Dry break fitting difference?

[Jim Garry]

There is a large variation in cost for dry break brake fittings, as shown in the two links below. Is there a significant benefit to the more expensive version?

https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/pr...oduct=4700-001

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Speed...ku=9401083-AN3

Thanks for sharing your expertise.

[lowside67]

Personally, I intentionally did not use any aluminum fittings in my brake system - they are generally rated for far less pressure than stainless varieties. I am curious why you would run them in your brakes - do you anticipate changing the calipers regularly?

I do use one in my fuel system to provide a spot to pump fuel out easily and have been extremely impressed with the low cost Jiffy Tite that I bought at Pegasus:
https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/gr...?GroupID=JIFF2

-Mark

[Jim Garry]

I am curious why you would run them in your brakes - do you anticipate changing the calipers regularly?

-Mark

I'd run them on the brake & clutch lines going to the rear of the car so that when I remove the transaxle I don't have to bleed the lines after reinstallation.

[Rick Kirchner]

There's one simple equation: Stabuli + Pegasus = $$$$

I've had a couple of the cheaper ones on my car. After several years they weep a little, but it doesn't seem to be catastrophic, and then I replace 'em.

Stabuli is typical expensive german engineering - great for pros. I guess if I was refueling I'd want that level.

[mark elder]

I use them on brake and clutch. It is so much easier to remove the engine/gearbox and eventually you will save the cost on brake fluid alone. And if you work on your own at home you do not need to find the wife/GF to help bleed the rear brakes. Happy dragon, happy castle....

But.... many are not rated for brake fluid which is why they leak eventually. You need the EPDM seals (not BUNA etc). And yes, you can buy them without aluminium components. I buy them here in New Zealand at a cost of $US100 each. Never failed. Cheap in my view (see above re status of castle).

The other hidden advantage is if your clutch starts to 'feel funny', then you can disconnect the dry break and test the master cylinder (isolated from the actual clutch) and see if that is OK. Nothing worse than taking the gearbox off only to find the issue is up front (ask me how I know).

The Speedway boys are all onto these fittings. Search in their happy hunting places.

[alangbaker]

The Speedway boys are all onto these fittings. Search in their happy hunting places.

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Speed...ku=9401082-AN3

I'm sorry, but I'm not convinced that you have to spend north of $300.

[Eric Cruz]

I have Staubli on my rear brake lines, and Jiffy Tite with EPDM seals on the clutch. Jiffy Tite are only rated for about 200psi, far below what your brake lines should be regularly experiencing.

Yes, they are very convenient, especially if the box has to come off at the track with limited time. You just have to decide whether the convenience is worth the cost to you. I think you'd be engaging in some serious false economy to to go with a cheap fitting. You can probably ask Bailey Monette what a failure in the rear brake hydraulics just cost him.

Best regards,
Eric

[R. Pare]

You might also try to see what Earls has.

https://www.earls.com.au/product-cat...reak-couplers/

https://www.earls.com.au/product-cat...nect-fittings/

[Jim Garry]

Thanks guys.

I'm on hold with Speedway Motors. Going to ask about the rating on their low cost breaks. Not going to purchase (at least not for the brakes) but would like to know.

How low of a rating can I use for the clutch line?


Thanks

[Jim Garry]

OK, I'm passing this along just to pass it along. I'm not saying I believe it.

After waiting on hold for 25 minutes but listening to some good rock and roll on the line, the guy who spoke with me didn't know what the fitting is rated to (https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Speed...ku=9401083-AN3). So he put me back into voice jail to talk with a tech guy. I waited another 15 minutes but this time it was elevator music. Head explodes.

Anyway, the tech guy says these fittings "will do yer". He says he uses them on his 1500 pound dirt sprint and he's had no problems for years. He didn't know what they were rated at but he acknowledged that there are some fittings that "you can piss away a lot of money on these babies".

Sigh.

[Rick Iverson]

Jim;

What you are looking at in the Pegasus Staubli link is only the male end. Then you need to buy the female end, as in here. Having said that, Staubli and Earl’s are the best of the best.

