Whole House Generator

[BeerBudgetRacing]

* Children should always be supervised when experimenting with electricity.

Correction: Children you like....

[DaveW]

Onan/Cummings 20K with 360 gal propane- quiet, reliable. A little more expensive than the generac, but I think much better quality.

The tank selection was based on history of outages on my road. Most are less than 2 days, but there seems to be some regularity of them. The only really big one was an October 1987 snow storm ~30" that took out most of the trees in the county- we were out for 9 days and my daughter was 2 weeks old; so much fun using a 3,500w portable from the race trailer.

Onan, because of their long history of making high quality industrial units, is a brand I would have seriously considered if there were any installers around here that handled them. Only Kohler and Generac showed up in web searches so our choices were limited.

[stonebridge20]

Correction: Children you like....

Never grow up Bro.........NEVER !

Edit to add:

I first read this as "children like you"

On second look I noticed it actually says

"Children you like"

Lol !

[DD16]

I'm glad to see all the various approaches. Unfortunately, in Texas we have brownouts and rolling blackouts even in the summer. In the aftermath of Hurricane Ike we were without power for 10 days Gas stations couldn't pump what they had and couldn't get their tanks filled when the power came back on. During this last episode of storm URI lots of people lost their lives due to the temperature. They don't build houses in Texas for freezing temps. We're having a smaller house built in a neighborhood outside the principle urban area that specifically allows whole house generators but prohibits visible propane tanks. Natural gas supplies to power plants was interrupted but not to residential customers. If you had enough power you could run the fan and thermostat system for the furnace. As with Dave we travel a lot , not necessarily for racing, so that is a consideration. We had a pipe burst and it gushed when it warmed.Thankfully, we were home and able to mitigate. Some neighbors had both floors of their homes decimated as they were staying at motels. It's worth it for the piece of mind. We are looking at the Cummins/Onan brand so I'm glad to see that mentioned. It appears that the Texas legislature does not have the political will to change the way the natural gas supply is delivered so problems will re-occur. Many thanks for all the input.

[J Leonard]

If you have a heat pump or AC you may want to consider a "compressor defender".

[pooch776]

We considered a whole home generator for my home in central Florida but decided on a solar power system instead. We don't have natural gas so I would have been stuck using a buried propane tank. With a high water table, this is doable but not as easy to install as some other places.

We choose a Tesla solar array with 23 panels on our side and rear roof and installed two Tesla Powerwall batteries in the garage (see photo). It is a whole home system designed to provide 108% of my annual estimated electric use. The utility installed a bidirectional meter so I feed power back to the utility when I am producing more power then I need. The Powerwalls will run the house including the AC for about 8 hours before they need to be charged by the solar array.

We no longer have much of a utility bill. The utility meter costs us $12 per month plus taxes and fees. During the months of July and August we may get a bill for usage between $25 to $60. We paid for the power walls with cash. They cost about what a whole home generator would of cost us to install after the tax credit. We have a loan to pay for the solar array which costs us about $100 per month.

The system has been installed for a little less then two years. There were some minor issues early on with a couple of arc-fault breakers tripping every time the utility power went off and the system automatically switched to the Powerwalls but Tesla figured it out and fixed it with a firmware update.

I am very happy with the system and Tesla as a company. For us, this was a more eloquent solution then a whole home generator during a power outage.

Cheers, Joe

[John Nesbitt]

If you have a heat pump or AC you may want to consider a "compressor defender".

More recent units may have that circuitry already built in.

[Marty Nygard]

Onan, because of their long history of making high quality industrial units, is a brand I would have seriously considered if there were any installers around here that handled them. Only Kohler and Generac showed up in web searches so our choices were limited.

