I am running COMMA this weekend. We run in FA but there are no 016, 014, 008, ect running.
Comma
I am running COMMA this weekend. We run in FA but there are no 016, 014, 008, ect running.
The P2 motorcycle engine of choice for the past few years has been the Busa. I know a few people who have scrapped their stock or modified 1L and switched over to the Busa. Look at the top finishers in P2 and the 1L engined cars are missing.Originally Posted by johndl
Craig Farr
Stohr WF1 P2
Get your cars to Colorado! You, Jose x2, me, Jeff Keacher with Gary's old Phoenix, Arax, a few Speads, Mike Holland at Hallett, there's critical mass to have some cars to zoom around and play with one of these days
-Jake
Jake, I thought that was the plan. You, Jose and I were all going to race in the Midwest this year, Then I read you're doing NorthAm F1000. What? you cloning yourself so you can be in two places at once?
Actually, this might not be a bad idea for next year. With so few real FA's in that division we might get qualified for runoffs, if we were so inclined to do so. It does pose interesting possibilities. I want to do COTA and Indy before I check out. We can get both those in next year. This year I'm hoping this lock down happens soon enough I can get in at least one race this year. I'm so behind the curve being out of the car for so long.
Firman F1000
It’s like riding a bike my friend. Within five laps you’ll be right back where you left off. I took five years off, came back and set a track record and posted a win my first race back. You’ll probably be FASTER after a little time out of the car. Just think of it as purging any bad habits and shaking off the cobwebs.
Formula Enterprises 2, chassis #009
A bad day at the track is still better than a good day at the office!
So, what really happened to F1000/FB in SCCA? Was it the engine cost that killed the class?
And if I showed up with F1000 car in SCCA now, do I run in FA ?
I do know of the FRP series, but F1000 is not listed there on their website, so is that dead also?
The short answer is, yes, F1000 cars now race in the FA class, alongside the Ralts, Swifts, and Pro Formula Mazdas. An F1000 was on pole at last fall's Runoffs in the FA class and led until having contact with a Swift 016.
Stan Clayton
Stohr Cars
The NA F1000 series is a separate group from FRP but is alive and well with 8-10 cars showing up with the other FRP cars. Next up will be Autobahn in July and is the more the safer alternative than running in FA with 1400-1600 lb. cars. Look NA F1000 up on FaceBook where you can get live updates.
.
FRP 2022 -AUTOBAHN (motorsportreg.com) check the entry list. It is early but there will be more entered closer to the race weekend.
(2) North American Formula 1000 Championship presented by EPC | Facebook
F1000 is alive and well!
f
F1000 wins FA at the runoffs!
Alex Mayer won FA at the runoffs in his JDR F1000.
Rod Rice was third.
Victor Seaber was running strong uniti tangling with a spinning atlantic.
Faster for less money.
Try one.....you will love it!!!
Jerry Hodges
JDR Race Cars.
life of F1000 engines
In response to engine cost comments, I offer this.
We just pulled an engine that had 3500 race miles out of a JDR..
It was running strong....and the engine builder who rebuilt it said all looked good. Just put in new bearings, and valve springs.
If you take care of them they will last.
Jerry Hodges
JDR Race Cars
Yup.....the only problems I've ever had were self inflicted. Most people won't admit that.
Ciao,
Joel
Piper DF-5 F1000
IIRC, when I first raced in F1000, the competitive engine was a stock, low mile (never opened) engine, found for around $2,500. Admittedly, I might be remembering that with selective, rose-colored glasses.
I'm curious what current F1000 (FA) racers have invested in their engines.
Runoffs
Actually, Rod Rice is shown as 2nd place. When the race was over, he pulled into the pits after the third place car.
There goes a perfectly good class. Now, having built motors and aftermarket ECUs adds cost to running the car and will drive out more entrants that cannot afford to run the car. Last year we got a preview of a 016 and a F1000 coming together. This year it wasn't as bad. The F1000 car will always loose in this instant.
Like the saying goes, SCCA can screw up a wet dream.
Yep, Rod did a terrific job!
What is your point? F1000s and 016s race together at every Regional and Majors race in the entire country all season long.There goes a perfectly good class. Now, having built motors and aftermarket ECUs adds cost to running the car and will drive out more entrants that cannot afford to run the car. Last year we got a preview of a 016 and a F1000 coming together. This year it wasn't as bad. The F1000 car will always loose in this instant.
What a crock...SCCA made the best of the hand it was dealt.Like the saying goes, SCCA can screw up a wet dream.
Stan Clayton
Stohr Cars
That fact that it is done doesn't change the fact that it's intrinsically dangerous to mix those types of cars....
Total BS....the SCCA was in charge and dealt all the cards....we are just dealing with the wreckage of long list of poor decisions.
Ciao,
Joel
Piper DF-5 F1000
One of the things I've never fully understood was the pushback on the open ECUs. Granted, a stock bike ECU is cheaper, but a decent aftermarket ECU isn't much more than a set of tires. Sure throwing a Motec M130 or M150 in there will cost almost as much as a Geartronics setup, but a Haltech, Link, or Megasquirt are more than capable ECU's to run very straightforward engines. Sequentially injected 4cyl with nothing fancy, no variable valve timing, etc and many engines don't even have DBW. One aftermarket ECU could run any engine you chose to run with nothing more than a retune.
