Daytona races

[Richard Dziak]

F1000 Series Promoter East Coast:

It is called "bonafide" Sponsors. A business that has a product or brand to sell, and promotes the brand by donating/contributing funds or products to the event participants. The business gets brand recognition. There is no way that IndyCar entry fees cover the costs of Championship money, it's the bonafide sponsors.

When you first announced the F1000 East Coast Series you listed many bonafide sponsors/partners. What happened to those sponsors/partners that you listed which is clearly listed on your F1000 website currently? There is no need to list them here, we all can see who you listed on your own website.

http://www.f1000champ.com/index.html

The probem Jon, is that all your credibility is lost. If you have incorporated your F1000 Championship as a business enterprise, you can write off losses. You file tax returns for profits and losses.

Bottom line is, you need to do what ever it takes to make good to the racers who entered your series whether it's your own personal funds or funds/products from your list of sponsors/partners.

I find it interesting that none of your sponsors/partners have come forward with cash funding or products to the entrants, past or future. Not one of the sponsors/partners that you list on your website has come to your defense in the controversy that has been created within the F1000 class.

[R. Pare]

Every Series out there uses their entry fees to pay for expenses, prize funds, you name it. Where do you think the prize money comes from? For example (one series out there): 30 entrants at $995/ea = almost $30,000. An event costs maybe $20,000 to run and the prize fund is around $5,000, that's about $5,000 profit. Who do you think pays for the event and the prize fund? Like it or not, in just about every series, the entrants are funding their own prize fund.

Guess I have to ask a question:

If the above quoted method of organization is/was also true for this series, just what happened to the monies from those fees that were supposed to cover the payouts?

[JohnPaul]

Hey, I'm up for that! We can call it the Wanker Grand Prix

I don't see why we should wait til next year to start the ball busting though.
Here, I'll start....JP, are you going to actually drive your new car or is it going to be a garage queen like the last two ?

Sorry for the highjack. I couldn't help myself.

Tom

No that's my Brit buddy Ben.
I blame you. I'm scared to race ever since I saw you put Sal Philly's one off pride and joy into the wall at 140 At the runoffs a few years ago. I still get nightmares.
Just to clarify the beautiful car that Sal built was the prototype and has since built many more. So one off may be the wrong choice of words. But just to be clear Tom ****ed that car up!

[Matt King]

Who do you think pays for the event and the prize fund? Like it or not, in just about every series, the entrants are funding their own prize fund.

That only happens in amateur racing series masquerading as professional racing series. In real professional racing series, the prize money comes from sponsorships. For example, my company is a sponsor of the AMA Pro Racing XR1200 series. The entry fee for a race is $150 and the winner takes home over $3,000 in purse money.

[Wren]

You have no clue about what you're talking about. Every Series out there uses their entry fees to pay for expenses, prize funds, you name it. Where do you think the prize money comes from? For example (one series out there): 30 entrants at $995/ea = almost $30,000. An event costs maybe $20,000 to run and the prize fund is around $5,000, that's about $5,000 profit. Who do you think pays for the event and the prize fund? Like it or not, in just about every series, the entrants are funding their own prize fund.

You forgot about paying the expenses of paying the series staff (more than just a good idea). I have been to that other organizations races. It is the best open wheel racing in North America. Period.

If I did that the Series would be out of business. No one would get paid, period.

So if the series goes out of business, no one is getting paid? That is not encouraging.

John, I think it is time that you say who the "supporters" were who let you down. These magical people who were going to cough up 6 figures without having their name on anything associated with the series should be outed for not keeping their word.

You say that the check that was supposed to pay every one came with so many conditions that you could not accept it, don't you think that you should have discussed that with the drivers? Maybe they would have preferred racing with the conditions over not getting paid?

What were some of the conditions? I understand that you would have had to give up the majority ownership of the series? So what? Even a successful series is not worth much of anything more than the value of the equipment they own.

It's easy to just place points and prizes on events that are already happening. There's no organization there. There's no cost if the prizes are coming from other avenues. I think what Mike B is doing for the Runoffs is great and I think as many F1000 drivers that can should participate. But you can't even place that in the same ball park as to what I've been trying to do.

You don't get to compare what you are doing to what Mike has done for this class. Mike has always delivered much more than he has promised and you can count on his word.

People went out and bought cars/trucks/trailers for this series and rearranged their plans for the year based on your word. Personally, I spent an unreasonable amount of time and a lot of money getting things ready for this series. That time and money would have been better spent on a lot of other things and it would have been spent on other things if I had not believed your word. I think that believing you was my fault though. I should have known better after your first business dealings in this class.

