Formula Ford 50th Anniversary

[Purple Frog]

Just as a word of warning Steve.
Because I like you.
This weekend do not bring up this subject with Rand.

You have been fairly fore warned.

[Purple Frog]

Ah... the Captain and i have been thinking about this for a few hours since i received the last scalding email from Rand.

Thinking more about post #71 and what Bam Bam was saying...

Gosh, it seems so easy. Make one of the sessions the FF national Championship race in lieu of the Runons. Then the same weekend have a pro F1600 event. (maybe their season finale) Then all the monoposto things. And the vintage things. And a Ford only race. You could probably dream up 6 run groups.

Yes, to be King. What i would do.

[GT1Vette]

I place the chances of the BoD allowing the 2019 FF National championship to be decided somewhere other than the Runoffs at 0%.

I place the chances of the BoD directing Topeka to recognize a single event as the 50th Anniversary of FF in the US and then get out of the way slightly higher. I'll have a better feel for those chances after I talk to some folks at the SEDiv Mid-Year meeting on July 16 and the Cat Majors the weekend of July 30-31, then we'll proceed from there.

[tstrong]

So I think both events sound fantastic and encourage all to make plans to attend both.


First the "World" 50 anniversary of FF at Indy by SVRA. A few have commented on some negative aspects of IMS and the points are somewhat valid. Yes it is expensive but if you just look at the staff requirements and facilities to operate at IMS it becomes clear that there has to be a premium associated with that. Yes there are some quirky rules related to golf carts, insurance, etc, but nothing that rises to the level of oh I am not going to go because of the hassle or cost. The SVRA staff and amenities that they provide (Dinners, concerts, etc) are incredible and add to the experience. As Mr Generotti commented in earlier posts the "wow" moments that Indy offer are incredible. From the mystique as you come through the the entry tunnel, to driving under the gasoline alley sign as you enter the track, to wandering out onto the yard of b Rick and walking the pit lane with all to pit lane team names still on the wall it is just an incredible experience. Also no guarantees but we have also been allowed to run an exhibition group on the oval at the past event. Petty cool experience running flat out in you FF and seeing how narrow the track seems as you enter turn one feeling like your going to drive right into a wall. Then think about adding another 100 mph to your speed as the Indy guys do and I promise you will have a new respect for their talents (and attachments). Some have commented on the track not being a great track and I would agree- no rolling hills and blind corners but it is a decent layout with two very good passing zones and a straight that will provided great long FF drafting lines. The track is nothing exceptional, but it is not bad and again the whole experience overcomes any shortcoming of the layout for me at least. SVRA has changed some staffing over the past couple of years and is absolutely focused on making the competitors experience a positive one and this will be a fantastic event not to be missed. Make your plans now. As someone mentioned earlier this event is slated for June 2017. Likely one or two weekends after the 500. Stay tuned on the SVRA website.

Now onto the "US" 50th in 2019. I am sure this can be an exceptional event And plan to attend as well. Unfortunately I missed the 40th and still kick myself every time I think about it. I would vote for Road America again over Road Atlanta as Road Atlanta just is not one of those bucket list track for me and is just about as far away from California as you can get. It really does take a monumental effort to organize such an event and hopefully we can convince some folks with the experience and passion to pull this off to take on the challenge. Looking forward to both opportunities to honor the history and spirit of what I feel is the greatest "drivers" class ever created. Todd

[DK540]

The exact dates were still somewhat in question in my mind after listening to Tony's interview from IMS posted by Roland - "back to back" vs. "the first weekend." So, I called Kathy. The Open Wheel Invitational will be June 9-11, 2017, followed by the Brickyard Vintage race on June 16-18. The open wheel thing conflicts with the Montreal GP in case that affects anyone. I didn't ask Kathy - didn't think of it 'til after I hung up - does any of that mean that FFs and others will NOT be included in the Brickyard Vintage Invitational? Tried calling back.. no answer at the moment. Rick?

DK

[Roland V. Johnson]

When I talked to Tony about this at Indy, his statement was that if you entered the Open Wheel weekend, your entry for the Vintage weekend would be accepted...........unless you did something really really stupid! And Todd Strong's post says it better than I could.
There seems to be a lot of negativity posted about SVRA....But I'm not sure it is by anyone who has run with them lately.

[butch deer]

As a member of the organizing committee for the 20th-45th FV Birthday Party Races and an participant in the 50th I can offer some advice.

1. It will probably be better as a stand alone event. (but this will increase the cost and risk to the organizers)

2. To do this in 2019 you need to get started finding a track with an open date now.

3. Make it at least a 3 day event. (At the 50th FV a free Friday test day was well attended and a fair sized group rented the track for testing on Thursday.) A Thursday evening reception at a nearby hotel was also well attended.)

