Bring a Trailer Automotive Sales

[Jerry Poole]

Has anyone on the forum had any dealings with the "Bring A Trailer" sales site? How does this work? Is your credit card used to pay service fees to the site or to the owner of the vehicle when/if sold? Any information as to the amount of fees charged by the site, (percentage/ flat rate or)? Is your card information safe on this site? Appreciate any insight and information and thanks. Jerry

[Thomas Wirtz]

Try this.
https://bringatrailer.com/faq/

[t walgamuth]

It seems to get results.

[John Nesbitt]

Well-established auction site. It has definitely moved up-market from its bring-a-trailer roots. Their bread and butter is BMW and Porsche, with a mix of 'other', including some very interesting oddball stuff. Does not look like the best place to sell a racecar, though.

From a seller's point of view, it has a lot to recommend itself. Commission is 5%, minimum $250, but capped at $5K. Your car gets wide exposure, so you have some confidence that you are capturing its full value. There is certainly a subjective component to 'value', which varies from month to month, but there is a solid data base of past sales, which gives a good sense of the market, especially for the above-mentioned BMWs and Porkers.

[DanW]

BAT staff are experienced auto dealers and appraisers. If you read the fine print and understand it, they don't have much skin in the game, the seller has almost all of it.

Unfortunately they insist that they alone set the reserve, usually around wholesale or trade in value. If you don't like the reserve they specify, absolutely don't list your car with them.

They also have the right to buy your car at the reserve price if they wish even though you may not want to sell at reserve at all.

The other part that concerns me is the lack of an escrow process. As a buyer you are required to provide the funds via wire transfer. Once the money leaves your account.....

Read the fine print. YMMV.

[t walgamuth]

BAT staff are experienced auto dealers and appraisers. If you read the fine print and understand it, they don't have much skin in the game, the seller has almost all of it.

Unfortunately they insist that they alone set the reserve, usually around wholesale or trade in value. If you don't like the reserve they specify, absolutely don't list your car with them.

They also have the right to buy your car at the reserve price if they wish even though you may not want to sell at reserve at all.

The other part that concerns me is the lack of an escrow process. As a buyer you are required to provide the funds via wire transfer. Once the money leaves your account.....

Read the fine print. YMMV.

Why would I care if they bought my car at the reserve?

[John Nesbitt]

Why would I care if they bought my car at the reserve?

Because they set the reserve. Of course, you have to agree to the reserve by signing the listing contract, but you may want more than that amount. On balance, I agree with you. If you are not happy with the reserve they propose, list the car somewhere else.

On a semi-related note, a recent auction for a Porsche did not get to reserve (reserve was $55K, final bid was $53K). BAT made up the difference in order to get a sale. They essentially took $2K off their commission in order to get some commission. Normally, in the case of RNM, BAT puts the seller in touch with the high bidder, and they have the option of striking their own deal (i.e. no commission to BAT).

Edit. RNM= Reserve Not Met.

[t walgamuth]

Because they set the reserve. Of course, you have to agree to the reserve by signing the listing contract, but you may want more than that amount. On balance, I agree with you. If you are not happy with the reserve they propose, list the car somewhere else.

On a semi-related note, a recent auction for a Porsche did not get to reserve (reserve was $55K, final bid was $53K). BAT made up the difference in order to get a sale. They essentially took $2K off their commission in order to get some commission. Normally, in the case of RNM, BAT puts the seller in touch with the high bidder, and they have the option of striking their own deal (i.e. no commission to BAT).

Edit. RNM= Reserve Not Met.

Reducing the fee is a common strategy to sell under the reserve.

When I wanted to sell the YC3, lotus 7 replica for D mod I wanted to advertise there. I wanted the reserve set at a number in the low twenties. They told me I had to reduce it to 11,500. I listed it elsewhere, racing junk i think, and got more than the reserve I wanted.

Sometimes you just have to stick to your guns.

