Fire systems

[Jnovak]

Any recommendations for a lower cost fire system?

[DanW]

Hello Jay,


Search by the brand Firebottle, Safecraft, SPA, Stroud, AFFF Foam, FE36 or Halon 1301 that you want in Fleabay..


Of course, buyer beware.

[scorp997]

IIRC, the rules in SCCA doesn't allow halon any longer on newer cars, but it is grandfathered in with older cars. FE36 and AFFF seems to be the allowed stuff.

[cory mcleod]

Jay,

Have you checked out Stroud Safety? They sell what used to be the Phoenix systems. Not sure how their prices compare for a full new system, but they helped me with a direct replacement FE36 bottle for my existing Phoenix system, and their customer service is great.

Cory

[racerdad2]

Cold Fire Suppression Systems Speedway Motors has a sale on FE36

[Adam Brouillard]

Anyone know a way to test an installed system. I'm able to weigh it, but does that guarantee that the system works? Why do know onboard systems seem to have pressure gauges?

[Steve Demeter]

Depends on the system.

Halon for instance is pressurized with nitrogen. Therefore you need the cylinder to weigh the proper amounf=t (full weight) and have pressure.

A minute leak can over time allow the cylinder to depressurize, but until the Halon starts to vaporize and leak, it will weigh as if it were full.

[DaveW]

I just did a Google search for maintenance/refilling instructions on Halon extinguishers. I could find no reference to the use of any gas other than the Halon itself during refilling. There is also no mention of checking fullness/readiness other than by weight. Here is one of the quotes:

"Check weight of extinguisher and compare to proper weight specified on extinguisher nameplate. If discrepancy is noted, remove nozzle or hose assembly and follow Complete Maintenance/Recharge Procedure for recharging."

So, I think a gauge is not needed on a Halon extinguisher. Mine has never had a gauge, and it is stated to be checked by weight only.

Since Halon is a CFC type of compound, similar to AC refrigerants, it is pressurized to convert it into a liquid, and becomes a gas on release, so no additional propellant is needed.

Solid state or aqueous (AFFF) extinguishers, OTOH, can weigh correctly, but have lost propellant, so they do need a gauge.

[Matt King]

Both Halon systems I own (Fire Bottle and Safecraft) have gauges installed on them, FWIW.

[SEComposites]

Willans make fire extinguishers now and they are well priced, but. I don't think they are available here in the US unfortunately.

[snettleship]

Since I have the seat out on my Crossle45F, I figure it's a good time to check the fire bottle. The good news is, it has a gauge and it is in the green. Of course I've been told not to bet your life on that. I've attached a picture of it installed.

First, how to I remove the bottle without setting it off? I see the "Pull" cable, the line out and an attached "pin". I can guess what to do but that usually ends up in a clean-up of some sorts. Then after that, determining if it is charged and safe. All step by step instructions appreciated.

Scott

[Roland V. Johnson]

Insert the pin, there is a hole for it between the cable and the out fitting. The pin goes all the way through the actuator head. Only then can you loosen the allen set screw that holds the cable in and remove the cable. I often take the pin over to the belt sander and sharpen it a bit so that it slides in easier. While you're at it you should remove the actuation part of the fire bottle, and clean/lube it. I have seen several that were so corroded that they would never have worked when the cable was pulled. I'll try to post some pix and a how to tomorrow.

[Jerry B.]

Also when the firing head is removed, and if it has cable actuation , remove the cable core from the casing and use a light grease (consistency of Vaseline) on the core so as to have a free movement in the core/ casing. Many of the casings provided by the oem will not keep out water.

When replacing the cable core/casing in the firing head, make sure the core comes out a bit (1/4" or so), then tighten the grub screw on the casing. This extra core validates that the firing pin is in the correct position to keep the firing pin open, and then you can safely remove the shipping pin from the head.
As to bottle weight, best case is weighing when the bottle (halon) is new, then once in a while reweighing the bottle. Loss of substantial weight and you have a problem.

