FB National Car Count?

[jerry freeman]

Don't bag on the regional guys to bad. Some of us had no choice on nationals. If it didn't take FOREVER for low budget racers to get a "national" license there would already be more cars on track at the nationals. And no I don't want to start the licensing procedure thread over again. Just have to live with it.

Jerry

[Stan Clayton]

Not to worry, Jerry...nobody's bagging on the Regional guys.

[CSHAW]

That's the germ of a great idea, Gian Carlo! We gotta work on incentivizing FBs to switch to Nationals.

Stan, I think incentive is there because the cars do have a great deal of appeal but I sense a hesitation based on many questioning if the class will make national status before making the big investment. It is the enthusiasm that is openly demonstrated by those that are in the show currently that is responsible for the stimulation in the class that is present now.

[Stan Clayton]

...many questioning if the class will make national status...

That's exactly why I was talking about "incentivizing" those who can to switch to Nationals...so the class DOES qualify for National status within its 5-year window.

Obviously, there are those who cannot enter Nationals, and my comments aren't aimed at them.

It's all good!

[Richard Dziak]

While I fully understand the desire to have the FB Class as a National Class for 2010 and the National Run-off events....I would NOT get your hopes up. If it happens great, if not, there's always another year.

I have written here on ApexSpeed in the past about the economics of racing and the present economic situation that many Americans are faced with, even our own racers.

There have been many posts here in our own FB forum, about owner/drivers that have been effected by job losses, extra expenses etc. that effect the racing schedule. Several owner/drivers have reecntly commented about not being able to make the ARRC race for 2009 due to economic constraints. It is fully understandable. If it was not for a long tow and exessive costs to attend the ARRC I would be there.

We must all realize that racing takes disposable income in order to cover the expenses. While we all love the sport, love the class, we must realize that it's plain economics that have affected attendence.

Case in point: The Arizona SCCA Region just began their 2009-2010 season, Opening race at Phoeninx International Raceway, a premier track. 3 open wheel cars........that's it. That attendence alone should tell a story.

I seriously doubt that we will see any major improvements in economic conditions within our country in 2010. There are several reasons to believe that we could fall back into a double dip recessionary environment. If that happens, even the racers with the deepest pockets will pull back. Car counts are down in most and possibly in every class within the SCCA ranks.

As for the regional racers, we are out to enjoy the sport, our cars, and our passion to have a good time. Yes, I could attend Nationals, but feel so much more comfortable in the regional racing environment. It's more relaxed. I don't feel that I should be asked to go out and spend extra money and travel extra distances in order to please a few owner/drivers who want to have the National Class. It will happen. If owner/drivers find that they have extra funds to employ for racing, and can spend the time to travel further, and bare the extra expense, then we will meet our goals.

My predictions about economic conditions that I have written about here on ApexSpeed have come true. Economics, finances, and investments is my profession. We ready have seen many FB's for sale right here on ApexSpeed. I understand that the major constructors, Stohr, Firman, Phoenix are not getting orders. It's the economy, plain and simple.

So we must exercise patience, and must try to fully understand that economic conditions for all the owner/drivers that are different from each other. What is most important is that we continue to create interest in our class, we keep the friends and commrodiary that has been built here on ApexSpeed. We help other owner/drivers when we can. We promote the class when we can. We enjoy time that we get to race and on the track.

The FB Class will have a National Event class, when the time is right. No one driver or words will make it happen. It will take time, Patience everyone. You still have the June Sprints, the ARRC and there are several other venues that FB owner/drivers can and do enjoy. The SCCA organization is NOT the only venue available for us. The costs to attend an SCCA Run-off event is excessive and most likely unaffordable to the average racer.

Thanks for reading........your time and understanding is greatly appreciated.

[glenn cooper]

Maybe I'm not reading or comprehending correctly, maybe you guys are implying that we will be a National class only when we get to go the Runoffs?

