2015 Challenge Cup Series Straw Poll

[fvee62]

For the 2015 race season there is an effort being considered to create a cross-border “Challenge Cup” series with the F-1200 group in Canada. A nucleus of long-time Formula Vee enthusiasts and racers are behind this effort. This new series would be an evolution of the past two years’ of Challenge Cup Series events.

Before going forward, it has been decided that a straw poll be taken among the potential Vee competitors - both in the States and in Canada, to gauge interest in this proposed series.

The basics of this series would be as stands:

1.) Five race weekends – two in Canada and three in the U.S. The Canadian races would probably be Mosport and Shannonville. U.S. races are somewhat up in the air because of the re-surfacing of WGI, but would hopefully include one race there and then a choice of Mid-Ohio, Nelson Ledges, Pocono or Pitt. Int. (Beaverun). The exact configuration would depend on scheduling and the various organizers co-operation with the Series’ intention of running a Vee only group at all events.
2.) The Falken radial tire and Diamond wheel set-up would be required to be eligible for points.
3.) The point structure would award all race starters from first to last position.
4.) Prize money would be awarded – most likely to the first three positions.
5.) “Monster” manifolds will most likely be illegal to run. There would be an averaged manifold diameter that would be determined between the U.S. and F-1200 entities. The idea would be to put the U.S. Vee’s and the Canadian F-1200 group on an equal horsepower footing.
6.) There may be a small fee to be a member of this Challenge Cup Driver’s Group. This would help cover some of the expenses incurred.

With the aim of convincing the various organizers to grant us our own group, we would like to see 20/25 cars per event. Your response is needed to see whether this car count figure is a likely possibility.
The question for potential entrants is simple - would you consider committing to this proposed series? Your help with this survey is greatly appreciated and every response counts. Please send me a PM with your response.

Greg Davis

[nbrigido]

Depending on the dates and how they stack up against the current series dates, would like to say Yes, count me in.

[Johan W]

For the 2015 race season there is an effort being considered to create a cross-border “Challenge Cup” series..........The question for potential entrants is simple - would you consider committing to this proposed series? Your help with this survey is greatly appreciated and every response counts. Please send me a PM with your response.

Greg Davis

Greg...100% for sure. I'm in.

[fvhopeful]

Count me in enjoyed the races I took in the last 2 years.
CASC schedule has been posted .
So hopefully we can start to work on the dates and tracks soon

Cheers
Desmond

[blackhole]

What about Canadian cars that don't have a SCCA approved fuel cell? Fire systems?

Would they be eligible to race in the US part of the series?

[nbrigido]

What about Canadian cars that don't have a SCCA approved fuel cell? Fire systems?

Would they be eligible to race in the US part of the series?

Kevin, the Fire System in mandatory for SCCA events. I do know speaking to most people that went down last round, that they will accept the CASC tech for the car.

[Steve Bamford]

What about Canadian cars that don't have a SCCA approved fuel cell? Fire systems?

Would they be eligible to race in the US part of the series?

You would require these to be changed & installed as far as I understand.

[fvhopeful]

Kevin

I have raced in the States in the last 2 years.
you will need 2 safety requirements that are not mandatory in Canada.

1. Arm restrains (which FTDA has mandated)
2. Fire suppression system.

both years the SCCA accepted my CASC annual tech inspection.
at each event they looked at my safety equipment, which I was thankful for.

Cheers

Desmond

[Robber98]

Count me in.

[blackhole]

Im only writing this now because everytime I want to change something. I get flak about "we need to keep costs down"

Canadian F1200 always talks about keeping our rules inline with the states. So that we can attract cars and drivers from the states.

For a Canadian to go down and race there we need to have a fire system that will cost that that person $300-$500 plus installation for the ones that can't do it on their own.

I think there needs to be an exception in place for this Can-Am Series. To keep costs down.

On another note not to mention the Canadian vs US dollar is 11% in favor of the US. Our entry fees will be 11% higher.

Just a thought. I wouldn't be able to go to the US anyways 6 weekends in Canada is already a large enough time commitment for me.

[gbmetcalf]

Depending on the dates and how they stack up against my work Schedule, count me in

G.

[fvhopeful]

Kevin
The challenge series will not interest everyone
So that being said , we hope the ones interested
Will keep a positive outlook and appreciate the hard work.
being put into the series . As far as the cost of a fire suppression
system I look at it as money well spent ! Some people will
Spend much more on custom paint for their helmets.