4. The only two things you can count on National SCCA for are
A. If approached early they will cooperate on accepting Foreign, Vintage, and misc. other drivers licenses and rules.
B. They will take a great deal of credit if the event is a success.

5. Be sure to get a good racing region to help you. We had great success with booth Milwaukee and Bucaneer.

Hope you can get it together.
Butch Deer

[Purple Frog]

OK Sportsfans,

On July 12th and 13th the Purple Frog Traveling Circus visited Sharon CT to have a rigorous drinking session and head-to-head discussion with Mr. Mike Rand on many topics of world import.

One topic we covered extensively was the thought of a FF50th celebration and his possible involvement.

I am obliged to report that Mr. Rand in no way wants any part of organizing, promoting, directing, or any other responsible activity with the FF50th.

He did say he would probably attend as a participant. If he was having a good day.

The attached picture was taken when we shook hands on the agreement that I would quit promoting his involvement in any such event.

A frog of his word.

[Steve Bamford]

He was very clear when I saw him at MO that no arm twisting would get him to organize it.

So Rand is out, what about you Butch? I am sure you have lots of people willing to support this endeavour.

[Purple Frog]

Some thoughts from the Sharon Summit Meeting:

There is concern that the cohesiveness of FF may not be the same as it was in 2009.

Remember... there was no Fit in FF in 2009. Beeler (one of the primary organizers of the FF40th) completely quit SCCA when the Fit was accepted. So there may be a lot of rancor in the ranks.
Another example of the division is the recent "tire war" to arrive at a spec tire. In 2009 there was no spec tire. Toyos, Hoosiers, ARs, Dunlops... OH MY! More rancor.

An event such as this needs probably close to 300 entrants to happen. We question whether there is that much cohesion in the class to pull it off.

Just laying it out there....

[Ian Lenhart]

Design an event that can't fail. I was making this point on page 1 when I started listing class groupings.
Make Formula F the feature, but invite series and classes that will make sure this event is successful beyond expectations like the 40th. Is it that hard to design an event with gauranteed participation.
How about a pro f1600 race during the anniversary event.

Here's an idea that is going to blow your mind:
Why not open up the track for the old farts that have Formula F's in there garage with no desire to race but would love to do a non competitive touring session. Maybe another group that is a little faster and geared toward the autocross CM cars and more seasoned driver. Rules such as passing in certain corners or by point bys as suggestions.
How many of you want to show off your FF without worrying about someone running out of talent and destroying your investment.

It's not open wheel but it has participants, promote a race to determine the fastest spec Miata in the country or largest field of spec Miata, promote through SCCA and NASA. Bryan Cohn, what do you think?

Besides the norm, Current FF, Club Ford, Vintage here are a few other suggestions:
If in the north, invite FF1600 Toyo Canadian Series (for those running Toyos - that includes the Arizona group).
Once again, if in the area, Great Lakes Challenge FC series (FC and Cdc
Pro F2000
FA,FB,FE,FS,P1,P2 (or if any group within want to promote for individual run class) it's all about class promotion, I know the FE guys are working hard marketing their class).
Vintage S2000 (great group of guys and S2000 was the first class to destroy the glory years of FF).
SRF, I'm sure someone can promote a one off race for the SRF crowd to bring in numbers.
(Other possibilities: Skip Barber Championship Series, FV and/or vintage FV)

Finally, don't scare people away with high entry fees and no track time.

[GT1Vette]

He was very clear when I saw him at MO that no arm twisting would get him to organize it.

So Rand is out, what about you Butch? I am sure you have lots of people willing to support this endeavour.

One of the reasons for me attending the Cat Majors at Road America is research on the feasibility of holding the FF 50th there. I should have a much better idea of whether or not I want to (continue to) pursue this effort after this coming weekend.

[swiftdrivr]

I don't see much to indicate discord in the FF ranks, from my view anyway. I doubt anyone was less pleased than myself about the spec tire we were given, as it cost me a lot of money, but even I recognize the good it did in leveling the field. I doubt anyone would avoid the 50th over that [although, I think it would be wise to let all groups run whatever tire they use in their series, so nobody needs to buy tires just for one event]
As for the Fit, sure, that still gets people who feel it has a performance advantage, but I doubt it would keep anyone from the 50th. The 40th was an event far more than a race, and I expect the 50th would be viewed the same.
If anything, FF seems stronger in the SARRC series than it when the 40th happened. We have more competitors than at that time, a mix of Fits and Kents that get along without any rancor, and everyone seems to really like the spec tire. I personally don't see a problem with cohesiveness. Plus, one of the cool things about the 40th was running with other clubs and groups that you never see at your local events.
Just my view, but I hope it's not mine alone

[TimH]

You need to get folks who are happy to run in the back of the pack, regardless of tire, aero, motor, or skill. Ok, folks like me!

