No lights were used, just flagging stations all weekend.
RACE Report -COTA
No lights were used, just flagging stations all weekend.
Steve Bamford
RACE Report -COTA
I could also be wrong but I don't believe COTA allows any safety vehicles on the track without FCY where many other tracks you will see white flags. This shortens green laps considerably.
Some accidents did require FCY though, others I would say did not.
We did see white flags but only with double yellows...that some, or many depending on who's perspective it is, seemed to miss for a few stations.
Steve Bamford
I do. It could be the difference between a set of tires and no tires, and $300 or no dollars. I get the feeling that T & S doesn't even know.Originally Posted by Wren
RACE Report -COTA
Oh yeah. I forgot about the prize side of it. You may have to wait for fastrack next month to know.
Well I just got home
and was able to semi-view the footage from today's debacle, umm, race and I have to say - when I got hit in T1 on the start, it was definitely NOT from 2 different drivers, rather only one.
(Jose I sort of owe you an apology as I coulda sworn you hit me first!)
GREAT drive from Gerardo, 3rd on Sat and first on Sun, kept it on track and took the overall.
Coop Chronicle to follow (NOW with video)...
My son & I drove down from Mn to watch. The split starts seemed to work well. However, FB is so fast, it put them into traffic rather quickly. The heavy winds did make the yellows nearly impossible to see at times & some were in seemingly odd locations. The time time delay between classes was really, really long. Too bad the next group out could not be ready to roll much faster. The track supplied safety crews seemed very slow to react, even slower to clear the track.
Watching 85 spec Fords run under the bridge was incredible. The spec Miatas, likewise. It was truly disappointing that Group 5 had so little racing laps. It's an awesome group !
I came to watch the FC's run, as I begin racing this April. Honestly, I had no idea how fast they are.
Overall, a fantastic track & facility. With shorter times between races, much faster track safety responses, easily seen track lighting for yellows & green, a truly grand weekend of racing awaits !
BTW... Thanks to all the racers who came. A first time was bound to be a bit of a mess. Y'all made a great show of it. Congrats to all !!!
"An analog man living in a digital world"
huh? I could see them just fine. So could another car from whom I have video evidence of multiple PUY. Awful. ps, they stole my podium.
Awful officiating at this race.
FB was the rear pack. What actually was happening was that the FAs and CSRs were so fast they were catching the back of the FB within about 3 laps.
Its late, I just got home, our flight was delayed because of the weather in Chicago.
Whoa... Didn’t realize enforcing the rules would damage my integrity.
Damn if you do, damn if you don’t. I can see it now, if nothing was done, "why should HE be able to get away with that?"
It BS that the stations were hard to see.
What happened:
Race starts and I get a good jump on JR, but Ott gets a bitchin and goes to the inside and JR goes wide into 1. Lots of action going on at this point, maybe even 4 wide and JR is even on the turf. Somewhere Ott (I think) and I had contact, our left rear endplate was bent, but I never felt a thing and we got out of there pretty smoothly with Ott leading and a nice lead on the pack.
I followed the, btw awesome looking Astra, from 2-11. Went we went got on the brakes, Otts right rear suspension failed. Talking later to the team at the Saturday night party, I guess a rod end failed. Anyway, so now I have a few car length lead on JR. I get to 11 and can’t downshift. After multiple pushes forward on the bump shifter, I was able to get it into 1st and shoot out of there... JR eats up a couple car lengths. Upshifts are fine. Hmmm. Get to 19, down one gear, no problem. Up to 4th and then approach 20, down one gear, tried downshift another, nothing. WTH. Push, push, push... Finally 2nd. JR eats another couple car lengths. Damn. Up through the gears its fine down the straight. JR is close enough to draft and makes a run and goes deep into 1. He passes, goes wide, I go under... The old over-under. Now approaching 11, I decide I'm going to use the clutch. Same result. One gear butter smooth, then just the blipper, blipping away every time I push forward, but no downshift. I keep pushing and finally get into 2nd. But by this time, JR nails 11, gets a great run and nothing I could do to get passed into 12 but he goes wide, I go under... The old over-under.... But now he has the inside down into 13 but he goes wide, I go under... The old over-under! Struggling again into 20, JR is close enough to draft and takes the lead in 1. This time after as the usual first smooth down shift, I pull back on the lever and then push forward and it downshifted! So I quickly realize the shift lever isn’t retracting back to center position after I pushed forward. By now we start hitting the tail end of the other pack, dicing through traffic and are nose to tail several times.