Dave,
I used to work for Onan but the product line I was involved in no longer exists. Between Kohler and Generac, I would probably opt for Kohler since they have a history of supporting road racing (both the Millers and the Road America track).
Marty

[DaveW]

Dave,
I used to work for Onan but the product line I was involved in no longer exists. Between Kohler and Generac, I would probably opt for Kohler since they have a history of supporting road racing (both the Millers and the Road America track).
Marty

If both installers had given me equal confidence in their knowledge and quality of installation, Kohler would have been my choice. IMO, the Generac installer seemed better in these aspects, thus my choice of Generac.

[Kazis31]

Onan?
power company?

lol.

I had to say it........

[billtebbutt]

We live in an area with a 1920's style electricity distribution system. Its all above ground, falling apart, running through densely-forested neighborhoods.

Yesterday we had hours of very high winds - not that unusual, and trees were coming down here and there. A nearby substation had an "event" - all we heard was a really loud BANG, and there goes the power. Again.

We can't use solar here - tree canopy, general location, etc. Its not a viable substitute. However, our outages are only hours long, maybe 4-5. It's more complicated because our neighborhood remains on septic for reasons only our city forefathers may understand.

So in reading through this really interesting thread, it struck me. Could I not install a Tesla Powerwall as a simple storage system, and feed it off the grid as opposed to off of a solar array? Does that make any sense at all?

cheers,
BT

[stonebridge20]

We live in an area with a 1920's style electricity distribution system. Its all above ground, falling apart, running through densely-forested neighborhoods.

Yesterday we had hours of very high winds - not that unusual, and trees were coming down here and there. A nearby substation had an "event" - all we heard was a really loud BANG, and there goes the power. Again.

We can't use solar here - tree canopy, general location, etc. Its not a viable substitute. However, our outages are only hours long, maybe 4-5. It's more complicated because our neighborhood remains on septic for reasons only our city forefathers may understand.

So in reading through this really interesting thread, it struck me. Could I not install a Tesla Powerwall as a simple storage system, and feed it off the grid as opposed to off of a solar array? Does that make any sense at all?

cheers,
BT

Bill, if you only lose power for 4-5 hours, why not go this route?

[pooch776]

Bill,

Yup, It is done all the time. Two years ago when I bought my Powerwall, Tesla had twice the storage capacity at the same unit cost as their nearest competitor. I have two Powerwalls to run my whole house, you may only need one depending on what loads you want to back-up. If you use only one, they will use a sub-panel to separate the critical loads from the non-critical loads.

Cheers, Joe

[EACIII]

We live in an area with a 1920's style electricity distribution system. Its all above ground, falling apart, running through densely-forested neighborhoods.

Yesterday we had hours of very high winds - not that unusual, and trees were coming down here and there. A nearby substation had an "event" - all we heard was a really loud BANG, and there goes the power. Again.

We can't use solar here - tree canopy, general location, etc. Its not a viable substitute. However, our outages are only hours long, maybe 4-5. It's more complicated because our neighborhood remains on septic for reasons only our city forefathers may understand.

So in reading through this really interesting thread, it struck me. Could I not install a Tesla Powerwall as a simple storage system, and feed it off the grid as opposed to off of a solar array? Does that make any sense at all?

cheers,
BT

If you have a septic system why do you need power for it? I have septic and it requires no electric, just gravity. Does you system require a sewage ejector pump? (the old joke - all a plumber needs to know is **** flows downhill and pay day is Friday)

I have a well also, but use the generator to cycle it on if there is a long outage. Always keep a bucket of water to flush the toilet and containers of water for other use.

[billtebbutt]

If you have a septic system why do you need power for it? I have septic and it requires no electric, just gravity. Does you system require a sewage ejector pump? (the old joke - all a plumber needs to know is **** flows downhill and pay day is Friday)

I have a well also, but use the generator to cycle it on if there is a long outage. Always keep a bucket of water to flush the toilet and containers of water for other use.