And anyone who's done any tuning, a standalone is much faster to fully tune on the dyno and gives more more flexibility for setting safety parameters such as alarms, rev limiters for oil pressure, and datalogging to discover problems before they present themselves out of the crankcase. There really isn't any overall performance advantage to a standalone. Once you have calibrated an ECU (OEM or aftermarket) for proper fuel/air mix and optimal ignition timing, you're not getting any more power out of it.
Of course it is intrinsically dangerous to mix those types of cars! As it says at the top of page 3 of the GCR I have handy:
"The General Competition Rules of the Sports Car Club of America are intended to assist in the orderly conduct of race events. They are in no way a guarantee against injury or death to participants, spectators, or others. No express or implied warranties of safety or fitness for a particular purpose are intended or shall result from publication of or compliance with these rules." [Emphasis added]
You (pl) need to evaluate that statement each and every time you approach your racing car with the intent to drive it at speed. There is a reason Hemingway included motor racing in his famously short list of sports. All the rest are merely games. And if you ever conclude the risk is not worth it, sell your car to someone whose calculus arrives at a different result.
Please do share this long list of yours with the assembled. Does it start in the 70's when the current FA class began? How about December 2005 when people on these very pages began discussing a motorcycle powered formula class? Or will you cherry pick some later event to cast aspersions upon the Club?Total BS....the SCCA was in charge and dealt all the cards....we are just dealing with the wreckage of long list of poor decisions.
If anyone here wants to put talk of relegation to rest, the solution is obvious, if not cheap. Enter more races this year than you did last year. It's amazing, bordering on magic, what increasing participation can achieve. Also, bring your car to the Runoffs.
Stan Clayton
Stohr Cars
The F1000 forum is probably not a great place to make that statement. As you may recall, F1000 was not afforded the opportunity to be "on probation" and the club used the previous year's numbers to justify eliminating the class. I understand that P1 is having trouble meeting numbers but yet they have been given 1-2 years to build them up. Is that the magic you're talking about?
Remember that you are arguing with the FB vendor who sold out the FB class and pushed SCCA to kill FB by merging into FA. You will not be convincing Stan to change his mind.
That someone quotes Hemmingway as a justification to not evolve safety standards, is a pretty scarey statement for someone involved in the race car business or SCCA rulemaking..
Greg Rice, RICERACEPREP.com
F1600 Arrive-N-Drive for FRP and SCCA, FC SCCA also. Including Runoffs
2020 & 2022 F1600 Champion, 2020 SCCA FF Champion, 2021 SCCA FC Champion,
2016 F2000 Champion, Follow RiceRacePrep on Instagram.
You realize our run group is almost always P1/P2/FA/FC/FE/FX at every event.
Yes, I realize that is the case but there is a big difference (if you are a competitive person) between being in the same run group and racing a car for class position.....especially when the car in the same class is HUGE. Just one of the many reasons that very few F1000 cars show up at SCCA races.
Ciao,
Joel
Piper DF-5 F1000
******This still doesn't explain your belief that it is inherently dangerous to put F1000 in the same run group with these cars.
I'm often battle FA cars in my FE. They go like hell down the straight and the simply park the car in the corners and I'm always needing to take great caution to hit them in the corners. At least having some ability to stay ahead with F1000 power on the straights would make me feel better.
So few show up because there were always so few, at least in my part of the country. I don't think I have ever seen more than three at a race even when they had their own class.
Kill? Methinks the gentleman doth misspell "save". FB had already failed to make the numbers, and I (and plenty of other people) considered a merger to remain a nat'l class the lesser of two evils.
You also simultaneously argue that I'm a FB vendor AND that I wanted to kill FB. Which is it? I can't be both.
Gee, I also quoted liberally from the SCCA GCR, yet you didn't include that in your remarks. I wonder why?That someone quotes Hemmingway as a justification to not evolve safety standards, is a pretty scarey statement for someone involved in the race car business or SCCA rulemaking..
Stan Clayton
Stohr Cars
I will back up point that Stan was trying to make.
Merging F1000 into FA was the least to 2 bad options for which there was not other alternatives. Those options wer that either F1000 would be degraded to a regional only class or merge with FA and continue to run in the national program.
It certainly was not a case of someone selling the class out.
It is easy to throw manure around especially when you do not have all the facts that were involved in making the decisions that were made. It is easy to belittle SCCA and the people who work at making the club function in the interest of its members.
I think that over the long run, F1000 is probably the future of FA. The cars can be built new for less than half the cost of a new Swift 016 or something similar.
Sorry if this rant is insulting.
All I can say is an enormous thank you to both Jerry Hodges and Dustin Hodges for keeping F1000 alive. Thank God F1000 found a real home in the FRP.
I don't belittle the SCCA for what they did in regards to F1000. I tell it like it is. And they deserve every ounce of my wrath. Once again, short term memory seems not to exist. They backdated the car count criteria. That why F1000 didn't make the participation numbers. They backdated it. By a year and a half.
Imagine a world where they back date rules by a year and a half and basically wipe out your participation. Because that's what they did. The rule came out in May 2018 with the counting starting in January 2017.
Firman F1000
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