The next lap we come over 9 and yellow. We come over 10 and there’s a yellow on the outside of 11 but JR passes the Radical. We exit 11, go into 12 while passing 2 more double yellow stations, one mid straight on left and another drivers right at 12. Then another at drivers left at 13 and JR passes Joe's CSR Stohr and a FA by 14 because they were driving at a reduced pace. Joe even mentioned radioing in to his crew asking if its ok to pass under double yellow. By 15 I think it’s were JR must have noticed because he reduced his pace. Now I'm thinking, what the hell, when we go green, I'm screwed with 3 cars separating us which all have more power than our FB's.
We get to 11 again (under full course double yellow) and you ould see a red/white CSR DP02 in the f1 wall, straight off, looked like mech failure or something IDK. By next lap, several wreckers were at 11. Next time around they throw the checker.
We pull into tech and I tell the team what happened and told them I believe we won anyway because JR screwed up somehow and passed 3 cars under yellow. I went victory circle and chatted with JR, we were both in smiles having fun trading positions over and over and also surprised how short the race was. That has to be the shortest race I've ever been in. Not to mention the 2 practice sessions on Friday cut ultra-short and our qualifying cut to 15 minutes (2:09 lap times, with 75 cars on track, lucky to get 6-7 laps in). Chris Farrel even joked how he didn’t even break a sweat yet. I then mentioned to JR he passed all those cars under yellow. And he said he didn’t think it was yellow yet. So after a celebration on the podium with JR and Coop (which btw we all were nice and didn’t spray each other w the bubbly to spare each other having to get into a soaked suit for the next day. So we sprayed the crowd instead!
By this time I was really wondering too. I swore I saw yellows, many of them. So I went over and asked Joe and immediately he confirmed what had happened, explained radioing to his crew and asked what the outcome was. The driver from the Radical was right there too also confirming what happened. Now I was just curious if T&S and/or the corner stations called it in and went to see the stewards. I just wanted to know if I won...Geez
But the stewards were all in a frenzy about being behind schedule. That the SM race took too long and even through the checker one lap after time expired. Giving a parade lap to one driver and then changing the results and giving it to Drago who led the previous lap. We asked if they saw the multiple passes under yellow by JR. And they wanted to hear more. They took us to the mega TV room and some discussions went on in there and calls for the chief steward. Then I’m told no one saw anything, nothing was called in so it must not have happened. Joe and I looked at each other in disbelief looking at all the monitors and the multiple double yellow corner stations we passed AND ALL SAW.
]Then the chief steward walks up and wants to hear the story. And then explains he simply didn’t have time to investigate but we should fill out a protest then they would look into it and if it did happen, they'd cancel the protest and a CSA would be issued because they wouldn’t have time until the morning... Because they are deciding on moving the last race to the am and canceling all Sundays Q sessions. So I did and Joe filled out a witness report as directed as well.
At 11am, we were called to the courts. I was told after much investigation and much review with the ultra-sophisticated video playback system, there was no passing under yellow. The asked if we had video, I answered no but informed them Joe said he did. Now to prove a point. We then watched the video (w JR too) and what you read above is what happened...On Joe's ultra-sophisticated GoPro
JR at this point was pretty upset. Saying very similar to things you wrote... IE, this is how you want to win? I would never protest you... etc.
I could feel his frustration and have been there before. I’ve been punished for passing under yellow by mistake and as a matter of fact, it wasn’t a car in my class. I was in EP, lots of prod cars out there on track at the same time... And that was for one car and one flag.