[OneWayOut]

I've seen lots of grey market, questionable import history, undisclosed damage, and/or title/lien problems. If you are looking for a legitimate street car that can be titled and insured, I would be very careful when bidding on cars posted to "Bring A Trailer".

[DanW]

I've seen lots of grey market, questionable import history, undisclosed damage, and/or title/lien problems. If you are looking for a legitimate street car that can be titled and insured, I would be very careful when bidding on cars posted to "Bring A Trailer".

Caveat emptor.

I was looking at a car recently on BAT. It looked great but also showed an accident on the CarFax. The seller mentioned the work was done by someone well known to me so I sent him the link and asked him about the repair work he did. It was all bodywork no chassis or crash structure damage but it was a really significant job. I wanted to see it in person before bidding, but by the time the seller responded I was unable to schedule a visit. I passed.

I think for something of significant value, it's prudent to go look and see the car or bike. Sometimes the article for sale has a defect not described or just gives you a bad feeling. Sometimes the seller gives you cause for concern, so the smart thing is to walk away.

[Bardahl77]

You're looking at that Quasar DSR at no reserve aren't you?

[t walgamuth]

Caveat emptor.

I was looking at a car recently on BAT. It looked great but also showed an accident on the CarFax. The seller mentioned the work was done by someone well known to me so I sent him the link and asked him about the repair work he did. It was all bodywork no chassis or crash structure damage but it was a really significant job. I wanted to see it in person before bidding, but by the time the seller responded I was unable to schedule a visit. I passed.

I think for something of significant value, it's prudent to go look and see the car or bike. Sometimes the article for sale has a defect not described or just gives you a bad feeling. Sometimes the seller gives you cause for concern, so the smart thing is to walk away.

I like looking at a car before buying. nothing yet bought sight unseen. If you cannot afford to fly across the country to look at a potential purchase perhaps you cannot afford to buy it.

[Daryl DeArman]

If you cannot afford to fly across the country to look at a potential purchase perhaps you cannot afford to buy it.

Perhaps. Perhaps it's a matter of it not being prudent to do so. There are professional inspection companies that can give you a very detailed report with video and photos for a fraction of the cost of a round trip transcontinental flight. I sold a '70 BB Chevelle SS to a guy in New Zealand. He didn't come look at himself, though he could have done so for 5% the value of the car.

[Chris Livengood]

Based on that description I wouldn't buy that Quasar.

The air-cooled two-stroke 750cc inline-three and five-speed gearbox were sourced from a donor Suzuki 750GT motorcycle and installed under previous ownership.

They don't have a clue what they have. The GT750 is water cooled, fairly inadequately so in race trim unless you work over a few parts. And the gearbox was sourced? I guess... Being a motorcycle engine that should be obvious. The spark plugs aren't centered, meaning the squish is garbage. It likely blows head gaskets left and right with stock head geometry, and that also results in it running hot. Looks to be running stock inlet spigots, which means stock carburetors. The engine is lucky to make 85hp. A good GT750 can make 120hp at output shaft. Ocelet promised that 40 years ago. For the record, Ocelet as well as privateers had these engines issues worked out back then.

That said, Fred Puhn is a hero of mine. His "How to Make Your Car Handle" was probably one of the first books I ever read cover to cover.

[t walgamuth]

Perhaps. Perhaps it's a matter of it not being prudent to do so. There are professional inspection companies that can give you a very detailed report with video and photos for a fraction of the cost of a round trip transcontinental flight. I sold a '70 BB Chevelle SS to a guy in New Zealand. He didn't come look at himself, though he could have done so for 5% the value of the car.

I might do that someday. Circumstances might dictate a change in my strategy.

[EACIII]

I bought my Buell sight unseen. But it was coming from a dealer and they took a credit card for payment. I would have the bike before I had to pay for it and if it was not as represented it would be Visa's problem, not mine.

Oh, bike was perfect except one detail but that was because the dealer didn't understand dry sump systems and thought was doing the right thing in topping up the oil tank on a cold bike.