[swiftdrivr]

There will be a small group who plan to win the race, and they are probably the same group who show up at the Majors or the F1600 Pro races, so they are not going to no-show due to spec tires or Fit engines. They already run against them. The "races within the races" will perhaps divide into "I won the Kent race, but the Honda won overall", and that's okay too. That is again, something that is already out there, and it's not keeping many people away. It will be the same for the guys running different tires. This is for fun, [and if you aren't having fun, you probably quit FF years ago. It's too much work to do if you aren't enjoying the racing!] Like myself, I expect the vast majority of us will come to enjoy the track, the camaraderie, and the cars, with no real expectation of running at the front or winning. Being there and having a good time IS winning
.

[Roland V. Johnson]

http://www.racer.com/more/historic/i...at-ims-in-2017

[reidhazelton]

If it's on spec tires, I wouldn't go. Not being bitter, they just don't work at all on my car. Which, is why it is a garage queen now. I would try to find a car that I could borrow, and if that happens, I would certainly be there.

I'd hope there would be multiple classes. Maybe Spec tires, bais plys, and treaded vintage tires. Or, Open Tire/Club Ford/Vintage Tire

[TimH]

Reid,

I think the whole point is to get as many cars on track as possible. You may need a spec tire to be eligible for a particular prize, but I'll bet you can run just about anything safe.

[Robins Ken]

Blew F1600 out of the water in Canada.

12 car grids and 50-75 'garage queens' in Ontario/Quebec not willing to pay $800+/race entry fees.

KR

[Steve Bamford]

Blew F1600 out of the water in Canada.

12 car grids and 50-75 'garage queens' in Ontario/Quebec not willing to pay $800+/race entry fees.

KR

Huh? What?

$800.00 entry fee at CASC events?

The upcoming event at Mosports is $500.00 for the entire weekend. I just logged in so I could see it & there is also a special $100.00 entry fee for any former racer who has not raced in the last 3 years. So garage queens get a special break.

[problemchild]

Huh? What?

$800.00 entry fee at CASC events?

The upcoming event at Mosports is $500.00 for the entire weekend. I just logged in so I could see it & there is also a special $100.00 entry fee for any former racer who has not raced in the last 3 years. So garage queens get a special break.

I think the Ontario FF Series is the best Series in North America for the full range of FF racers from club to serious. It is the model that I show to anyone interested in how it should be done. Toyo support,. Honda support. Good promotion. Good leadership. Pro teams and a bunch of resurrected garage queens. I have only been able to make it to 2 events this year ..... 25 cars at the first one ...... and 18 and counting for the upcoming event. I sure hope they don't change a thing about it!

[problemchild]

I made sure that I will own a FF for the 50th. I was a spectator at the 40th and it was the the most interesting race event I have ever been to. I promised myself then that I would have a FF car for the 50th. If it is within a 1000 miles of me, I will be there. Further, and I will probably be there. If it is at a Roval (like Daytona), I'll just come to watch. Running the feature on an "open" tire would be a real turn-off for me, but I won't let the tire rule keep me home if the event is special.
Perhaps, to broaden the schedule, and be all-inclusive, the organizer could have fun with some "whiner" race groups. "Honda haters" group. "Kent purists" group (ironheads only). "Tire buyers" group (any tire you want but have to be new every other session). Etc.
A tweener group may draw more entries too!

[Robins Ken]

Steve/Greg. Nothing like $500. Check it out.

My point is Steve, we used to get an average of 30+ drivers who kicked arse, shook hands, shared beer, and cared. Not just 'rain light switch' flippers spoiling it today.

And we had spare short blocks in the trailer if needed.

KR.

[Steve Bamford]

Steve/Greg. Nothing like $500. Check it out.

My point is Steve, we used to get an average of 30+ drivers who kicked arse, shook hands, shared beer, and cared. Not just 'rain light switch' flippers spoiling it today.

And we had spare short blocks in the trailer if needed.

KR.

Your right Montreal was at the F1 Race and was about $2500.00 & had about 30 cars, most expensive race of the season & also highest turn out. So I don't understand your point as your saying the most expensive race which has had the highest turnout is keeping cars away?

That isn't the average & there are plenty of $500.00 or less races so why not race those?

I think we are discussing this in the wrong thread, this should be about the 50th shouldn't it?

[Lotus7]

Steve/Greg. Nothing like $500. Check it out.

My point is Steve, we used to get an average of 30+ drivers who kicked arse, shook hands, shared beer, and cared. Not just 'rain light switch' flippers spoiling it today.

And we had spare short blocks in the trailer if needed.

KR.

... and it wasn't just the drivers that had fun :

[Robins Ken]

Steve, yes there are cost effective events out there. More cars needed. How ?