We were also pretty surprised it even came to this. It wasn’t supposed to go to courts and turn ugly like this.
And I even explained that this shouldn’t have to be our responsibility. And now with a night of sleep didn’t care what would happen and we withdrew our protest. But, they decided to do a CSA.
Sure, I feel bad. Definitely not the way I want to win. But I know we could have won. I’ll have a chance to prove that another day. The race cut short... No qualifying... It was a mess, something needed to be done.
The track and facility is un-friggen-believable. Wow what a track! COTA has set a new bar in the US for race tracks. Texas region on the other hand wasn’t firing on all 8 and this was the biggest race they ever hosted. Not sure why Cen-Div wasn’t called in for help. I now have an even better appreciation for how the June Sprints and the Runoffs are.
You know, there’s a bunch at stake. It cost a lot of money to enter, to tow, tires, tires to win, GDRE cash, F1000 cash and I’m trying to help a team sell some cars. Guys who really have a lot at stake and every point matters. Kevin is right. Rules are rules. Passing under double yellow is serious. Especially, multiple times.
So today’s race...
I get a good start but JR has pole and the inside. Lots of action at turn 1 but we pull out of 1 and into 2 with JR leading. Nose to tail all the way into 12. Jr gets on the brakes to late in 13 and I go by into 14. Then we get to 20 and you guessed it... JR is close enough to draft and makes a run and goes deep into 1. He passes, goes wide, I go under... The old over-under! This happens again next lap too, great fun, close racing! We then are approaching 12 and JR has a run but there’s double yellows in 12 and yup, JR passes me in 12.
We then do several laps on full course caution and find Jake and not sure who tangled at the top of the hill in 1. The pace car also picked up the field in the wrong spot with a few FB's behind the pace car instead of the overall leader. Once we came around and saw they cleaned up the incident it was obvious the race should be restarted. But al the yellows were still displayed. ALL OF THEM. Once I exited 15, I figured it should be close to go time because of the size of the pack and the leader should be on straight possibly getting the green. But there’s the yellow. All of a sudden JR passes the radical in front of him into 16,17,18, there’s another yellow so I didn’t follow and then Ott, Jose and another FB pass me and the radical on the outside. Besides me and the radical you could see several saw the yellows and weren’t passing into 19. Going into 20, JR dives under a FA and they tangle and I go wide. A couple lucky dogs went inside and all of a sudden im in 6th crossing start finish. At the top of the hill there was more bumping and grinding and by 10 full course caution, double yellows, field slows down. We get to start finish and they're waiving the checker. We get to 11 and Coop is parked drivers right.
I’m told they saw nothing again.
Well there ya go.
On the flipside, I do want to say I'm enjoying a FB, the JDR and especially impressed with the F100 series. So cool to actually have strong contingencies, George throwing in some cash and a double/private race at the June Sprints!!
I’m tired, it's late, gotta go to work in 5hrs, so please excuse my rant. I guess Wren got me going. Good night.
Lawrence Loshak
'13 FB & HP National Champion
'10 DSR National Champion
'06 EP National Champion
-I searched the entire thread. I never said anything about integrity
-I wasn't talking about you. I don't know you and I don't have a beef with you.
-I doubt that winning by protesting events that had no effect on the outcome of the race is going to help anyone sell cars
It was obvious from the announcing and from watching that there was some sort of problem with people seeing yellows. I've never seen anything like that at a race. There were issues in every group, every time there was a double yellow.
This was the first event at COTA that had to use corner stations instead of in car beacons. They've got some work to do.
Agreed, even by SCCA standards.Awful officiating at this race.
It went both ways. The fast FB guys caught the back of the lead pack in 2 laps and the fast FA/CSR/DSR guys caught the back of the FB pack in 2 laps.FB was the rear pack. What actually was happening was that the FAs and CSRs were so fast they were catching the back of the FB within about 3 laps.
