier to get their confidence, and you could be running their show within a few weekends. Because the driver is fast, but now more consistent, people will notice your contribution, and other opportunities will evolve.

Having just reread your background info from post #14, you have a good foundation to become a valued crew member. The practical hands-on experience will also make you a better engineer! I suggest you share more about the tracks you can support, as you will probably attract some interest and contact from racers at those tracks.

[runawaybend]

The key will not to work for someone like Stan, or myself, or many experienced racers on this site.

Volunteer for people that have a need for you.. Some drivers are awesome racers, but they are always forgetting little things ....... like torquing wheels, setting tire presssures, putting fuel in the race car, getting to the grid on time, etc. It will be much easier to get their confidence, and you could be running their show within a few weekends. Because the driver is fast, but now more consistent, people will notice your contribution, and other opportunities will evolve.

Having just reread your background info from post #14, you have a good foundation to become a valued crew member. The practical hands-on experience will also make you a better engineer! I suggest you share more about the tracks you can support, as you will probably attract some interest and contact from racers at those tracks.

I like how you separated "driver" and "racer". Hadn't thought about that before.

So, assuming I or any interested new helper isn't completely inept, it would make sense to try and find people who a) want to be racing, and b) are riding the struggle bus in some way(s)?

Maybe a dumb question, but how do you find people in such a situation? Do many folks admit they need/want help?

[runawaybend]

General comment to everyone interacting with this thread: Thank you! This has been and continues to be incredibly valuable for me.

[problemchild]

I like how you separated "driver" and "racer". Hadn't thought about that before.

So, assuming I or any interested new helper isn't completely inept, it would make sense to try and find people who a) want to be racing, and b) are riding the struggle bus in some way(s)?

Maybe a dumb question, but how do you find people in such a situation? Do many folks admit they need/want help?

At your age, with your technical background, and experience working in a team environment, you have the tools to become a very capable crew/mechanic in literally a weekend or two. What will matter next , is your enthusiasm, your focus, and your commitment. As I have mentioned several times, it is just "New Job 101". Show up, dive in, and get-r-done!

[runawaybend]

At your age, with your technical background, and experience working in a team environment, you have the tools to become a very capable crew/mechanic in literally a weekend or two. What will matter next , is your enthusiasm, your focus, and your commitment. As I have mentioned several times, it is just "New Job 101". Show up, dive in, and get-r-done!

Makes sense now - I appreciate the direction and encouragement!

[EYERACE]

SAE !!! Absolutely great. I did not know that earlier. You are already a long way along.
After I got my Son into my FF and FC on an SCCA Novice Permit, I introduced my Son, when he attended Univ. of Florida, to their SAE program years ago. He learned more that way than I'll ever - bet you did too. By the way, back then the U of F SAE team was in the top ten of the world three years in a row.....out of - what? - about 135 schools. He was in the top 10 in the world for their drag race portion of the competition at Michigan Speedway....or was it the Ford testing grounds?

My hypothetical above was thinking about a total newbie......which you obviously are not.

Now I've got to brag on my other kid.......she's a graphics designer. About 12 years ago, while living in Orlando, she won the contest to redesign the horse head logo for the University of Western Michigan. So, two years later in SportsCar, in the article covering SCCA National Auto-X finals and all the Classes - of all the SAE teams - the picture of the Western Michigan team's car was the SAE one in the mag.....and sure enough....there was my Daughter's art work on the car. Small world 'eh?

[runawaybend]

SAE !!! Absolutely great. I did not know that earlier. You are already a long way along.
After I got my Son into my FF and FC on an SCCA Novice Permit, I introduced my Son, when he attended Univ. of Florida, to their SAE program years ago. He learned more that way than I'll ever - bet you did too. By the way, back then the U of F SAE team was in the top ten of the world three years in a row.....out of - what? - about 135 schools. He was in the top 10 in the world for their drag race portion of the competition at Michigan Speedway....or was it the Ford testing grounds?

My hypothetical above was thinking about a total newbie......which you obviously are not.

Now I've got to brag on my other kid.......she's a graphics designer. About 12 years ago, while living in Orlando, she won the contest to redesign the horse head logo for the University of Western Michigan. So, two years later in SportsCar, in the article covering SCCA National Auto-X finals and all the Classes - of all the SAE teams - the picture of the Western Michigan team's car was the SAE one in the mag.....and sure enough....there was my Daughter's art work on the car. Small world 'eh?

That's so cool! Gosh, well done to them! The fsae culture is big these days but also pretty close, which is awesome. I was at Oregon State University in the late 2000s to 2011. We partnered with a school in Germany as well, which took us to about 100 team members and multiple chassis each year. Loved those times getting to connect with even more people outside of the US. Such a fun, valuable series, even for those like me who transitioned from the engineering side and took on marketing/comms/PR. Something for everyone.