Predator History/Info

[csingletary01]

Hi all I am doing research on a Predator I have purchased. It is marked Predator DW.
Who built the predators. This car has a very sleek body with out the beam fairing and side pods. Any history or info would be greatly appreciated.

[Bill Bonow]

Chuck,

The cars originally were built in Colorado. Don't know who exactly, but the first one I saw was in '83 at the FV 20th with Zan Smith driving. Predator was sold (I think in '85 or '86?) to Dan Wise (DW) and Andreas Serrano, both living in the Detroit area. Dan Wise was building the cars up until just a few year ago (maybe he still would build one if asked). They were very popular in the mid 80's when handsome Dave Smith was selling them.

Not much in the way of details, but I'm sure someone else will jump in with more.

[problemchild]

I thought Predators were the production version of the Vista Bushwacker cars run earlier.

The original Predators were very very clean with beam fairings which enclosed the beam, Citation-style steering, and running the length of the car while fairing in the similar shaped trailing trailing arms and rear axles. Pete Pires ran one in the Northeast after 1988. Lots of bodywork but minmal frontal area and little draft!

Later versions were not nearly as nice as the skinny-car trend came and the car's producers removed all the cool stuff that made the cars cool and fast ..... although now skinnier.

[BLS]

I'm not sure who actually designed or built the cars, but I believe the Vista's were built for Don Courtney in the mid 70's. As I recall, only Courtney and O'Neill had these cars for several years. Courtney won the National Championship in 1978 in his Vista. I'm fairly familiar with the rear view of the car...

[Dave Woodmancy]

FWIW, Dan did build a new bodied Predator around 97?? Possible its that car? Maybe post a pic, I would recognize it for sure if its that one. As far as I know, there was only one car with the new sleeker bodywork that was ever completed.. Other than that all the predators I ever saw had the full bodywork with the beam fairings, ect.

[Bill Bonow]

Greg and Barry are correct. I should have been more specific. The Predator was a higher production "knock-off" of the limited build Vista Bushwhacker. The Predator was built by ? in Colorado and then moved to Detroit.

Chuck, for your car, I think yours may be the new bodied car that Woody mentioned ('97 range). I know it was partially converted to FST a few years ago by Dennis Baran (Big Baran 23 here on Apex), but was sold before the conversion was completed.

[csingletary01]

It has Dennis's name on car. I have attached some photos. I am trying to find if there is a logbook or homologation papers some where. I am completing conversion to FST and hope to have race ready by Mid-Summer

[Agitator]

The evolution of the Predator ended up looking nothing like the early editions. The original Vista was almost a clone of our car (the original 10 or so Agitators). Courtney and Oneill showed up in '78 with cars that were hard to distinguish from ours. I guess imitation is the highest form of flattery, but it was almost like they snuck into our shop and stole the molds! The original Predator had a slightly different nose - it came in a few inches on each side before flattening out and tapering vertically toward the front beam, and very molded rear cowling that did indeed give off very little draft, as Greg stated.

Glen Harcus, who drove one of our cars in the early 80's, was one of the first guys to drive a Predator in the southeast. He always had top notch power, but I also remember folks having a hard time passing him in a straight line.

[Rmalcomb]

If I remember right Darrell Baily designed and built the Predator FV

[Bob Posner]

Larry Bangert who still races a Swift DB1 and lives in Issaquah Wa had both a Vista and a Predator on the west coast between about '79 and '85 if you want to track him down for info.

[lenhart05]

I would love to here more about these cars. I have what was originally a '92 Vista. I'm not sure how much is similar to the original Bushwackers. The original nose is different than the Predator, but the middle body and the rear look identical.

Didn't a Vista win the runoffs in the late '70s or early '80s at Road Atlanta? I know a few Predators did pretty well at Road America in the '80s. I think I remember there was a brown predator with chrome suspension.

More photos?

Tad

[Bill Bonow]

I know a few Predators did pretty well at Road America in the '80s. I think I remember there was a brown predator with chrome suspension.

"Handsome" Dave Smith

[BLS]

Didn't a Vista win the runoffs in the late '70s or early '80s at Road Atlanta?

Don Courtney in 1978 and 1981. As far as I know there were just the pair of cars the first couple of years, Don's and his partner Brent O'Neill.

Courtney and Oneill showed up in '78 with cars that were hard to distinguish from ours.

James, I had forgotten the cars were virtual copies of the Agitator, at least the original ones. At least in appearance as I do not recall the chassis design. As I recall the original Agitator design was unique in the tubing used, or something. Hey, just for reference, we met at the birthday party near the end of qualifier race 2, standing in front of Steve Davis's motorhome. You and your dad happened to walk around to the fence. I was the tall ugly guy

Regards,
Barry

[Agitator]

Hey, Barry! Yeah, it was good to meet you.

The tubing in the original Agitators wasn't magic, but the car was just aerodynamically superior to any car running at the time. In '76, my dad went to the spring Charlotte race with the car in just an aluminum finish, as none of the fiberglass was ready sans the nose. He led every lap of every race he ran that year. It did use the side pods and air entered under the nose, traveled through the chassis tubes to cool the engine, so all the scoops and such being run back then weren't necessary. When Don and Brent showed up in the Vistas the next year it raised a few eyebrows. If I recall, Don went from not qualifying for the Runoffs in '76 to winning in '78....although my dad pretty much did the same thing - went from finishing in the teens at the '75 Runoffs in his Zink, to winning pretty easily in '76. The southeast was a hotbed of good drivers back then..Don, Brent, Wayne Moore, George Fizell, then Stevan Davis, etc. as the 80's rolled in. It was a battle just to qualify for the Runoffs.

Back to the original thread - I remember the Predator the first time I saw it, and thought what a polished, professional look it had, plus the name was pretty cool! It was at Savannah, and the guy had just had it delivered. It was just white gel coat and he put some numbers on it Friday night and raced that weekend.

[Agitator]

Oh, and when I mention hot drivers in the southeast in the 70's, I can't forget JJ Carlin. I was in my good formative years between about 9-12. I learned all kinds of choice curse words from JJ. He couldn't go a weekend without getting pissed off about something, but he was a damn good driver when he got over it! JJ bought Harvey Templeton's Ringwraith, and had just the right temper for it...

[BLS]

air entered under the nose, traveled through the chassis tubes to cool the engine...

That's it. I knew I remebered something a bit unusual for the time.

I think everyone learned a new word, or string of them, from Mr. Carlin...

[csatte02]

If I remember right Dennis only drove that car the predator p4 a few times at Waterford. I don't think it was ever raced as a first so I doubt you are going to have homologation papers for first but maybe RV. I saw Dennis a couple years ago racing a formula ford. I think he got it directly from Dan wise and it was the only p4 built, but not sure on that. I have only seen the one and it was raced around 2005. Not sure when it was actually built.

[Ecclestone]

Hi Guys
Sorry a bit late for the Predator discussion, but the car was built in Salida Co. by Precision Dynamics ..a trio consisting of Darryl Bailey , Ben VanderLinden and Gary Valler. How do I know, I still have my original P3 in Australia, built here under licence by myself. The guys provided all the drawings ,while I purchased all the main component parts,body, loom, roll bar etc. The car was the first zero roll car to race in Australia. It was an absolute jet in a straight line, but took me some time to sort it for our treaded tires. I still have all the original drawings and am restoring it slowly for vintage vee. Darryl Bailey has passed away but I still correspond with Ben.

[Davidmachx]

Hi Guys I think I may have a Vista. Body work looks very similar but it was missing it's nose. Barn find. Any idea where I source a nose?
Thx