Wow at how much I don't miss FB.
was anyone else getting advertisements during the live feed? and at the worst times?
By my count, if someone participated in every green flag lap from Friday to Sunday, then a group 5 participant got 21 green flag laps for their $650 entry fee. That makes Rand's series look positively cheap.
I can't imagine where he got that impression . . .
+1 @ David
Me either. None of the things you quoted address integrity at all. I don't have any problem with Loshak. He got out of his car in impound and said he wasn't going to say anything. The stewards said that he wasn't the one who filed the protest.
Well, I may as well chime in with my experience from the middle of the pack.
I personally had no issues seeing the flagging stations or the double yellows. To me it seemed the workers were trying their best to prominently display the flags, and I actually thought they did a good job (meaning the flags were held high and visible, not down low where they couldn't be seen). Unfortunately I got to observe them way more times than I would've liked.
The track itself was a hoot - the few hot, clean laps we got were just a blast, there were just too few of them.
As for the passing and protesting, I've never protested results before, but after Race 2 I had little choice as three FB's passed me under double yellow between T12-T16 during the brief green flag period after the restart. We only had the green until halfway down the back straight, and I guess that's when JR got collected in T20. All I know is the extremely slow FA I was behind needed to be passed, and I was going to do it in T12, but then the flag station halfway down the straight on the left side throws that double yellow and I realized I wasn't going to get to do it. As I approached the braking zone in T12 I could see the right station's double yellow as well, so there was no way I was going to pass that FA. And then the three FBs passed me...
Once in the impound, I approached all three drivers (nice guys) and asked them if they saw the double yellow as they passed me. None of them did. I let them know that I was going to have to protest and there were no issues there at all - they all understood they'd made a mistake and there were no hard feelings or anything like that.
The officials, who had numerous protests to deal with, needed time to sort things out, so we got the trailer packed up and headed to the airport. I received several calls from the chief steward asking very specific questions about what occurred, where it occurred, the sequence of events, and so on. Unfortunately, our in-car video did not work, so they had to use COTA's camera footage for their investigation. About ten minutes prior to boarding I got the final call from the chief steward informing me that, yes, they had the entire thing caught on video, and the footage echoed what I had reported. So my protest was upheld and I was informed I'd get back those three places that I'd lost when passed under double yellow. Fair enough.
It's unfortunate that so many drivers had issues with seeing the flags - that's a mystery to me. Maybe some drivers are sitting so low in their cars they can't see very well, I don't know. I will say that some of the driving behavior out there was less than stellar.
Fellow competitors, if you get passed and the driver passing you has earned it by out-braking you, then get over it, you just got passed. Shutting the door and making contact when the driver has earned the corner is just poor sportsmanship. If you get passed, work hard to re-take that position but do it fairly and cleanly.
Likewise, forcing a car off the track is also not acceptable behavior - if you have a car to your inside (or outside, for that matter) you have to give that car room to drive on track.
Case in point: on the first lap yesterday, after avoiding the collision(s) in T1, I was on track entering T2 when I got forced off to the inside and had to launch over the rumble strips and put all 4 wheels well into the red paint. I lost several positions there and was lucky not to damage the underside of the car as I came back onto the track (checking the left mirror to be sure I wouldn't hit anyone). I spoke to the driver who forced me off while we were in impound, and he immediately apologized and said he simply didn't see me, which I believe.
How he didn't see me is another question, but what surprises me is the amount of people not seeing what's out there - be it cars or flagging stations. Are drivers sitting too low in their cars? Are their shields so filthy they can't see well out of them? Heck, I don't know.
Let's all respect each other out there. Race as hard as you can and give it your all, but do it the right way. We're out here to have fun and compete for the top spot on the podium, so let's race cleanly so we can actually have more than 3-4 hot laps in a 30 minute race.
Anyway, sorry for the rant. I would've liked to have had some more clean laps at that track, because it is just fantastic to drive.
John, could you clarify some of what you said?