It comes down to this, and there is no getting around it: when dealing with brakes, do you want to bet your life?

Analogous to a Carrol Smith quote, “they don’t put grade 8 bolts on airplanes, why would you do so on a race car”. Just say’in,

There is a large variation in cost for dry break brake fittings, as shown in the two links below. Is there a significant benefit to the more expensive version?

https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/pr...oduct=4700-001

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Speed...ku=9401083-AN3

Thanks for sharing your expertise.

[Daryl DeArman]

They are marketing to different crowds, and their prices reflect such.

Finding out who the private label manufacturer is would require somebody in their purchasing department disclosing such, or an insider from FedEx/UPS telling you if they get shipments from one of these manufacturers for Speedway.

That dry-break fitting seeing 3000psi of line pressure doesn't know (nor care) what kind of race car it's mounted on.

You could contact some of these folks and see what they have to say as far as where you can buy their fittings that would be appropriate for your application.

https://www.thomasnet.com/products/d...0191201-1.html

[Jim Garry]

Ok on spending the money for the brake line. Wouldn't want the cheap one to be on my mind.

But how about the clutch line? Much lower pressure I'd think. OK to go low cost on this one?

[Daryl DeArman]

Ok on spending the money for the brake line. Wouldn't want the cheap one to be on my mind.

But how about the clutch line? Much lower pressure I'd think. OK to go low cost on this one?

It's okay to go low cost on any of them, just not low quality

[Jim Garry]

It's okay to go low cost on any of them, just not low quality

And that's the rub ... without some specs from Speedway, it's not possible to know other than Speedway probably wouldn't continue selling fittings that failed regularly.

[stonebridge20]

Question.......how often are you guys taking engines and gearboxes out to warrant needing dry breaks on your hydraulic lines?

[SteveG]

Question.......how often are you guys taking engines and gearboxes out to warrant needing dry breaks on your hydraulic lines?

Twice was enough for me.

[killerken53]

But how about the clutch line? Much lower pressure I'd think. OK to go low cost on this one?

I have no first hand data from putting a gauge in a clutch line, but my opinion is your clutch sees similar pressures to your brakes. You are actuating it using essentially the same master cylinder, and it requires some amount of pedal effort. Use all the same couplers, then you don't have mismatched spares. You could paint them different colors, or reverse the male/female if you were concerned about mismatching the lines during reassembly.

[Jim Garry]

Just received a response from my written request to Speedway Motors eBay. I'm told their fitting has a max rating of 3,000 lbs. (He didn't say PSI, just lbs but we know that's shorthand I suppose.)

So if that is true, and the fitting uses EPDM, why the big cost difference? It must be made more cheaply in some way that may or may not result in a higher chance of failure. In the end it's up to the consumer to decide if buying a product for $60 is a risk compared to the $300 item.

[Daryl DeArman]

So if that is true, and the fitting uses EPDM, why the big cost difference? It must be made more cheaply in some way that may or may not result in a higher chance of failure.

It isn't definitive that it's made more cheaply. The only thing definitive is the cost to the end user.

What do you think the difference is in raw materials cost? Machining and assembly costs per unit difference?

[BeerBudgetRacing]

It isn't definitive that it's made more cheaply. The only thing definitive is the cost to the end user.

What do you think the difference is in raw materials cost? Machining and assembly costs per unit difference?

I bought $100 Allstar pieces from Summit and $300 pieces from known open wheel vendors. My idea was to use the 'cheap one' for the clutch line and the 'good one' for rear brakes.
Except for an etched 'name' the products were indistinguishable. In fact the M-F connections were interchangeable which ticked me off because I bought different ones so I didn't have to mark the lines!

My conclusion was they were all made in the same factory and the difference was marketing.

I did use a large (-10 iir) Jiffy-Tite connection for the tank to pump connection. The Jiffy-Tite stuff is nice and reasonably priced.

[Daryl DeArman]

Yep, there are only a handful of folks making these fittings yet a crap ton of private labeled items.