Yeah, the entire system drains into a basin under the basement floor, so sub grade (the basement also has a bathroom, washer/dryer, etc). There is a pump in the basin that basically pumps it vertically to about 3 ft sub grade outside the house, where it is transferred into the first of a two stage septic tank system (first for solids that ultimately won't degrade, the second for liquids, etc). The second tank is under the concrete pad in front of the garages, where another pump in the bottom of that tank again pumps the liquids up to about 3' sub grade where it is transferred to the septic field.

So, when the power goes out, the capacity for wastewater is a not very large basin that houses the ejector pump.

cheers,
BT

[Eric Cruz]

We are in the sticks and on well water. Power outages can be seven days. Wife doesn't like peeing in the yard. We don't have natural gas (or cable, or broadband for that matter). I used to employ the portable 5-7KW generators backfeeding the panel. Went with the Neanderthal solution 10 years ago: 60KW CAT Diesel. It has a fuel polisher that runs weekly so the fuel is always fresh. Will run everything I have in the house, shop and more without even blinking. Runs seven days on the belly tank; I can get more diesel from my farmer neighbors or put the fuel drums in my truck if things are so back it can't be pumped locally.

First year we had it, hurricane took down power for nearly seven full days. We left town on the third day to race at Brainerd. That's the ultimate luxury...did not require any additional effort or worry. Told the neighbors to come by for hot showers or whatever while we were gone.

For the past several years it mostly exercises once a week and "prevents" utility power from ever going down again!

Best regards,
Eric

[John Nesbitt]

...

For the past several years it mostly exercises once a week and "prevents" utility power from ever going down again!

Best regards,
Eric

That's it! Putting in a reliable, automatic backup inoculates you against further outages.

I often think that I should charge the neighbors an insurance premium for maintaining their utility power for them.

[Rick Iverson]

We installed a natural gas 21KW Generac last year. Self tests every Monday at 1200 hrs. precisely, Mobile Link app notification. BTW, Generac offers 18 months free financing, if so inclined.

We’re in the strike zone. Michael missed us by 65 miles, Tyndall AFB had sustained winds at 205 knots. We have property adjacent to Tyndall in Mexico Beach, out of power for months.

Piece of mind.

We just contracted to have a 20KW (actually 18KW on NG) Generac installed. The biggest worry is the sump pumps since an underground aquifer dead-ends into our basement wall and means unless we are in a severe drought, these pumps run every few minutes, and of course the refrigerator and freezer. If the power goes out for long, we also don't have any water (funny since there is too much trying to get into the basement) since we have a shallow well with a pump.

We live in an area with a lot of trees near power lines, and power goes out several times a year, usually for 6 hours or less, but occasionally for more than a day.

Since we go on the occasional vacation and are often away for the weekend racing, there is no one here to run anything that requires hooking up, switching, etc. We have had a few close calls with basement flooding that if we were not home would have been a disaster. We also wanted to have the capability to run the house AC and my race shop and not have to "load-shed."

The Kohler, IMO, has a higher quality engine, but other things convinced us to go with the Generac - the installing company has been in business a long time, and answered my questions about installation, zoning, etc. quickly and more thoroughly. So while I liked the Kohler unit better, the level of competence convinced us to go with the Generac installer.

It turns out the Generac is a bit quieter (55 DBA test, 67 DBA full load) than the Kohler (64 DBA test, 67 DBA full load) and, thru the company who will install it, has a 7 year warranty, while the Kohler warranty was only 5 years. Online reviews (I looked at 25+ sites and reviewing companies) were mixed for either unit - there was no clear winner. The Kohler engine was better, but other things with the Generac were deemed more reliable and easier to repair if there were issues.

It will be installed on the west end of our house where it's out of sight from the road and the furthest point from any of the neighbors. It will be fairly close to our bedroom, but if the power goes out, I won't mind hearing it run, most of the time at low load. I spent too many nights awake keeping a portable generator running so the basement wouldn't flood during rainstorms. The sound will actually be reassuring.

The installation cost was estimated to be almost identical between the two installers.