Any chain and sprocket suggestions?

[Ivinsea]

Do you guys have any recommendation for front sprockets brands?

These guys offer:

AFAM
Driven
Pit Bull
Super Sproxs
Vector

http://www.kneedraggers.com/list/137.../GSXR1000/2008

I have seen Rebel recommended here.


Now for 530 X ring chains:

DID ERV, VM & ZVM
EK SRX
RK GXW & SXO

http://www.kneedraggers.com/catalog/...orcycle-Chains


If I counted correctly, my chain has 39 links; I suppose I will get 3 chain sets from a 120 link bulk chain?

Thanks in advance.

Ivin

[Superbikes]

Hi Ivin,

We use Driven sprockets with RK chains on our race bike builds. Driven just has held up the best for us. We did install a Pitbull sprocket set but it was on a street bike. Quality looked great but as for durability I don't have any feedback for you.

-Sal

[glenn cooper]

Yo Ivin, I'm pretty sure you have more than a 39 link chain.
Are you counting inner and outer plates?
Also be sure to include the masterlink in total length.

Diggin' that new ride, ain'tcha?!!

GC

[Dave Gomberg]

I've used an AFAN front sprocket on my DSR for years. No sign of unusual wear.

Coop is right. Your chain is probably 78 (maybe 80). If you expect to be doing this for any length of time, you might want to order chain in bulk lengths so that you don't have to be piecing together "leftovers" from 120 link packages. Some manufacturers do sell 160 link packages (which would work for you). I've gotten bulk chain from http://www.moto-chains.com/ although they don't show it on their web site. Call them and they will send you whatever you need.

Dave

[Ivinsea]

Yo Ivin, I'm pretty sure you have more than a 39 link chain.
Are you counting inner and outer plates?
Also be sure to include the masterlink in total length.

Diggin' that new ride, ain'tcha?!!

GC

Oops, I stand corrected:

http://www.ekchain.com/faqs.htm

Every pair of sideplates – both inner plates and outer plates – counts as one link when determining chain length. If your bike is supposed to have a 110-link chain, count every single inner and outer plate on one side of the chain until you reach 110.
Chains will always have an even number of links. If your uninstalled chain has inner plates on both ends, or outer plates on both ends, you’ve miscounted.

I now have a 78 link chain.

Glenn - I am loving it. Can't wait until spring.

BTW - you must have a new FB on order, don't you???

[Ivinsea]

Hi Ivin,

We use Driven sprockets with RK chains on our race bike builds. Driven just has held up the best for us. We did install a Pitbull sprocket set but it was on a street bike. Quality looked great but as for durability I don't have any feedback for you.

-Sal

Thanks Sal.

I've used an AFAN front sprocket on my DSR for years. No sign of unusual wear.

Coop is right. Your chain is probably 78 (maybe 80). If you expect to be doing this for any length of time, you might want to order chain in bulk lengths so that you don't have to be piecing together "leftovers" from 120 link packages. Some manufacturers do sell 160 link packages (which would work for you). I've gotten bulk chain from http://www.moto-chains.com/ although they don't show it on their web site. Call them and they will send you whatever you need.

Dave

Thanks Dave.

[glenn cooper]

Actually... The chain will have an uneven amount of links and when the master is installed it then becomes a complete chain w/ an even # of links.

New car on order? No.

BTW - I still have a 25' roll of the RX 530 XSO X-ring chain I run, sellin' it for $1.00/link, inc's free master link, just add shipping from 30076
GC

[RussMcB]

When I was looking for the strongest chain available 3 years ago, it seemed to be RK GB530GXW:

http://www.rkexcelamerica.com/rk_cha...25_530gxw.html

Mine have always looked good, but replaced occasionally for peace of mind.

[carnut169]

When I was looking for the strongest chain available 3 years ago, it seemed to be RK GB530GXW:

http://www.rkexcelamerica.com/rk_cha...25_530gxw.html

Mine have always looked good, but replaced occasionally for peace of mind.

X2 I never has any issues with the GXW chain. Sprocket Specialists was where I got my rear sprockets...


http://www.sprocketspecialists.com/

[Wren]

Plan to replace your chain more often than it needs to be replaced. It can do an impressive amount of damage if it does let go. Kind of like sticking the back half of your car into a 170HP bush hog.

