help identifying formula vee

[mikehinkle]

I have the chance to buy this vee chassis and parts but I can't seem to find one like it. Does anyone know what chassis this is? Is it worth cleaning up and racing?

[FV90]

Looks to be a Caracal C or a Lynx adjusted to make a Caracal C. Have you seen a logbook number stamped on it?

[mikehinkle]

There is a log book I haven't seen it yet. The owner says the log book claims it as a lynx but I couldn't find one that looks like it.

[fvkartguy]

If I only saw the second picture, I'd say it's definitely a Lynx/Caracal C, but I don't know about that frame.
The frame might be based on a Caracal?
I don't recognize the hardware either. Bellcranks don't look Caracal and those are some weird-looking leading arms.

[Campbell Motorsport]

At one point this might have been a Lynx- but the leading arm conversion is not Lynx/ Caracal.

Every month or 2 a car like this shows up and it looks attractive because of the low initial price. These cars are huge money pits. If you got the car for nothing, you would soon find yourself way upside down financially in an old race car. By the time you get an engine, front end, transaxle, fire system, belts, and probably a fuel cell- you will have spent more then the cost of a complete, much nicer car.

If your goal is truly to get to the track and race, it is a buyer's market, keep looking. Buy a complete car that has all the parts you need.

I have given the same advice for many years, "Buy the best car you can in the class you choose to race." I have never had anyone tell me they bought too nice a car, but have heard many stories of buyer's regret. The bargain basement car (that looked good last year) now has many thousands of dollars invested in it and it still isn't as nice as the complete car they could have bought for less money. Plus they still haven't made it to the track.

YMMV- but not by much.

Larry Campbell

[mikehinkle]

thats one vote against it.
anyone else think its just not worth bringing back?

[rave motorsports]

I totally agree with Larry Campbell. The market is full of true race ready cars at bargain prices right now. I know of one Formula First sitting totally race ready with only one weekend on the motor. Everything built with top parts and truly could be bought and hauled to the track and raced for $8500.00. There are lots of Vees for sale like that too. You would have more than $8500 in that care in just parts.

[FV90]

I know of really good Caracal D (Huntsville Al)with spares and a enclosed trailer for around 8K and a clean Caracal C (NC) for 5750....plus several others.

[Bruce]

That car will need a fire system $1000, belts. $300, fuel cell $600, Engine $3000, Transmission $ 2500, Front Beam assem $ 3000, brakes $ 1000, Other misc. $???. The prices are just estimates, but it is close to $10,000 and you will still need. Save yourself the trouble and buy a car that is complete, been developed, and proven. It will cost less and you will learn more, the easy way.
Go to a race and talk to the people, see if they will allow you to sit in their car. Try, get info, then purchase.

[Daryl DeArman]

thats one vote against it.
anyone else think its just not worth bringing back?

Depends what your plans are. The parts are worth asking price if it was next door and you already had a Lynx/Caracal or some other FV with a tweaked frame.

To rebuild to like new? Probably not unless you already had many bits.

You can't buy the rear shock, mirrors and 2 of the 3 body sections for the asking price...but there are lots of relatively expensive bits missing.

Getting it all to you is going to double your costs...

[mikehinkle]

well i can pick it all up for $200 if it makes a difference
I figured I would go to some races here in the northeast (Thompson CT and Loudon NH) and find some used parts to complete the car.
If you guys think this chassis is useless or homemade junk I wouldn't bother. Not knowing the costs of all the little parts... I might be making a mistake.
Thanks for the input guys I have until Monday to make my final decision

[Daryl DeArman]

If it's close, snag it at that price, assess what you have and what it would take to restore/complete it.

Meanwhile keep an eye out for another more complete car.

If you have to part this one out you won't lose money, that's for certain.

[gbmetcalf]

I'm with Larry on this one. It looks like a money pit.

G.

[Bill Bonow]

Those 4 x 4 frame rails makes me think that this is a Canadian built car. I know Greg Rice is very familiar with the guys who built similar, but I thought they were more like Lynx B (trailing arm) rather than C (leading arm). I don't know for certain, but I'd bet large money that GR know this exact car.

I will agree that to put this back on track will be a significant investment. Lots of complete cars available for less money.