Ian. You are from the wring the snot out of a Kent era. Proud too i hope !!!!!!!!!

KR.

[marshall9]

Perhaps, to broaden the schedule, and be all-inclusive, the organizer could have fun with some "whiner" race groups. "Honda haters" group. "Kent purists" group (ironheads only). "Tire buyers" group (any tire you want but have to be new every other session). Etc.
A tweener group may draw more entries too!

Germany was good for you, love it !

[CAROLE1]

Fascinating debate- but think if you are going to celebrate US event in 2019 you should all think about popping back to the UK next year- I'm guessing there will be wall to wall FF races celebrating 50th..
Just couldn't resist sticking my oar in from the other side of the pond.
Feel free to ignore my intervention

[swiftdrivr]

I'd love to do just that, but theres that two jobs and still not enough money thing. Still, running Brands would be awesome!

[DanW]

Fascinating debate- but think if you are going to celebrate US event in 2019 you should all think about popping back to the UK next year- I'm guessing there will be wall to wall FF races celebrating 50th..
Just couldn't resist sticking my oar in from the other side of the pond.
Feel free to ignore my intervention

Would you kindly advise us of 50th celebration races planned for next year?

Thanks!

[EYERACE]

I can tell you now I would be skipping the SVRA event since it will be a treaded tire vintage event with no place for modern FF cars on slicks.

Bingo!

[Ralph Z.]

Bingo!

Will the SVRA event be all treaded tires? Has this actually been stated by SVRA? Or, are we assuming it will be treaded?

[Rick Parent]

Quote:
Originally Posted by EYERACE View Post
Bingo!

Will the SVRA event be all treaded tires? Has this actually been stated by SVRA? Or, are we assuming it will be treaded?

We are working on the classes at the moment and will announce them soon. I can say that we will have a Modern Formula Ford group "MF" that will run with the current specs and yes the Honda's and Slicks are welcomed. We are planning on having 4 FF run groups, FF, CF, PCF and MF. It's a Formula Ford celebration and we can't leave out 25% of the cars, that just wouldn't be right.

Please be patient, we are trying to do something that has not been done before and want to make sure all participants have the best racing weekend ever! Please keep in mind the big picture, this weekend is for all open wheel cars ever made and is no small task making sure it is done right.

Here is the first announcement.

http://www.svra.com/news/open-wheel-...e-at-ims-2017/

[Ralph Z.]

We are working on the classes at the moment and will announce them soon. I can say that we will have a Modern Formula Ford group "MF" that will run with the current specs and yes the Honda's and Slicks are welcomed. We are planning on having 4 FF run groups, FF, CF, PCF and MF. It's a Formula Ford celebration and we can't leave out 25% of the cars, that just wouldn't be right.

Please be patient, we are trying to do something that has not been done before and want to make sure all participants have the best racing weekend ever! Please keep in mind the big picture, this weekend is for all open wheel cars ever made and is no small task making sure it is done right.

Here is the first announcement.

http://www.svra.com/news/open-wheel-...e-at-ims-2017/

This should be a great event. SVRA always does a nice job.

[Swift17]

We just returned from the SVRA event at IMS less than two weeks ago and it is the best run event on the planet. IMS management loves to see SVRA there and the attitude supports it. A very well run event. This is huge! Kudos to Tony Parella and his team.

...as well and as an added bonus

..., the IMS official photographers are there and take pictures all weekend at all locations which are later for sale and for a Dad's office wall ....

[EYERACE]

Thank you Rick

.......and for the purists.........since FF began over on the other side of "The Big Lake" it seems to me that the proper celebration of the class should actually be "over there".........but then none of us would be taking our cars "over there" now would we? I simply mention this because there's been a lot of opinions about where it ought to be but no one had mentioned "over there"

Ok, now back to our regularly scheduled program.........

[DanW]

A long tow. Time to start planning.

Rick, we really appreciate what you, Tony and the SVRA are doing for formula cars and vintage racing. Looking forward to seeing you at Coronado in September.

[lenhart05]

Quick question. As I'm not experienced in pro racing, I don't have a good grasp on what would be considered OK. Assuming pro1600 could be part of the weekend, would the typical Pro team welcome one-off entrants to join them for the weekend? (Following all pro rules, tires, licensing, etc.). I think it's Ok now, but what about 20+ additional entrants.

[Purple Frog]

Not only would you be welcome, they waive some of the fees so you can try it on for size.

[GT1Vette]

We still have some T's to dot and I's to cross, but my trip to Road America this past weekend was very productive regarding the possibilities of a "US FF 50th Anniversary" in August 2019.

Still need to get some more commitments, but look for an announcement (one way or another) before the Mid-Ohio Runoffs...