But everyone is welcome to participate. We just have to follow the rules.
Which are in place to protect and increase the safety of the drivers.

Cheers
Desmond

[Steve Bamford]

Im only writing this now because everytime I want to change something. I get flak about "we need to keep costs down"

Canadian F1200 always talks about keeping our rules inline with the states. So that we can attract cars and drivers from the states.

For a Canadian to go down and race there we need to have a fire system that will cost that that person $300-$500 plus installation for the ones that can't do it on their own.

I think there needs to be an exception in place for this Can-Am Series. To keep costs down.

On another note not to mention the Canadian vs US dollar is 11% in favor of the US. Our entry fees will be 11% higher.

Just a thought. I wouldn't be able to go to the US anyways 6 weekends in Canada is already a large enough time commitment for me.

You are right on all points pretty much. I highly doubt the SCCA wil make an exceptions for fire systems so that one you will not get past. I think it will be like trying to push water up hill to get them to change.

There are higher costs if you travel outside our "local" tracks but keep in mind we also want people to travel north to us as well so there should be some give & take if it fits in the budget.

The great thing about traveling to different tracks is you not only get to meet other fellow FV drivers, you get to test yourself & your equipment on other great race circuits. Kevin you would really enjoy Watkins Glen or Mid Ohio without a doubt.

You also travel in & stay in your RV, so no extra lhotel expense fuel is cheaper & food is much cheaper in the US so hopefully that would make up for part of our dollar difference. I am sure you would enjoy the challenge of some US racing.

[Johan W]

You would require these to be changed & installed as far as I understand.

We(me Matt and Dave) had no hassles at Watkins Glen. Just checked Matt's helmet. My helmet was in my trailer(think Dave used the same reason) but was told that they would check before the race. Checked the arm restraints in pre-race paddock.

Accepted our Cdn tec.

[Steve Bamford]

X

[Johan W]

Im only writing this now because everytime I want to change something. I get flak about "we need to keep costs down"

On another note not to mention the Canadian vs US dollar is 11% in favor of the US. Our entry fees will be 11% higher.

Just a thought. I wouldn't be able to go to the US anyways 6 weekends in Canada is already a large enough time commitment for me.

Kevin...the entry fees are way less. The traveling a lot closer for you to some of the US tracks as Calabogie.....also nice to race on new circuits.

I know the feeling and carefully open my e-mail after mentioning anything towards the ugly words "development" or "new".

[Steve Bamford]

We(me Matt and Dave) had no hassles at Watkins Glen. Just checked Matt's helmet. My helmet was in my trailer(think Dave used the same reason) but was told that they would check before the race. Checked the arm restraints in pre-race paddock.

Accepted our Cdn tec.

That doesn't mean you were running legally. I could be wrong but believe it is a requirement.

I would guess it is also a requirement for SCCA insurance some how.

[Johan W]

That doesn't mean you were running legally. I could be wrong but believe it is a requirement.

I'm racing a US Vee....from Detroit with all the required systems. It's legal...just mentioned that the three of us(if you go by passport...two Canadians and South African) had no problems racing at Watkins Glen.

[Steve Bamford]

I'm racing a US Vee....from Detroit with all the required systems. It's legal...just mentioned that the three of us(if you go by passport...two Canadians and South African) had no problems racing at Watkins Glen.

My mistake, I thought you meant the three of you were all running without the fire system.

I wouldn't want any F1200 drivers to make a trip & not be allowed onto the track to compete.

[Johan W]

You are right on all points pretty much. I highly doubt the SCCA wil make an exceptions for fire systems so that one you will not get past. I think it will be like trying to push water up hill to get them to change.

There are higher costs if you travel outside our "local" tracks but keep in mind we also want people to travel north to us as well so there should be some give & take if it fits in the budget.

The great thing about traveling to different tracks is you not only get to meet other fellow FV drivers, you get to test yourself & your equipment on other great race circuits. Kevin you would really enjoy Watkins Glen or Mid Ohio without a doubt.

You also travel in & stay in your RV, so no extra lhotel expense fuel is cheaper & food is much cheaper in the US so hopefully that would make up for part of our dollar difference. I am sure you would enjoy the challenge of some US racing.

You're right EXCEPT....Kevin, take your Keurig coffee machine. The coffee is really bad at Watkins Glen and way more expensive then five large double doubles...lol.