From the F1000 series website:


Did Sunoco fail to pay for the awards that they were sponsoring, because none of the "Sunoco Pole Awards" have been paid? What would Sunoco think of this? How likely are they to support junior formula racing in the future?

Does anyone have contact info for Sunoco to talk to them?

What about all the equipment that was given to the series? Weren't there a car, a truck, a trailer, scales, ramps, and other items needed to run a team?

Right. Isn't this a metaphorical RV to sell? Or I suppose that all of this equipment neccesary to run a team could be contingent on there being a complete season of racing, other wise that equipment would have to go back. That might be another motivation to finish the season any way possible.

Another possible scenario is that the equipment is being used to run a rental car in the series under another business name(and apexspeed user name). If that were the case, then that person renting the car might be wanting money back? That might be another motivation to finish the season any way possible.

[Northwind]

Initially I was fairly excited about this series, but as a potential entant I looked back at Jon's history in F 1000 and felt there was not much backing any of his claims. Early on when he took delivery of Ken's car he made the statment that he and Robbie Peccorarie(spelling?) were going to run a season of national races including the Junesprints. Sorry Robbie for dragging your name into this! As that season progressed it turned into excuse after excuse why he and his team couldn't make it to any events. They never ran a national event despite his claims. Prior to this partial pro season starting, He was posting that TTM was buying a specific brand of car and would be running that car. That brand changed many times contradicting his claims and had no consistency. With the close knit community that the F 1000 boys have bits and pieces were revealed that lead me to question using my very limited racing budget and join his series. The pattern of him never holding up to his claims made me decided to hold off and see how the first couple of events turned out. So far, sadly enough it has exceeded my expectations.

[Christopher Crowe]

It appears that this was one very unfortunate deal for everyone who entered the F1000 Championship Series.

At the outset, it all appeared to be too good to be true. It turns out it was too good to be true.

Hopefully, this entire dark episode will quickly fade from memory (and from these pages) so the F1000 category can get on with its still very promising future.

Thanks ---

[Northwind]

A good turn out at the runoffs will certainly help the class.

[John Robinson II]

excellent races at tracks that the participants might have never have gone to.
FWIW, I have it on good authority that the F2000 series ran for several years before the backers got any return on their investment. And IMO, they probably have not seen very much return on their investment but it is still better than what the stock market is/was earning.
Should be a lesson learned by all.

John
Only way to make a small fortune in racing is to start with a very large one

[starkejt]

Twelve thousand, eight hundred fifty dollars.

Just thought that should be mentioned again in case anyone forgot.

[Tiago Santos]

What's Greece's GDP got to do with it?

[Daryl DeArman]

Twelve thousand, eight hundred fifty dollars.

Just thought that should be mentioned again in case anyone forgot.

I don't think anybody should forget that or Jon Lewis' business ethics.

If he's not driving a '72 Mercury Bobcat or pedaling his way to work his priorities appear to be a bit askew.

Jon could sell some personal assets, loan the CORP some money (so he has some real skin in the game) pay all those he owes and move forward motivated to get his money back plus a bit of interest.

What's to keep somebody who is lacking ethics from keeping a business operating under the guise of righting the ship, when it very well could be just an opportunity to funnel more revenue back to a select few as trumped up operating expenses?

[starkejt]

I'm just glad I never sent that cashier's check for 40 cents.

[reidhazelton]

I'm just glad I never sent that cashier's check for 40 cents.

HELL YES! Sign me up! Ever since my deal with a Nigerian Prince fell through I have been looking for a new investment!

Investing in race cars is such a smart move, a whole series must be a sure thing.

[reidhazelton]

Ok, now I know this is bogus. Check out the picture of the grid girl on the main page...pretty sure even the F1000 Series logo is photoshop-ed (and poorly) on her. You can screw a man out of cash, but don't tease with the hotties. That's just cold.

[Wren]

I'm just glad I never sent that cashier's check for 40 cents.

When I add up the numbers in the revenue column, I don't get the same numbers as him. Am I missing something? I guess this goes well with all of the misspellings on the website.

Did he honestly believe that anyone would cough up $150k for this series?

[Brett Lane]

[quote=tombeattie;354947]Hey, I'm up for that! We can call it the Wanker Grand Prix

Hey- I'm up for it too! We can pick the smallest regional we can find with the smallest run group so a split start with four cars may not look so bad..

John Paul, don't go bad mouthing Tom- we can all be friends here. He'll be the friend walking away with your side bet!

We have to start a new thread for the wanker grand prix- we just need a title sponsor that really exists.

[Northwind]

[quote=Brett Lane;355051]

Hey, I'm up for that! We can call it the Wanker Grand Prix

Hey- I'm up for it too! We can pick the smallest regional we can find with the smallest run group so a split start with four cars may not look so bad..