Was this after you crossed start finish with a waving green? I know there was some passing after the green was waved but some of the field was still being shown double yellow flags at the corners before the start finish straight. The first time I read your story I thought you might be discussing two separate incidents, but I'm not sure.
Definitely reasonable and definitely the classy way to handle it.Once in the impound, I approached all three drivers (nice guys) and asked them if they saw the double yellow as they passed me. None of them did. I let them know that I was going to have to protest and there were no issues there at all - they all understood they'd made a mistake and there were no hard feelings or anything like that.
I'll chime in with a few observations:
1) It's a brand-new track that none of us have ever driven. We've not had very many laps, so we really aren't all 100% comfortable. Personally, I would have liked to have had some sort of flag displayed on the warm-up laps for all of the practice and qualifying sessions so that we could find the stations.
2) Tons of cars. Everyone had to watch front and rear, left and right, as well as looking for flags. Elevation makes this even a bit more challenging.
3) This race is early on the season for many of us. I, for one, haven't been in a racecar since last June, so there was some rust being shaken off.
4) Rain in Friday practice really hurt the guys who didn't get to practice Wed-Thur, so they were still finding speed.
5) Short qualifying sessions increase the pressure and "red mist" potential.
None of these are excuses for PUY, and having seen 3 contact incidents up close, visibility wasn't the apparent cause of any of them. That said, there were a number of contributing factors.
Marshall Mauney
Milwaukee Region
Yes! That was awful. With one lap to go Greg Creamer was cut off and they aired two identical commercials one after the other.
Racer Russ
Palm Coast, FL
Well the advertiser got their money's worth
Steve Bamford
I still don't understand why they didn't use the light system instead of flags.
Posted by Wren:
By my count, if someone participated in every green flag lap from Friday to Sunday, then a group 5 participant got 21 green flag laps for their $650 entry fee. That makes Rand's series look positively cheap.
There is so much more cost than just entry fees as we all know to race these cars. If entry fees were the only expense, so many more racers would be participating in this sport. As Mr. Loshak pointed out in his post....."It cost a lot of money to enter, to tow, tires, tires to win".
If each driver calculates the entire cost ( flights, meals, hotel rooms, entry fees, tires, tow costs, etc.) of the event, the per minute cost of racing 5-6 laps would be astronomical for this race, especially the drivers of group 5. That's my point.
Richard Dziak
Las Cruces, New Mexico
Former Phoenix F1K-07 F1000 #77 owner/driver
website: http://www.formularacingltd.com
email: sonewmexico@gmail.com
This wasn't an event that made sense $'s per lap, specifically $'s per green lap.
COTA's time in between sessions was one of the reasons there was no way to get the schedule in. Saturday's qualifying was cut to 15 min for groups 4, 5, 6 & 7. Sunday's qualifying was cut to...well cut out altogether.
As for the incidents on the track, it is an extremely safe track to race on so someone, some where made a mistake causing an accident to happen. Much like most plane crashes after investigations are completed a high percentage of it comes down to pilot error.
Steve Bamford
Totally agree and a great question for the SCCA organizers. I know when we raced at Phoenix International Raceway (PIR), the AZ Region had the lights working and was a "BIG" help to all drivers.
Richard Dziak
Las Cruces, New Mexico
Former Phoenix F1K-07 F1000 #77 owner/driver
website: http://www.formularacingltd.com
email: sonewmexico@gmail.com
A few observations:
First off - A HUGE Thank you to the The Lonestar Region and SCCA Majors for trying to put this show on. I am so spoiled being in the Atlanta Region and having things go super smooth the VAST majority of the time.
Last year these guys played host to probably 150 (?) cars at Texas world Speedway, and now to jump to CoTA, well there's gonna be issues.
I can't imagine how these folks were pressured with the sheer volume of stuff going on, THEN throw in the fact that this event is to be run on THE Premiere track in ALL of the Americas...
Massive Undertaking never came up as Major Understatement until now...
