What would you choose?

[Eric Little]

I have an opportunity to get one of the following for free. I can only get one and these are the only options. Which would you choose and why?

GoPro Hero+

GoPro Hero4 Sessions

ION Air Pro 3

Garmin Virb Elite

I have looked each up online but I have no practical experience with any of them. The primary purpose will be use on a FF (Swift DB1). I might use for other things but those uses would only serve as a tie breaker since it is likely to spend 99% of its time on the car.

So, if you could have one of those for free, which would you choose and why? Which do you have and would you buy it again?

Thanks
Eric Little

[fitfan]

well... i can tell you that to date - my success rate with the go pro is about 1 out of 5 times. and it frequently turns itself off on those rare occasions that its actually recording....

while the image resolution was "mid 90's quality" at best, i much preferred my chase cam.

[Swift17]

I cannot speak to the others - and I know some others have had problems BUT we have had our GoPro Hero mounted on the tail (not roll bar) of our db-1 for upteen seasons and it has worked well - true, it does NOT have overlay from the AiM etc but our drd equiped Hero 3 has provide steady clear video and sound (......let the discussion continue )

Note: this was set/shot on the "second" highest setting and an overcast day ........

https://drive.google.com/folderview?...VBQMUlUVkhrUW8

[Earley Motorsports]

I have the GoPro Hero and I am very happy with it. Have a look at all the car shows on TV and see how many have GoPros mounted on them. Hundreds of them, can't be too bad if the pro videographers are using them constantly. Besides, you can use it for other video as well even though the primary use is on the racecar.

[pacratt]

Not sure if mine is called a "Hero" or "Hero+" but its the last of the original style - has a square lens cover instead of the round fish-eye.
It works great so far and you can get them relatively cheap now - I've seen this model for $130 at Sam's Club.
Perhaps the "pros" use them because the quality is acceptable when also considering the cost of expendability.


Glenn Lange

[problemchild]

The GoPro "box" cameras are great for a closed cockpit car, or other toys, but they are inappropriate for a formula car. They provide an excellent picture but the reliability of the hardware and operation is a joke. You want a "bullet" style camera with a "vibration on/record" feature that you mount within reach of the driver. I believe you can get a 90+% success rate with video using this approach. We get 98% success rate with Smarty-Cam GP. We were less than 50% with GoPro, and had to build tethers to not lose cameras when the hardware keeps breaking. At Mosport on Saturday nights, the cornerworkers bring a "lost and found" bucket of GoPro cameras and hardware around the paddock so people can reclaim theirs. If you get one, have your name on it.

By my criteria, and your choices, that makes #3 your only option. I would only consider bullet-style, in any case

[Sully]

I don't have experience with any of these but form was a big factor for me when I was shopping for a camera. That's why I have 2 Replay Mini's.

I hate the big box hanging off the car that you get with the go pro's. The session model helps a bit, bit still square.

For that reason, I like the ION on your list but I have never even heard of the brand. That doesn't say much.

I do like the options the Virb offers.

[BeerBudgetRacing]

A Session is on my Christmas List......

I have a GoPro2 and it's worked well for years. Had an original and it died of unknown causes. Rumor is the originals and early 2's had reliability problems. I sent them my out-of-warranty original and got a hefty discount on the 2...

I don't think a car is an unusual environment for them and certainly a tintop v open wheel comparison is bogus - most camera's are on the roof, hood, fender or bumper of a tintop and subjected to no less vibration, etc.

ChaseCam is probably better but the niche market means higher $$. I'm not making epic films or broadcasting so the marginal increase in quality is not worth the not-so-marginal increase in cost.

With the goPro we have all the bikers, surfers and skaters doing the nut-cracker to drive the cost down.

Sony and Canon and Nikon have all tried the market. GoPro is the VHS of action cams.

[Jim Garry]

I purchased one of the original Go Pros a few years ago and it didn't work. Manufacturer worked with me for a month but eventually gave up and sent me a new one. I sold it unopened.

Last season my co-driver got a brand new Hero with wifi. Never worked. Lost nearly an entire season of potentially helpful video.

I think aero issues aside, the Go Pro is probably a fine product but they make their customers do 100% of the quality control. So if you end up buying one and it doesn't work out of the box, send it right back. Don't mess around with it.

Went back to my Chase Cam.

[Spengo]

I cannot speak to the others - and I know some others have had problems BUT we have had our GoPro Hero mounted on the tail (not roll bar) of our db-1 for upteen seasons and it has worked well - true, it does NOT have overlay from the AiM etc but our drd equiped Hero 3 has provide steady clear video and sound (......let the discussion continue )

Note: this was set/shot on the "second" highest setting and an overcast day ........

https://drive.google.com/folderview?...VBQMUlUVkhrUW8

You can use software on your PC to sync up the data with your video and render an overlay if you like. I use Race Render 3 but there are other applications such as Dashware that do a similar thing. It's not instantly ready to go like with a SmartyCam but you don't have to buy a $1000 camera either. https://youtu.be/iWL8k5m9oEg

[BeerBudgetRacing]

And as mentioned in another thread, Dashware is owned by GoPro and is now free
http://www.dashware.net/

So, their commitment to the market is building...

[Eric Little]

Thanks to everyone for their observations and recommendations. If any more come up, please post them or PM me. I do not need to make a decision immediately so I am going to think about it for a bit.