John Paul, don't go bad mouthing Tom- we can all be friends here. He'll be the friend walking away with your side bet!

We have to start a new thread for the wanker grand prix- we just need a title sponsor that really exists.

Don't forget the parasite, that's job is to hold the money until the end of the event but sneaks over the fence about half race distance with the cash. If you are going to have a real "Wanker Grand Prix" you'll need a real wanker!

[JohnPaul]

[quote=Brett Lane;355051]

Hey, I'm up for that! We can call it the Wanker Grand Prix

Hey- I'm up for it too! We can pick the smallest regional we can find with the smallest run group so a split start with four cars may not look so bad..

John Paul, don't go bad mouthing Tom- we can all be friends here. He'll be the friend walking away with your side bet!

We have to start a new thread for the wanker grand prix- we just need a title sponsor that really exists.

No bad mouthing here, Tom's my buddy. Just a little ball busting is all. Don't worry I got some for you too!
Just spoke to James. I don't think he'll have the car ready for Daytona but it would have been funny if we ran our own F1000 wanker series and had a better turn out than the Jon.

[billwald]

hard for me to personally comment on something I know very little about. But I am disappointed for the drivers and for Jon. Still hope the drivers due funds get paid, and some sort of series emerges for 2013. Not my style to make negative comments on a public forum anyway, But, I switched to Hoosier's 8's and 10's in June and comitted to 5 sets for the rest of the season. So not only do I run larger size tires, now I dont use GY's.

I am not available that race weekend but good luck to all who attend. I'll be at DIS next weekend though!

PS: Nothing wrong with the GY's! I've run them on our car since 2007. Just trying something new. And Amen to Phil's post below!

[Phil Creighton]

As most of you are aware I've been around this sport a long time and I've dealt with Jon Lewis before. All I can tell you is that he could have walked away from monies he owed us when the Indy Lights sponsorship was not completely paid but he made good on it, albeit late, a couple of months later and I suspect from his own funds. I know others that have dealt with him and there was not a trail of unpaid bills - I checked before getting involved.

No question he's a promoter and prone to over-verbalising but his intentions are good. I'd be surprised if he doesn't settle up with the people that are owed money. Its real easy for people to sit behind a computer screen and jump on an internet lynching - all that will do is really sink any chance of this F1000 series going further and only a couple of posters actually have skin in the game and some of the most vocal don't seem to race much, if at all

Phil

[DFR Dave Freitas]

Phil makes some good points, the only thing I've had a problem with during this whole deal is the "You don't have a ball in this game" attitude from the series owner.

When potential customers are hearing during the offseason that some east coast series is putting up over 50k in prize money, kind of makes it tough to sell our program.

[Daryl DeArman]

We weren't all a direct victim of Enron, Bernie Madoff or the Lehman Brothers scandals, but I bet many of us have opinions about them.

Lots more people involved in this sport than just the names on the results sheet.

[starkejt]

Well, this time there is a trail of unpaid bills and bounced checks.

[JohnPaul]

what happened to the other Daytona thread?

[KevinFirlein]

I suspect unpaid advertising, But its just a guess

[Bill Bonow]

*

[starkejt]

I guess Andy let you have your bullet.

[JohnPaul]

And it was just getting interesting. I was wondering why this one got revived.

[jim_oseth]

Okay, before we get moderated, I'd like to steer the discussion back to a more productive direction. I have a few suggestions.

1.) Why is Brandon lifting in T1? Refer to the video posted by Wren. I hope it doesn't keep him awake at night.

2.) Jimmy Oseth is 66.

3.) Purple Frog has never had good pork barbecue.

Josh,

1.) Because he's smart and enjoys life as he knows it.

2.) That's in dog years, my friend.

3.) You wouldn't know that from looking at him.

[starkejt]

Give Jim a break. I know it looks like he's several days behind in the discussion, but he actually started typing his post 4 days ago.

[Christopher Crowe]

I spent about forty years in Hollywood. And I thought the film business was ugly when it came to making fun out of people's failures, kicking the **** out of people when they're down, etc.

But a few of you guys -- racers for God's sakes-- make even the nastiest film critics seem kind. (And I'm certainly not talking about the folks who actually took the financial beating on this thing; they certainly have a right to bitch).

My point is... isn't this thread dead? Everyone who had something important to say has already said it. So...

Dontcha think we should put it all to bed? It's become akin to a public stoning...

Thanks,

Chris

[Jnovak]

Agreed, enough is enough.

Thanks ... Jay Novak

[Mike B]

Everyone who had something important to say has already said it.

Not really, but I'm locking the thread anyway.