[Johan W]

My mistake, I thought you meant the three of you were all running without the fire system.

I wouldn't want any F1200 drivers to make a trip & not be allowed onto the track to compete.

No...Bill Vallis warned us prior to the trip to have the fire systems in place. I was lucky that it was already installed.

[Chris Elwell]

I'm in for all the races and I'm excited to race with the F1200 group in Canada. Keep in mind, a lot of us are going to be purchasing the radial wheel and tire package for next year, so I personally don't see having to add fire systems to some F1200 cars as a big deal. I'm looking forward to meeting you guys and hope we collectively can get some huge groups together.

Chris

[nbrigido]

I'm in for all the races and I'm excited to race with the F1200 group in Canada. Keep in mind, a lot of us are going to be purchasing the radial wheel and tire package for next year, so I personally don't see having to add fire systems to some F1200 cars as a big deal. I'm looking forward to meeting you guys and hope we collectively can get some huge groups together.

Chris

P

[nbrigido]

I'm in for all the races and I'm excited to race with the F1200 group in Canada. Keep in mind, a lot of us are going to be purchasing the radial wheel and tire package for next year, so I personally don't see having to add fire systems to some F1200 cars as a big deal. I'm looking forward to meeting you guys and hope we collectively can get some huge groups together.

Chris

Good way to look at it.

[Amon]

Chris,

Keep in mind that if they eliminate the larger manifolds, you'll have to also
purchase another manifold and spec it to Canadian regs......

That being said, if the larger manifolds are banned, then I suggest we go back to
stock dia. manifolds for the series and get rid of all increased dia. manifolds.

Mark

[Rolling Stone]

Chris,

Keep in mind that if they eliminate the larger manifolds, you'll have to also
purchase another manifold and spec it to Canadian regs......

That being said, if the larger manifolds are banned, then I suggest we go back to
stock dia. manifolds for the series and get rid of all increased dia. manifolds.

Mark

Im sure some Canadian drivers have spare manifolds you guys could borrow each time you came to Ontario to race,and any Canadian driver who doesnt know you need a fire system to race in the States has his head in the sand,with the exception of a newbie to the class.I think it should be mandatory in Canada to have a fire system,getting burnt seriously or mildly is an extremly painful injury,being a WW11 buff I have read about pilots getting burnt back then,I got my vee from the States with a fire system in it,I would have installed one if I had a Canadian bought vee,its just not worth the risk,especially as one is sitting against or right next to the fuell cell with a carb right behind your head.

[Amon]

Rolling Stone,

The manifold rule would also apply to the U.S. races so unless the Canadians want
to bring additional manifolds to the "away" races, we'll have to get our own. As I
mentioned earlier, everyone runs "stock" and we end any diameter issue's etc.....


Mark

[problemchild]

The Ontario F1200 intake manifold dimensions were determined by measuring up any existing manifolds purchased before 2010 when the Harding saga changed the class. Presumably, only $1000 manifolds purchased recently won't fit with in those dimensions, and those rules will be a cost-saving benefit to most regional racers. For many, it will increase the value of older big-money manifolds that became virtually worthless with the current rules. Going to earlier interpretations of the manifold rule may be unachievable but would likely cost 95% of the racers money. I do have one 80s killer manifold around should that happen and I'm sure there are a few more out there, but that would not be good for the Series, IMO.

I doubt there are manifolds to lend in Ontario. Anything that is any good would be on a car. There are probably more surplus manifolds kicking around in the US, where the turmoil resulted in the more serious racers upgrading, and hanging their good manifolds on a nail in the garage. I expect most of the regional crowd still have them (pre-2010 spec) on their car and this "rule change" will cost them nothing.

I'm not politicing or promoting that the Series adopt these rules. That's not my place, but I did want to explain how the Ontario specs were obtained. I literally measured every manifold that I could in Ontario, and we settled on a maximum size, in effect freezing the spec at that time. Intoducing a new Series spec that is different(smaller) from SCCA or Ontario F1200, just seems like an unnecessary expense for everyone involved.

[G.B.]

I want to do Majors next year, so for the purposes of this thread, count me out.

[Mark Filip]

I want to do Majors next year, so for the purposes of this thread, count me out.

Will you make a exception and come to Palmer

[G.B.]

Will you make a exception and come to Palmer

Yes!

It looks like the provisional dates for Palmer are Aug 22 & 23 and Sept 12 & 13.