Ed

[Teuobk]

I bought my F1000 on BaT a few months ago and had a great experience. I'd use BaT again.

Jeff

[provamo]

to read as you sip your morning coffee

[John Nesbitt]

to read as you sip your morning coffee

A sad-looking Lola T640 up presently: https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...t640-race-car/

[stonebridge20]

A sad-looking Lola T640 up presently: https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...t640-race-car/

Man, I haven't seen that thing in a while !

[EACIII]

Remember the car, wonder how it ending up in California. Had a 644, great cars

Ed

[Bardahl77]

I would have felt bad if the Quasar went for $2500 and I didn't bid, but a suddenly flurry of bids at the end and it went for $7K. Yeah, I don't think I'd go for that, no idea what needs to be done plus a long tow to get it. Hope someone puts it back on the track.

[BTennessen]

I'm glad people started bidding on it otherwise I was about to start myself. I hope whoever bought it goes through everything then proceeds to race it for years to come. It's always a shame when a prospector buys a race car and it shows up on various sites at double the price shortly after.

That's pretty regular for BaT, a few bids in the days leading up to close then a bunch of bidding in the last half hour.

[fitfan]

Negotiate the reserve or don’t list it. Most cars sell at the reserve. So if you think you’ll get more than the reserve... that’s the exception, not the rule.

otherwise it has a lot of good things about except that the odd of seeing the car in person is low... I did acquire my Matra through a bat auction that i was high bidder on RNM.

[Charles Warner]

Negotiate the reserve or don’t list it. Most cars sell at the reserve.

That is a very curious thing to say. I assume you have inside knowledge? Since the reserve price is supposedly kept secret, what are the odds that most cars sell at the reserve and not higher?

What many do not know is that BAT reserves the right (pun intended) to purchase your car at the reserve. If they can "negotiate" your reserve lower then they have the option of buying it at a premium and selling higher later on.

[fitfan]

That is a very curious thing to say. I assume you have inside knowledge? Since the reserve price is supposedly kept secret, what are the odds that most cars sell at the reserve and not higher?

What many do not know is that BAT reserves the right (pun intended) to purchase your car at the reserve. If they can "negotiate" your reserve lower then they have the option of buying it at a premium and selling higher later on.

Also - they have the right to at the close of auction if the sale is just shy of reserve... to kick in just enough to get it to the reserve and complete the sale. know auctions that have been "whew glad it didn't sell!" only to find out 30 seconds later... reserve exactly meet.

yes, know of more than one car that sold within a % or 2 of reserve. if you don't like the reserve, don't list it - odds are it will sell at that. of course there is always that stray like the $300k for a datsun 240z.... but those are the wild exceptions.

its still a good venue and format. just be eyes open and understand the system.

[Bardahl77]

Speaking of which, anyone see this Titan "FB?" Mk9 with an AlfaSud motor, from the comments it seems a little suspect, and for some reason $10K or so wasn't enough for it.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...meo-formula-b/

[Garey Guzman]

Speaking of which, anyone see this Titan "FB?" Mk9 with an AlfaSud motor, from the comments it seems a little suspect, and for some reason $10K or so wasn't enough for it.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/19...meo-formula-b/

As I replied there, the Titan Mk 9 was an FF, not an FB. The FB class last year was 1975 in the US and gone after 1973 in Canada, replaced by FAtlantic. In 1975, SCCA allowed the BDA engine. There was no proof that the Alfusud motor was a performance build and would need to be making nearly 200 hp to be a legit FB. Stock versions of these 1.5 engines made about 85hp from my google search.

I tried not to bash it but I wouldn't have paid 10% of the high bid for that car. Well, not unless I could sell the engine and gearbox for more than I paid.

Bottom line - Someone made themselves a toy to play with but the person with the car now has no clue what it's worth, based on the RNM non-sale.

[John Nesbitt]

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1970-mclaren-m8c/

[provamo]

has appeared there before ages ago