Another rule oversight

[R. Pare]

H.9.A in the FB rules apparently was copied directly from the FF section of the rules book. In FF, magnesium is not allowed in the construction of the uprights. In FC, the is a specific provision for such allowance.

I would suggest that this be corrected as an oversight, as most, if not all, VDs that are eligable for conversion (or have already been converted) have Mag uprights.

[RobLav]

I agree Richard. Our intent was to use the FC rules.

[Dave Gomberg]

The CRB has already received a request to fix this. It will be considered in the near future.

Dave

[R. Pare]

Good. I hope that they act quickly- there are probably quite a few cars out there already that are running illegally!

[Wren]

were any mygales even made with an aluminum upright?

[Chas Shaffer]

H.9.A in the FB rules apparently was copied directly from the FF section of the rules book. In FF, magnesium is not allowed in the construction of the uprights. In FC, the is a specific provision for such allowance.

I would suggest that this be corrected as an oversight, as most, if not all, VDs that are eligable for conversion (or have already been converted) have Mag uprights.

I've owned 5 VD's (models 1997 - 2000) and unless I don't know the difference between mag and aluminum (black vs shiny silver) I'm pretty sure none of them had magnesium uprights. The 98 and newer cars came with mag oil tanks but thats the only mag I'm aware of on the car. Were the pre 97 VD's or are the brand new VD's equipped with mag uprights?

If mag uprights are available for my car can someone tell me where to get them?

[Chas Shaffer]

Here's what I have on my 2000 VD which is basically the same as the 1997. It was my understanding that the rears were used up until at least 2006. There is a newer style front upright from 2001 on but it's still the same material. Isn't that aluminum? As I recall my Ralt RT 40 had mag uprights and the material looked very different.

[Rick Kirchner]

chas my 1994 FC has mag uprights. The RF is aluminum but that corner was replaced once.

[RobLav]

My RF96 had mag uprights. I was told it was an option.

[Brandon Dixon]

OK, I'm the one that wrote the letter to the CRB that started this one. Aligning the suspension rules with the FC rules seems the obvious thing to do. There are plenty of FC cars out there with mag uprights and probably some owners that don't know what material theirs are made from.


The other request that I made of the CRB was to look at the materials allowed in the chassis section (H.2.E) (copied below) :

[SIZE=1]E. Brackets for mounting components, such as the engine, transmission, suspension pickups, instruments, clutch and brake components, and body panels may be nonferrous, of any shape, and fastened to the frame in any manner.


This rule allows any material to be used for the typical components of the car aft of the roll hoop. It doesn't require the parts to be metal (could be carbon fiber), it it could be a huge machined up titanium fabrication. I don't think that the intent of the class is to allow this. I'd like to see this rule clarified to include any traditional FC type of construction, i.e. aluminum or magnesium components.

My letter to the CRB was listed as tabled for further research, so let your CRB or FSRAC members have your input, and lets get these rules clarified.
[/SIZE]

[Chas Shaffer]

I see no reason not to allow mag uprights i just wasn't aware of a VD since 1997 to have them. It's interesting that VD stopped making them 11 years ago. I wonder why.

[Wren]

-material is expensive
-storing it can be a nightmare, there's always a possibility for making the evening news
-machining it is a nightmare
-skunky coolant
-chips can auto-ignite and mag fires are hard to put out(they will burn harder if you pour water on them, and can go straight through the machines castings)
-same possibility for making the evening news
-most shops charge a decent nuisance factor for machining it
-corrosion can be an issue
-it can require a redesign b/c of different material properties

[R. Pare]

It's interesting that VD stopped making them 11 years ago. I wonder why.

The reason is easy : Profit Margin

[carnut169]

Pretty sure my 96 has mag uprights.

[Mike Devins]

the fast track is out and mag uprights are now specifally allowed.


Item 5. (FB) Effective 11/1/08: Change section 9.1.1.H.2.E as follows: Brackets for mounting components, such as the engine, transmission, suspension pickups, instruments, clutch and brake components, and body panels may be nonferrous ferrous, aluminum alloy, or magnesium alloy of any shape, and fastened to the frame in any manner.

Item 6. (FB) Effective 11/1/08: Change section 9.1.1.H.9.A as follows: All suspension components shall be of steel or ferrous material, except that hubs, hub adapters, hub carriers, bell cranks, pivot blocks, bearings and bushings, spring caps, abutment nuts, anti-roll bar links, shock absorber caps, and nuts may be aluminum alloy or magnesium

Also the following item is not recomended:

1. FB – Do not include endplates in the front wing length (4 letters). The recent clarification is correct as written.

[Dave Gomberg]

To be clear: those are recommendations that will be effective 11/1/08 if approved by the BoD.

Dave

[Wren]

so it hasn't been changed yet?

Is there going to be a gentlemen's agreement not to protest the illegal cars?

[cparsons]

I hope so. The change doesn't affect me personally, but since the rules for the class are a little more "dynamic" right now it seems to be a fair and reasonable thing to do. Once again, thank you to all the people who worked their hearts out to make this class viable.

[Messenger Racing]

Don't know yet how many races I will run this year in F1000 trim but I certainly would support such an agreement.

Jay Messenger
Messenger MX1 F1000

[RussMcB]

To be clear: those are recommendations that will be effective 11/1/08 if approved by the BoD.

Dave

I wonder why it wouldn't be affective immediately upon approval by the BOD. Seems odd that it would be delayed to November 1. What's the reasoning behind that?

Just curious.