It appeared as though the track safety crew had to have a round table discussion before attempting to move or lift cars and remove them from the racing surface. FIVE laps or more to get the Lathem/Burkett coming together (which was no biggie for Burkett as he drove his car in post race) was incredibly long. Each lap we drove by I could see guys gesticulating, and possibly even arguing about how the cars were to be moved. I saw no fluid, so it's not like they were waiting on a diaper for the car. What it DID look like was a local towing agency, used to repoing F150's from the local populace was brought in to do cleanup.
I witnessed some really weak driving, clearly some folks are not "Majors Ready".
The weather was not exactly cooperating, but some blunders by those in charge (TWO pace cars sent out for our group in the Sunday race? FFS people, TWO pace cars?) left some wondering if anyone was in control.
Finally, If I ever meet Herman Tilke, I may kick him square in the balls (from behind, so as to get the "elevation effect") Why the insistence to have Turn 1 a first gear corner - it sure leads to many schlemozzles. FAST turn ones (BOTH Rd A's, RRR. Sebring, etc...) allow the field to string out a bit...
As mentioned here and in other posts it was quite frustrating to spend so much time and money and then have so few green laps, but I don't regret going (I'm not super bright...).
I made Critter a $10 bet that the Runoffs will be coming to CoTA after this year last at Rd Am, and after running there I don't feel it will be a good fit, especially given the paddock arrangement which was never intended to support a super massive amount of racers.
Perhaps they could throw the green flag at a safer location like they do at Mid Ohio, THAT would be a huge help, just not sure where or if even feasible. One thing is for sure, get the Runoffs the hell out of the crap late fall Wisco weather and somewhere warm-ish!
COTA
It's the driver's responsibility to identify flagging stations. They had flags displayed on the first lap of every session. No problem seeing them. The 85 car spec wrecker class went green the whole race except for local yellows. Don't blame the region and the officals. COTA had significant control over what could or couldn't be done - lights, flags. So much so that COTA contracted out the photog rights to one company. I'll note that Chicago has had how many decades of doing the Sprints? Instead of bitchin about the region - thank them. You wouldn't have been there except for Krebs TWO YEAR effort. Nope, I'm not from Lone Star Region. I was there and had zip, zero problems. It's all in the expectations.
The region was not to blame for the lack of track time, COTA controlled when & what happened for clean up on the track from what I understand. It was significantly slower there then any other event I have participated in.
Everyone was gridded & set up long before they let us on the track. The delays in between run groups was 20 plus minutes in most cases.
Steve Bamford
Green green green
I don't give a flying freckle what flags are being displayed where I am at the track, but when the starter throws the green, and my headset is filled with GGG, I am G-O-N-E, GONE...
On the Thursday test day, last session, it took them 14 minutes and three wreckers to pull an FM that had spun in T1, was still on the racing surface, and could not continue.
I don't understand why they chose to throw the green flag at the up track station, just short of T1 and the checkered flag at the station close to T20. Throwing the green that close to T1 guarantees that the field is going to still be very bunched up when they get to T1.Perhaps they could throw the green flag at a safer location like they do at Mid Ohio, THAT would be a huge help, just not sure where or if even feasible. One thing is for sure, get the Runoffs the hell out of the crap late fall Wisco weather and somewhere warm-ish!
Hey Wren.
Sorry for the delayed reply - I had to go to the chiro as my upper neck and back were driving me nuts - nothing to do with racing, everything to do with loading and unloading the trailer!
Yes, I am referring to the one lap restart we got when they dropped the green for us at the start/finish after finally removing Jake's car. Of course, by then you guys at the pointy end were bunched up back near T12, from what I now understand.
Threads have been merged. Not sure why we need two threads discussing the same thing.
Carry on.
Can anyone shed some light as to who hit me going into 13 in race 2?
I'm going to be re-writing the Race Report from Saturday based on events that transpired after it was posted.
Normally I try very hard to to stay completely objective when I write up the reports or post anything online. I was working fast on both Saturday and Sunday trying to get info out to everyone and having to cover a lot of ground to do it.
