Crossle front spindle question...

[DB2Crossle]

Good day all,

Spindle/hub question for you; Recently aquired a Crossle 32F and starting to tear her down for inspection, cleaning, freshening etc. Noticed the front spindle appears to be pressed then captured with a nut. Is there a prefered method of removing the spindle? My guess would be a bit of heat and a press. Any thoughts??

I'm debating, should I plate or paint??

Thanks,
Dino
'78 Crossle 32F

[provamo]

Good day all,

Spindle/hub question for you; Recently aquired a Crossle 32F and starting to tear her down for inspection, cleaning, freshening etc. Noticed the front spindle appears to be pressed then captured with a nut. Is there a prefered method of removing the spindle? My guess would be a bit of heat and a press. Any thoughts??

I'm debating, should I plate or paint??

Thanks,
Dino
'78 Crossle 32F

neither

[Brian]

That is a modified Triumph spindle. I'd just leave it alone, and paint the rough bits black.

Brian

[troyt]

I've never disassembled mine since play is minimal, so great question. Hopefully someone will post up. You could check with Neil Porter, www.porterracing.com. He can be hard to get a hold of, but good guy and a fountain of knowledge.

[tstrong]

Same as almost all to old vintage and many club fords. You are right on the money. A little heat and a press and they pop out no problem. Although failure in the tapered section is highly unlikely it is best to remove the spindles when you mag them. Todd

[DB2Crossle]

Thanks for the replies!... I'll probably just leave them in given they have no play.

Considering they are nicely stripped I'll probably do a quick LPI (Liquid Penetrant Inspection) since I have all the stuff at home and call it good... unfortunatley I don't have a mag particle set up.

Thanks again,
Dino

[tstrong]

Dino, I want to start by acknowledging that there are hundreds of old formula ford out there that have never had any formal NDT/ NDI and have never had any failure. The fact is most of these cars are way over designed and unless there is a design flaw or gross manufacturing or maintenence flaw the parts will last forever. That said I just want to offer my thought on DIY inspection kits. These are only my opinion and I am certain many will disagree but I would like to share my experience. I am a Director of Engineering and Quality for a large aerospace company and have 30 yrs of experience in Aircraft Design and maintenance. I am an Engineer and have no significant NDT training or experience, but the folks who do that for a living report to me and as I am intrested in the process I have spent a fair amount of time talking with them, observing them doing inspection, and am familiar with penetrant insp, mag insp, floro penetrant and floro mag insp, ultrasonic, eddy current, and xray techniques. So, what I am going to offer is that using the simple DIY penetrant inspection spray kits for most people is very questionable at best. As an example I have taken know bad parts and conducted penetrant insp on them and typically have about a 50-60% success rate in identifying the defect. My guys tell me that even with trained people like themselves the success rate is around 90%. Using florescent penetrant (dark environment/ black light) significantly improves your odds, but still requires very dedicated concentration and discipline to ensure you don't miss something. So for me unless I am in a real bind I do not do any DIY inspection. I use a certified A/C inspection service, but even you local automotive machine shop is a pretty good bet. The key is having people that do the operation day in and day out with the right equipment. So just my thought and as I said earlier most of our parts will never have an issue, but I like the higher level of confidence I get letting a professional do it.

[DB2Crossle]

Dino, I want to start by acknowledging that there are hundreds of old formula ford out there that have never had any formal NDT/ NDI and have never had any failure. The fact is most of these cars are way over designed and unless there is a design flaw or gross manufacturing or maintenence flaw the parts will last forever. That said I just want to offer my thought on DIY inspection kits. These are only my opinion and I am certain many will disagree but I would like to share my experience. I am a Director of Engineering and Quality for a large aerospace company and have 30 yrs of experience in Aircraft Design and maintenance. I am an Engineer and have no significant NDT training or experience, but the folks who do that for a living report to me and as I am intrested in the process I have spent a fair amount of time talking with them, observing them doing inspection, and am familiar with penetrant insp, mag insp, floro penetrant and floro mag insp, ultrasonic, eddy current, and xray techniques. So, what I am going to offer is that using the simple DIY penetrant inspection spray kits for most people is very questionable at best. As an example I have taken know bad parts and conducted penetrant insp on them and typically have about a 50-60% success rate in identifying the defect. My guys tell me that even with trained people like themselves the success rate is around 90%. Using florescent penetrant (dark environment/ black light) significantly improves your odds, but still requires very dedicated concentration and discipline to ensure you don't miss something. So for me unless I am in a real bind I do not do any DIY inspection. I use a certified A/C inspection service, but even you local automotive machine shop is a pretty good bet. The key is having people that do the operation day in and day out with the right equipment. So just my thought and as I said earlier most of our parts will never have an issue, but I like the higher level of confidence I get letting a professional do it.

Hi tStrong,

Thanks for the feedback!! I too have a bit of aviation background and I do/did hold a level III NDT cert in dye penetrant, mag particle, eddy current and ultrasonic testing. Over the years in my past life I did manage to get my hands on some of the "real" stuff along with the proper UV wavelength black light.... It's fun for me going back to the good 'ol days!!

Thanks again for the input and I couldn't agree with you more about some of those basic DIY kits and the need for the proper training.

~Dino

[tstrong]

Great, that's exactly what I was hoping to here. It just scares me some of these people with no experience do a quick spray job and convince themselves everything is wonderful. Good luck with your rebuild and hope to meet you at the track sometime. Todd

[fshort]

Hi all:

This is a interesting post. I was a A&P mechanic on corporate jets & helicopters, and all the cracks I found w/ spray can kits were found first w/ strong light, CLEAN CLEAN parts, & a 10x magnifying lens.

I say this to reinforce the idea that you can inspect for defects with careful visual inspection.

I'm NOT saying this visual inspection replaces "real" NDI, because it sure doesn't!

We had a little Magna-Flux practice in A&P school, but I leave NDI to the pros.

Regards,
James

[DB2Crossle]

Hi all:

This is a interesting post. I was a A&P mechanic on corporate jets & helicopters, and all the cracks I found w/ spray can kits were found first w/ strong light, CLEAN CLEAN parts, & a 10x magnifying lens.

I say this to reinforce the idea that you can inspect for defects with careful visual inspection.

I'm NOT saying this visual inspection replaces "real" NDI, because it sure doesn't!

We had a little Magna-Flux practice in A&P school, but I leave NDI to the pros.

Regards,
James

Hi James,

I would agree that most "open to the surface" cracks can be found with a bit of magnification and some patience. It makes it a bit easier if the parts are nice and smooth starting out. Also having a bit of undrstanding of the loading characteristics and potential failure modes doesn't hurt either.

This ceratinly isn't going to be a common occurance for me, just like aircrafts requiring different levels of inspection based on airframe and engine hours are rouitine it's the non scheduled oopy's I'm looking for right now... the over-G'd, hard landing, sudden stop kinda things considering that most of the parts are close to 40years old!! lol

Thanks for the input!
~Dino

[fshort]

Hi Dino:

I'm MORE than 40 years old AND I've been over-Ged, had hard landings, got some surface corrosion, etc, etc. and I'm still circulating!

Seriously, yes, of course I meant open to the surface defects - thanks for pointing that out.

Regards,
James

[DB2Crossle]

Hi Dino:

I'm MORE than 40 years old AND I've been over-Ged, had hard landings, got some surface corrosion, etc, etc. and I'm still circulating!

Seriously, yes, of course I meant open to the surface defects - thanks for pointing that out.

Regards,
James

Haha...I'm right there with ya James on all of the above!! lol..

Have a great 4th!!