[Ivinsea]

I finally had a failure last Sat at the NJMP member day when my chain broke. I was afraid to remove the engine cover, expecting to see the beautifully-machined spar and LR a-arm and maybe the engine case wiped out, but incredibly the stock Suzuki sprocket cover retained the chain! The cover was blown to bits, alu chunks everywhere, but the chassis and engine were not even scratched.
Of course I left the spare chain and chain riveter in the shop, but my father made the run to fetch the parts and I missed only one session. Won't happen again!

I ordered a 160 link EK 530ZZZ chain from moto-chains. They said it is the strongest X-ring chain available.

A new 3-piece sprocket cpver was $150 so I bought a used one on Ebay for $30 delivered.

[Wren]

How many events on that chain?

[Ivinsea]

How many events on that chain?

Wren,
The chain came with my car which did not have much time on it. I had driven it 5 times approx 4 sessions = 20 sessions.

The car had maybe 20 sessions on it before , so maybe that is too much time.

[glenn cooper]

(btw - how did that ever come to mean anything!)
is to replace the chain after 4 weekends.
Inspect each roller after every on track session, looking for pitting / split rollers / missing rollers, etc.
Keep it adjusted correctly (ask 5 people, get 5 different adjustment methods), and lubed (2 people, 3 methods!), n' it should go 4 weeknds no problem.

[Ananth K]

Just out of curiosity, do you guys use a riveted master link or a clip-type? If the latter, has anyone experienced chain failure at the clip?

[formulasuper]

(btw - how did that ever come to mean anything!)
is to replace the chain after 4 weekends.
Inspect each roller after every on track session, looking for pitting / split rollers / missing rollers, etc.
Keep it adjusted correctly (ask 5 people, get 5 different adjustment methods), and lubed (2 people, 3 methods!), n' it should go 4 weeknds no problem.

It is likely that it refers to one of the numerous ways that thumbs have been used to estimate things - judging the alignment or distance of an object by holding the thumb in one's eye-line, the temperature of brews of beer, measurement of an inch from the joint to the nail to the tip, or across the thumb, etc.

[Ivinsea]

Just out of curiosity, do you guys use a riveted master link or a clip-type? If the latter, has anyone experienced chain failure at the clip?

A riveted master link is essential. Everyone says a clip in a no-no.

[RussMcB]

I've only heard of one guy (DSR racer) say publicly that he uses (or used) clip type master link retainers. I assume almost every DSR/FB racer has purchased the good ($100) rivet tool and uses them.

[lancer360]

I use 530VM chain made by DID on my F600. I only use rivet master links. I had my first chain failure a couple of weeks ago at CMP after 26 sessions over 5 events. Luckily the chain didn't come apart. It was my chain between the engine and my jackshaft. I heard the chain ratcheting on the gears first and let off. After checking the chain out in the paddock, it was completely blued and most of the x-rings were scattered all over the engine bay. With the engine proximity to the rear axle, my car has to use a jack shaft. This forces us to have a short chain (around 50 links) connecting the engine to the jack shaft running over a 17 tooth and 18 tooth sprocket. I suspect the failure was multiple issues.

1. Heat from the header proximity to the jack shaft end of the chain with no heat shield.
2. The short length of the chain.
3. Running the chain over two small sprockets.

For now I am going to only install the heat shield and see how much that helps. I am going to start measuring the chain pin distance when new and record its change in length each event. I would have thought that the chain manufacturers would have a guideline based on chain stretch as to when to replace the chain, but I haven't found one. I know on my bicycle I had a tool specifically for checking that.

Has anyone else monitored chain stretch as a guideline to replacing the chain?

[RussMcB]

Chris, your list of three things is pretty good. I cuncur with them. You should also verify sprocket alignment.

And maybe if you run the chain tight that might lead to extra heat and eary failure.

I don't now about measuring for chain stretch, but, can you just see how much additional slackness there is over time? In my expereince (and from others), you usually only need to adjust tension once after a new chain has been run in. Then it seems to stabilize.

I don't have any experience with running chains for a long time. I've been paranoid and changed them after a few races.

[jerry freeman]

I'll be the second person to publicly say I used clip master links until this year. Never had any problems. As always, I'm not running as fast as the DSR and FB front runners.

To be honest with you I had the clip come off one time because I put it in the wrong direction and it would touch a frame rail and the thing stayed on for the entire race. Thanks God!