[Frank C]

After an accidental discharge (don't even ask!), it seems that I need to replace the extinguisher in my DB1. I cannot get the old Halon extinguisher refilled locally. I am finding that finding an extinguisher to fit a DB1 is difficult. At the point where the extinguisher mounts, it is about 11 inches inside the frame tubes. The clearance beneath the seat is about 5.5 inches. Extinguishers which are 160 mm in diameter seem to be too tall. The only thing I have found that looks like it would fit is the OMP CEFAL 3, and it is not clear it is available. Any recommendations? I am willing to drive to get my old system refilled.
Frank C

[BWC54]

After an accidental discharge (don't even ask!), it seems that I need to replace the extinguisher in my DB1. I cannot get the old Halon extinguisher refilled locally. I am finding that finding an extinguisher to fit a DB1 is difficult.

If you don't want to go with a foam, the only thing I know of that fits a DB-1 in the original location is the Lifeline Zero 360 2.25kg mechanical. It's expensive though compared to the old halon extinguishers.

[DaveW]

I did a search for compact fire systems a month ago - here are my results:

[Frank C]

Thanks. It was with a fellow in OKC who thought he could refill it, but his filling tool did not work with it. I had not realized the space constraints of the DB1!
Frank C

[DaveW]

Depends on the system.

Halon for instance is pressurized with nitrogen. Therefore you need the cylinder to weigh the proper amounf=t (full weight) and have pressure.

A minute leak can over time allow the cylinder to depressurize, but until the Halon starts to vaporize and leak, it will weigh as if it were full.

I just did a Google search for maintenance/refilling instructions on Halon extinguishers. I could find no reference to the use of any gas other than the Halon itself during refilling. There is also no mention of checking fullness/readiness other than by weight. Here is one of the quotes:

"Check weight of extinguisher and compare to proper weight specified on extinguisher nameplate. If discrepancy is noted, remove nozzle or hose assembly and follow Complete Maintenance/Recharge Procedure for recharging."

So, I think a gauge is not needed on a Halon extinguisher. Mine has never had a gauge, and it is stated to be checked by weight only.

Since Halon is a CFC type of compound, similar to AC refrigerants, it is pressurized to convert it into a liquid, and becomes a gas on release, so no additional propellant is needed.

Solid state or aqueous (AFFF) extinguishers, OTOH, can weigh correctly, but have lost propellant, so they do need a gauge.

Steve, I have to apologize. I just found 2 days ago out that Halon 1211 did, indeed need an N2 boost to discharge properly. So, consider me corrected. Reference this thread:
http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64636

[Steve Demeter]

I kind of remembered but not 100% positively about 20 years ago getting a handheld halon unit recharged that had to be pressurized with Nitrogen but given how long ago it was I was not 100% positive. Apology OK and don't sweat it. I did not even remember it.

[Jeremy Soule]

After an accidental discharge (don't even ask!), it seems that I need to replace the extinguisher in my DB1. I cannot get the old Halon extinguisher refilled locally. I am finding that finding an extinguisher to fit a DB1 is difficult. At the point where the extinguisher mounts, it is about 11 inches inside the frame tubes. The clearance beneath the seat is about 5.5 inches. Extinguishers which are 160 mm in diameter seem to be too tall. The only thing I have found that looks like it would fit is the OMP CEFAL 3, and it is not clear it is available. Any recommendations? I am willing to drive to get my old system refilled.
Frank C

My friend and pro racing safty supplier Vicki Ponds, Race Safe Store(vpond@cox.net 480-861-7235) has a Safecraft 3 pound FE-36 that is 3.2" by 15.4" (not a typo 3.2" Dim. Bottle) $409. A lot of local guys use this bottle. Some have mounted in other areas around the cockpit, behind the dash, on the chassis tubes etc. There has been some indication that under the seat mount can lead to spinal injuries in a hard frontal impact if not correctly padded.

[Max Power]

Scott, I just had my 5lb Fire Bottle refilled and refurbished with a new actuator head.
http://www.firebottleracing.com/. Talk to Nick. These small bottles are no longer in production and becoming unobtanium.