What we are trying to do more than anything else is comply with the "5 Year Plan" as outlined a few years back by SCCA, which basically states that we have 5 years to get the numbers above the 2.5 car average per National race, or lose the Nat status and go Reg'l only.
We are currently at the end of year 2.
Hitting the number in 2010 will grant us a Runoffs berth at Rd Am for the 2011 Runoffs, just 1 year prior to the Mayan calculated end of it all. Sweet!!

Getting to go to the Runoffs as one of the Top 24 classes from the previous year's Nat participation #'s would be icing on the cake.

At this point we are merely trying to reach the goal stated above.
THEN we can concern ourselves with things like the Runoffs.

Here's an idea: Any Regional FB guys that want to run a National can be "mentored" by one of your more experienced brethren. A win-win. Help get the numbers up, recieve free coaching, advise, help, whatever.
I'll start the ball rolling and will be available to anyone running the FLA Winter Nat's.
Only requirement is that you have never run a National in the past.

GC

[Stan Clayton]

Just to clarify, attaining the 2.5 per race average qualifies a class not only as National, but also gains the class an invitation to the following year's Runoffs, per 3.9.2.F.:

F. Invited Runoffs Classes
Only those classes which have attained an average of 2.5 cars or better per event, as outlined in GCR 9.1.12, in the previous year of national racing activity, shall be invited to the following year’s runoffs; effective for the 2009 runoffs, based on 2008 results.

Also, per 9.1.12.Note 2.:

Note 2: For the purposes of this section, GTL shall be considered a new class from 2005, T3 and Spec Miata from 2006, and STO, STU, FE, and Formula 1000 from 2007.

FB has just completed its third season as a National class. There is only this coming year and the following to qualify before merger or relegation to Regional status looms.

[jjstecher]

Here's an idea: Any Regional FB guys that want to run a National can be "mentored" by one of your more experienced brethren. A win-win. Help get the numbers up, recieve free coaching, advise, help, whatever.
I'll start the ball rolling and will be available to anyone running the FLA Winter Nat's.
Only requirement is that you have never run a National in the past.

GC

So you wont mentor me then you bastard...I see how you roll. See ya at Homestead on New Years eve my man.

[glenn cooper]

the mentoring is "clothing optional"?

Hmmmmmmm, d'in think so...

GC

[Brandon Dixon]

Just to clarify, attaining the 2.5 per race average qualifies a class not only as National, but also gains the class an invitation to the following year's Runoffs, per 3.9.2.F.:
Also, per 9.1.12.Note 2.:
FB has just completed its third season as a National class. There is only this coming year and the following to qualify before merger or relegation to Regional status looms.

I'm not sure that everyone is paying enough attention here.

This thread about an F1000 pro series is an example:

Before I go off, what events are the "current pro series organizer here on the West Coast" running with?
If it's run in conjunction with SCCA Nationals then I'm all for it.
If it's run in conjunction with anything else, then I'll go off.

I'm with Mike on this issue. If we F1000 guys don't pay enough attention to the National participation numbers, then pro series or not, the class will not likely survive.

We have 2 years to get our numbers up.

That is 2010 and 2011. Otherwise we are a regional only class, and while there are some people that are happy with that, I'll hazard a guess that the majority of owners are not. I believe that many, if not most, of the drivers that are running cars now would find another class to play in if FB becomes a regional only class.

We need to be figuring out how we are going to get an additional 70 or so national entries next year. This will be no small feat as we had a total of 107 entries this year. We need a 66% increase in participation.

I'd like to propose that next year's ARRC race contain a "restricted National" for FB and any other class looking to boost their National participation numbers. This is a new concept in the GCR, I believe. Is this a possiblilty?

I'm planning on attending the January Quad National as well. What can I and the F1000 community do to attract people to this event?

[Mike B]

I'd like to propose that next year's ARRC race contain a "restricted National" for FB and any other class looking to boost their National participation numbers. This is a new concept in the GCR, I believe. Is this a possiblilty?

This was one of the things I struggled with when putting together the F1000 Championship. While we need a showcase event to wrap up the season, holding it at the ARRC contradicts the goal of the F1000 Championship (to increase national participation, for those not paying attention.) If it could become a restricted national, it might be an even bigger event than it already is. Can some official-type chime in on the feasibility? Could we do it this year?