[FVRacer21]

This look familiar - Jason Holehouse in the 1600 test car at Lime Rock in 1996

I always wondered where the car went.

[mikehinkle]

WOW!!! That's the car! Have anymore pictures or info?
1600 test car? does that mean its not a vee?

[mikehinkle]

well despite all the good advice I bought the parts. $200 is not going to break the bank.
I took some photo's of the log book. Maybe it will stir up some new info on this car.

[FVRacer21]

Well the shock is probably worth what you paid, looks like 2 good mirrors, if the leading arms match a Caracal C, that is worth something and it looks like the bodywork is in not bad shape.

Caracals and Lynx tend to go on the low end of the scale compared to Protofoms, Citations etc, so you should keep your eye out and definitely come to Thompson, looks like 18+ cars will be there.

And you have a log book, although I wonder if you have an earlier one too - by 1991 you needed homologation papers, prior to 1983 you didn't need them.

ChrisZ

[mikehinkle]

You mean this?


I'll be at Thompson Saturday. I'll try to talk to a few of you guys and see what I can learn. I don't know 100% if a big guy like me can even race. I'm 5'11" just under 250lbs according to the weight of 850 in the log book I would be at 1100lbs in car that's 75 over minimum. Is that a big disadvantage?

[problemchild]

I would not put two much significance in the 850 weight. Its fairly standard for tech guys to guesstimate that value and 850 was a pretty standard guess, especially since it matched the early weight rules. Even if actually weighed, it was probably a long time ago. Judging by the amount of steel in that chassis though, I expect 850 would be very optimistic.

[veefan]

mikehinkle,

You got a great deal and you're starting with a good/fair foundation. Welcome to the FV class! Many of us bought our "first Project Vee" like you except... without a log book and Holo papers! SO You got a great deal and your ahead of the game! Don't listen to "oh money pit" noise... it's just grumpy old/young men.

Like someone already said you could sell the rear shock alone and make money!

Don't fret, buy parts on the forum and e-bay, save money and take your time. Ask a 1000 questions on this forum and we'll all help to get you on track RACING!

Sure you could buy a "Race Ready Vee' for $7,500 and like anyone one of us, we'd send the motor out for a rebuild about $2,000. So you're $9,500 into a car you can sell for $7,500 Bah Bah

You have a Lynx clone, and it looks like a good frame design. Early Lynx cars had very little protection, not too reassuring for a new driver. Yours looks like a solid build frame with good extra protection. Like "problemchild" said, you might have a little extra frame, design, weight, but that's ok for a new driver.

My email address is jstofka@hotmail.com ask me any questions, I'll point you in the right direction, or if you get disheartened... send me you paypal account and I'll send you $500 for what you have right now!

Money talks.. BS walks I'm looking for a new project!

ps if you go to Thompson, find Chris Z, old school, class act, vee racer!!!!!!

Sloffie

http://www.sloffiemotorsports.com

pic of my Mod Lynx

[Amon]

Veefan,,

If you're looking for a new project, I have a 97' Citation roller I would like to get out of the garage!

Let me know!


Mark

[veefan]

Sure, how much? and what do you have?

Please do not get off track as typical, send me a private email.

Lets get the new guy racing!

[ajpastore]

Lets get the new guy racing!

Getting the new guy racing is what all the previous posts were about. Good advice from people with lots of experience. No honest person in their right mind would advise a complete beginner to nickel and dime themselves to death over years of heartache to acquire parts and assemble a car, if they really wanted to help them get to the track.

Mike, if racing is what you want to do, you would be best served with the information suggesting to buy a complete car. Especially when there are plenty available. The fact that we'll be racing with you someday means we don't want to give you bad information. ...at least those of us you'll actually see at the track!

You got a good deal on the parts, anyone of us would have bought them, but put those aside and look for something closer to ready to race.

We'll see you at Thompson.

Andy P.
Orange D13
NER

[problemchild]

http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/show...077#post437077

This, or something similar, is what you need now. Offer the guy $400 and go get it.