I would like to post one correction on a post I wrote--
I don't know whether or not JR did or didn't gain an advantage or not under the yellow flag in Saturday's race. I wasn't on track or in a position where I could see what happened so I can't say. I basically wrote down what I was being told to me at the time I was writing it. Probably should have filtered it a bit better but like I said I was working fast trying to get info out. I apologize to anyone that feels slighted at all by that post.
I'll post both the new Race 1 Race Report as well as the Race 2 Race Report from Sunday later today. These will be in different threads so it won't get lost in this one.
Regardless of whatever disagreements anyone might have over what happen on track (or off) I hope everyone was able to find some enjoyment from this past weekend's racing events.
The only thing I wish for at every event is good solid clean racing under the green and I never play favorites. I honestly wish I could see everyone win.
Looking forward to seeing all of you at later events in the season. Cheers everyone.
Last edited by Thomas Copeland; 03.11.13 at 2:32 PM.
Rats, this is where my in car video would have been nice, as I actually used that particular incident to get by several cars. My wife, however, who was recording from the pedestrian bridge that goes over the track between T2 and T3, captured video of the area, but the resolution is not that good and you can't see what actually occurred as a truck and trailer are in the way. Having said that, you can see the entry into T12 as well, so you may be able to figure it out.
It's about a minute long and 23MB in size. I am happy to send it to you if you have an FTP site or something. PM me if you'd like a copy.
The June sprints have been run for more than 50 years with lots of entry levels over 500.
To my knowledge they have been a 3 day event with only a single race. It is only in recent history that they have even had a test day on the thursday before the event. They have always had 3 practice and qualifynig sessions per class and full length race sessions.
Perhaps a double with such a large entry can't be done in three days. Perhaps a 4 day event or just a single would be a better format.
butch deer
Cota
I think the event would have been a little better if they separated the run groups further, and only race one of the two weekend days, this would allow for a longer race, and less cars on track.
In the 2nd race, after I shook off Meyer an Atlantic tapped my rear wheel at the end of the esses, sent me in a spin and took me out of the points, less congestion would of avoided this.
Overall a worthwhile experience, considering the circumstances.
DD16 +++ You are absolutely right!
The - "I don't give a flying freckle what flags are being displayed where I am at the track, but when the starter throws the green, and my headset is filled with GGG, I am G-O-N-E, GONE..." - is a good summary of the problem.
Pace lap - look for the stations. Race start - respect your competition. When someone that is in front of you suddenly becomes easy to pass - does it take a 'rocket surgeon' to figure out there is likely an issue on track???
This happened at Sebring. This happened at Mid-Ohio. This happened at COTA. Doesn't matter where.
When are all of you going to stop bitching about the officiating and people that work hard to put on these events and start taking personal responsibility? Follow the rules. Simple.
And I don't see the difference between the 'dignity' of winning a race after a protest or after I separate myself from 2nd place by putting a couple of fast cars between us on a yellow flag.
So sick of everyone complaining about the officiating. You sound like hockey parents yelling at the refs. You're lucky you have races to go to.
COTA was great. The region / track workers worked incredibly hard. They didn't volunteer so they could interfere with you winning a plastic trophy. Give me a break...
CoTA-official thread
When the green flys, racing starts. Simple. Unless, like in usf2000 or in SCCA pro where the rules says no passing until after the start line or passing cone.
If there is a yellow flag in front of you, I don't care what's going on two corners ahead, that section of the track is not green.
CoTA-official thread
The start is different. Otherwise in groups with like 100 cars at June sprints are screwed toward the end of the field since the last turn is usually still yellow while the people ahead are still racing.
I asked about this when I first started racing and the chief steward said "green means go". I have held to that ever since.
Because the track never went green again. It had no impact on the outcome of the race.
Except that according to the GCR, the track is green.
I don't know what people were protested for, but maybe we will get to find out in the next fastrack.
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