I'm planning on attending the January Quad National as well. What can I and the F1000 community do to attract people to this event?

I plan to do the F1000 Championship hopefully presented by George Dean Racing Engines and Taylor Race Engineering yet again in 2010. I have a few ideas to tweak the points formula but am all ears on other methods to convince guys to come out, especially to those double events that could really give us a shot in the arm.

[Stan Clayton]

I have a few ideas to tweak the points formula but am all ears on other methods to convince guys to come out, especially to those double events that could really give us a shot in the arm.

How about awarding double-points at a double-National in each Division? Like one of the Quad races in Florida to start off the season. Here are a few doubles I know of:

Thunderhill in March (NorPac)
Buttonwillow in April (SoPac)
Miller in August (RMDiv)

[jjstecher]

I think every Rmount division national is a double.

I think instituting a tow fund to all double nationals would be awesome versus giving a large lump of cash away at each of the sprints, ARRC, etc.

Why not screw the ARRC and have the F1k championship at the RA race before the Run offs or some late in the year double national.

[RussMcB]

Brandon's suggestion about restricted nationals is perfect. I think it was a great catch on his part to notice that new option in the GCR. Not only would that help FB national numbers with the huge turn out at the ARRC, there's no reason why it could not be used at other popular regional races, too.

[Dave Gomberg]

First, the Restricted National provision is not exactly new (it has been in the GCR since 2007).

Second, to quote:

3.1.4. Restricted Nationals
Restricted Nationals are experimental events developed by the National
Office under the auspices of the Director, Club Racing. These events may
include semi-Pro events during a National, and or fewer National classes
than those listed in the GCR.

This is not a region option. Such events are at the discretion of the Director of Club Racing. That isn't to say it couldn't be done, but there would have to be a case made for doing this.

Dave

[Mike B]

There's almost $5000 up for grabs at this year's ARRC. Doesn't that make it at least a semi-pro event?

[Northwind]

I believe it certainly would!!!!!!

Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

[RussMcB]

I'm sure it's too late for asking if the 2009 ARRC could be considered a restricted national.

Someone (one of you go-getters) should contact the Director of Club Racing and tell them what we'd like to do, find out the criteria, etc. I'd also get Butch Kummer involved (ARRC organizer). He would be a great person to help determine the best way to approach HQ with the request.

More than likely, they'll be open to the idea. This is probably what they had in mind when they decided to add it to the GCR. I can't think of any down sides or reasons why it wouldn't fly.

[Purple Frog]

Butch would be the one to contact Terry Ozmets about such things.
Might not happen this week though.

[Stan Clayton]

Couple of things to keep in mind...

3.2.2.F. No National races shall be scheduled after Labor Day weekend.

Second, the Club may well hesitate before setting a precedent for one class by scheduling a special, that-class-only National race to help it attain or retain National status. That is a road they may not wish to go down.

Just race within the National race structure and earn your National status the normal way.

[Brandon Dixon]

Our 2009 national participation numbers are too low to matter this year, so I don't see any reason to attempt any last millisecond changes to the ARRC.

Now if we could try to make it a 2010 National... but in many ways I agree with Stan that we just need to go out and run National events next year and make the numbers.

New cars and drivers are coming to the class every month, but I don't think that it's going to be easy for us to make 2.5 in 2010. I'm going to do what I can myself and encourage others any way that I can.

[Mike B]

Isn't there a national in Phoenix in early December?

[Stan Clayton]

The Club did approve Arizona's request several times to hold their January National in the preceding month, but I understand that last year's race was the last one the Club will approve.

[Richard Dziak]

Mike B....

As a paid member of the Arizona SCCA Region, races have been scheduled only to years end.....2009. They are all Regional Events. The AZ SCCA Region usually hosts a large event, entitled the "SnowBird Nationals" held in January. As of this date there are NO events scheduled for 2010 yet, but will be forthcoming.

Consult the AZ website at:

http://www.azscca.com/

[Mike B]

I guess last year was just a one-time deal.

Thanks for clarifying.