Eric

[dsmithwc04]

I've used gopro with 100% success. Never had a single fault with three different versions on 2 different cars (FM and FE).

Also, PM sent.

[Eric Little]

Time for an update. I ended up with the Ion. I used it for the first time at our season opener a week ago and it performed very well. I will need to figure out wind noise but the picture and operation was good.

I also produced my own mount. Turns out that an old two piece axle collar from my karting days is the same diameter as the roll hoop. I widened the keyway to fit a 1/4-20 screw, drilled and tapped, then added some neoprene washers. The camera screws down and compresses the neoprene to keep it from backing off. I will next try a bit of rubber between the collar and the roll bar to try to reduce the vibration but even without it the vibration is not too bad. I was also able to get a small zip tie through the existing spot for the factory tether so a secondary safety was very simple.

If you want to know what video looks like, here is a link to one of the races.

https://youtu.be/wvEL_85rXEg

Eric

[fitfan]

And as mentioned in another thread, Dashware is owned by GoPro and is now free
http://www.dashware.net/

So, their commitment to the market is building...

wait what? randy sold dashware? ....calling him now

Thanks for the link / update

[fitfan]

Eric,
congrats on keeping your nose clean and taking the win!

im not really happy with either my go pro, or sony action cam (it fogs up and shuts of / corrupts files constantly). the go pro -refussed to stay in position on the bike, air would just blow it back at 130mph... I've broken 3 go-pro type mounts now in 4 weekends.

so - good choice!

Time for an update. I ended up with the Ion. I used it for the first time at our season opener a week ago and it performed very well. I will need to figure out wind noise but the picture and operation was good.

I also produced my own mount. Turns out that an old two piece axle collar from my karting days is the same diameter as the roll hoop. I widened the keyway to fit a 1/4-20 screw, drilled and tapped, then added some neoprene washers. The camera screws down and compresses the neoprene to keep it from backing off. I will next try a bit of rubber between the collar and the roll bar to try to reduce the vibration but even without it the vibration is not too bad. I was also able to get a small zip tie through the existing spot for the factory tether so a secondary safety was very simple.

If you want to know what video looks like, here is a link to one of the races.

https://youtu.be/wvEL_85rXEg

Eric

[Eric Little]

so - good choice!

I will reserve judgement until it works consistently well for a lengthy period. That said, if it keeps up the way the weekend went, I will be able to recommend it. I will be trying a wired mic next time to see if I can eliminate the wind noise.

But more importantly... When will we see you back on the track? You can never have too many Swifts on the track.

Eric

[fitfan]

couldn't make spring MTN - was working in Dallas that week, couldn't get on the road friday for a long haul... bla bla bla - will be at most of the rest of the events. and tracking the scooter on a few free fridays in the meantime.

and you mean "can never have too many yellow swifts on the track" all the kool kidz have yellow Swiftz....

[Eric Little]

And part to... too... two... (whatever) has been posted.

Enjoy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8ibzEa5BcQ

Eric

[Swift17]

Eric,
.... the go pro -refussed to stay in position on the bike, air would just blow it back at 130mph... I've broken 3 go-pro type mounts now in 4 weekends. ..........

Jason averaged 100+ and 152mph TS @ Daytona - Our GoPro has been solid as a rock (mounted to body NOT roll bar - and had a DRD - maybe we have been lucky BUT have no problem with the GoPro - one note NEVER adjust the camera's angle w/o loosing the capture nut this sure fire method will brake the mount every time - just loosen adjust and tighten.

They have been mounted to airplanes that do aerobatics.

Here is the incar vid from Daytona - you can even see the weather change during the race - Watch the first from 6:00 mark 'till the incident - then start the second and skip to the 9:00+ mark - then watch the Third

https://drive.google.com/folder/d/0B...lUVkhrUW8/edit

I am now interested in the new application sourced above from DASHWEAR for data inlay and will check it out

[swiftdrivr]

GoPro's customer service is a joke. Any camera you mount should not be on the frame. I mounted my Sony on the depression behind the roll bar on the DB-1. I'll try to find a picture to post. It gives a great view, you can see both sides, and see your hands and dash. No problem for several years now.

[Eric Little]

Any camera you mount should not be on the frame.

Why not the frame? Is it simply an issue of vibration? I like the frame as all connections are mechanical (nut and bolt) which I can check frequently to avoid camera loss. I am not as comfortable with chemical connection (i.e. adhesive).

That said, if the probability of damage due to vibration is 75% and the probability of mount adhesive failure is 25% then I can understand the probability weighted loss is better to go chemical (and when aren't chemicals the answer really?).

And that said, if it is vibration, will some form of isolation of the mount to the frame (e.g. rubber or neoprene between the collar and frame tube) be sufficient to reduce the vibration down to the level that would be experienced if mounted to body work?

Eric

[swiftdrivr]

The rollbar mounts transmit too much vibration. Here is what I did to mount mine [if I hit the right picture]

[Eric Little]

Here is what I did to mount mine [if I hit the right picture]

Ahhhh!. You solved my mechanical v. chemical mounting dilemma and addressed the vibration of the frame mount. Interesting idea. I like that it still allows good access to the tow point as well. Thanks for the picture. I will take a look at my camera mounting and how I might be able to adapt something similar.

Thanks
Eric

[swiftdrivr]

Glad you like it.