No Russ, not all of us have the special tool to install the rivit links. A punch and a BFH work just fine.

I run chains 8-10 weekends unless they start to stretch after the initial tightening.

Jerry

[lancer360]

Chris, your list of three things is pretty good. I cuncur with them. You should also verify sprocket alignment.

And maybe if you run the chain tight that might lead to extra heat and eary failure.

I don't now about measuring for chain stretch, but, can you just see how much additional slackness there is over time? In my expereince (and from others), you usually only need to adjust tension once after a new chain has been run in. Then it seems to stabilize.

I don't have any experience with running chains for a long time. I've been paranoid and changed them after a few races.

Yea, I forgot to mention checking the alignment. I checked it visually at the track and it looked ok, but I'm going to put a straight edge on it before I put the new chain on. These engine and the jackshaft sprockets are fixed and designed with the right amount of chain tension so I don't have to sweat it too much. The outer chain from the jack shaft to the rear axle is the one I have to adjust each time I swap chain/gear ratios depending on the track.

One reason on bicycles to measure chain stretch is to help prolong the life of your sprockets. As the chain wears and stretches it puts more wear and tear on the sprocket teeth wearing them thinner. Then if you change the chain and not the sprockets, the worn sprockets will cause premature wear of the new chain. From some general reading on some motorcycle sites, it sounds like many people will change the sprockets out every other chain.

[RussMcB]

<snip> These engine and the jackshaft sprockets are fixed and designed with the right amount of chain tension so I don't have to sweat it too much.

This caught my attention. Can you elaborate? I'm wondering how you're able to get the correct tension. Idler sprocket?

[lancer360]

When Jay Novak designed it, he did the calculations to determine the optimum center to center distance on those two sprockets. The chain has a little bit of slack in it once installed. I do all of my gear changes with the outer sprockets connecting the jack shaft to rear axle so I don't ever screw with the inner drive chain and sprockets.

[JakeL]

In case it helps, I put together a "chain info" page a while back with the best knowledge I had, it may be useful. chain brands, breaker brands, lube, tensioning, sprockets, etc.

http://www.jakelatham.com/radical/info/chaininfo.shtml

anybody care to add/edit/elaborate, I'm all ears.

-Jake

[lancer360]

I just talked with a distributor of DID chain and he had some good info on chains. His first advice was to run odd number sprockets both front and rear. This makes the same link of chain not hit the same tooth every revolution. Next best would be one odd one even. As far as when to replace the chain, he said it would be based on chain stretch. With the chain installed and properly tensioned, try to pull the chain away from the large rear sprocket in the middle of the wrap. If you can pull the chain off the sprocket enough to see daylight between the chain and sprocket then it is time for a new chain. I'm going to see if I can correlate this to a measurement taken between roller say over a 5 links or so. This is because the chain pulling away from the sprocket only applies to the typical large sprocket on rear, not the two small sprockets I run on the counter-shaft to jack shaft.

He also recommended only cleaning the chain by wiping it down with a clean rag and not to use any type of solvent. Then apply a chain lube to the chain after you come in from each session while the chain is still warm.

I pointed out that I thought using 530 chain with a stock 600 was over kill and said not really. Compared to a motorcycle, we have a lot of grip and virtually no tire slip. This allows us to put down more power more often dramatically increasing the duty cycle on the chain. His only other suggestion was to step up from the 530VM chain I am currently using to the DID 530ZVM-X chain which had improved strength and wear.

[New F1000 Guy]

OK new question for me, probably old question for you all. I have an R1 and am new to the F1000 car. I am in the Northwest and will be running tracks like Portland, Thunderhill and ORP in Oregon. What gears am I looking at buying? I don't want to buy the entire gammut and start guessing. Any guidance would be appreciated.

[Mike B]

What year R1?

I have a gear chart for the '07 that can help you determine top speed/RPM in each gear. Guys that run those tracks can then help you work backwards based on their top speeds.

[RobLav]

Buy 2 sprockets:
- One 15 tooth front
- One 46 tooth rear

That will get you around almost everywhere except the really fast tracks.

One additional 16 tooth front will get you about 10 MPH more.


I had these while I ran in F1000:

Front: 15, 16
Rear: 44, 46, 48

One front tooth is worth about 10 MPH. One rear tooth is slightly more then 3 MPH. That should be about all you'll need everywhere.