[mikehinkle]

Well I may just buy a complete car in the future but for now I'm just going to learn and play with this one. like i said before I'm a big guy and I haven't even sat in one of these things yet. I've seen them at a few races that I've been to at Loudon and being a F1 fan I obviously was drawn to the open wheel cars. I just happen to see this one on craigslist and bought it if not for anything more then a project to play with. Hopefully I get it together or buy another car if I really think the class is right for me. Before I can even think about spending the money a race ready car costs I'll have to sell my other wanna be race car (BMW e30) maybe I can find someone who wants to trade

[mikehinkle]

Also anyone with cheap or free vee parts for this build I'll be at Thompson on Saturday with some cash in my pocket.

[veefan]

problemchild is totally right that car for sale is a great doner car. With the front bean and transaxle you'll already have a roller for possibly under $1,000.

Like everyone said, the fast way to get on track is to chuck down, $5,000 to $7,500 for a " race ready car". But that's not the only way to do it if your resourceful.

[problemchild]

I bought my first FV kit for $200 in high school about 35 years ago. Found a Beetle for another $100. That car never did see the track I expect only about 5% of these projects ever make it on the track. Perhaps another 15% do as I did, get enthused but overwhelmed, sell the project to another dreamer, and buy a more complete car. Lets hope Mike makes it! Good luck!

[budawe]

The term"race ready" is quite variable and there are some "track ready" cars I wouldn't drive to the trailer. As Veefan said, every situation is different and so much will depend on your skills. Reach out to the vee community and find an experienced person to assist in your search. Frankly, I think you got a hell of a deal and with some patience and elbow grease, you can be on course quite reasonably. Good luck and let us know what you need.

[njg005]

Mike
You should have a fantastic weekend at Thompson. Please approach all of us at some point during the weekend and ask plenty of questions. I was in a similar position when I first started. I had a limited budget and wasn't able to afford a "race ready" car. I look forward to meeting you. Look for the red #05.
Nick

[jeffrey]

mikehinkle,

You got a great deal and you're starting with a good/fair foundation. Welcome to the FV class! Many of us bought our "first Project Vee" like you except... without a log book and Holo papers! SO You got a great deal and your ahead of the game! Don't listen to "oh money pit" noise... it's just grumpy old/young men.

Like someone already said you could sell the rear shock alone and make money!

Don't fret, buy parts on the forum and e-bay, save money and take your time. Ask a 1000 questions on this forum and we'll all help to get you on track RACING!

Sure you could buy a "Race Ready Vee' for $7,500 and like anyone one of us, we'd send the motor out for a rebuild about $2,000. So you're $9,500 into a car you can sell for $7,500 Bah Bah

You have a Lynx clone, and it looks like a good frame design. Early Lynx cars had very little protection, not too reassuring for a new driver. Yours looks like a solid build frame with good extra protection. Like "problemchild" said, you might have a little extra frame, design, weight, but that's ok for a new driver.

My email address is jstofka@hotmail.com ask me any questions, I'll point you in the right direction, or if you get disheartened... send me you paypal account and I'll send you $500 for what you have right now!

Money talks.. BS walks I'm looking for a new project!

ps if you go to Thompson, find Chris Z, old school, class act, vee racer!!!!!!

Sloffie

http://www.sloffiemotorsports.com

pic of my Mod Lynx

I miss that car

[veefan]

mikehinkle how's the FV build going ????

Ditto Jeff! I wish I could take credit for building that Vee but I can't! Jeff build a solid car that is a great current racing FV.

p.s. he builds/built some of the greatest custom FV FST and FF custom steering wheels!!!

[mikehinkle]

The vee build hasn't moved yet.
I'm raising money to buy Jeff's gecko =) come on Jeff have a deal with me!
My other car is ready for autocross so I'm tied up with that at the moment. If I don't find a complete car I need to secure the major components for this build at a reasonable price Engine, Trans, front beam.... If I can manage those items for little money then this build will get the green light. Otherwise like many have said it may not be worth it. SOOO at this moment i'm just keeping my ear to the ground trying to collect parts.

[veefan]

The vee build hasn't moved yet.

Jeff's other car is a complete race car (the gecko) , sell what you have in a parts car and work a deal for a complete race ready car.. I'm 30 minutes from Jeff, interested in selling the other vee parts car you have???

Sloffie

203-770-2740

[jeffrey]

You talkin about the lynx I have buried away? That car will be sold eventually....I have no time to dig it out right now and go through it.....I don't know anything about it....it came with the trailer and engine I bought a few years back. Believe it our not, I think I sold the fuel cell to the guy that bought your/my old lynx