One more FB coming

[Mike Devins]

Well both clark and I hit the chassis' ths week with the "saws all". Both chassis are RF95's, mine will be an FB and Clarks will be a DSR. All of the chassis changes will be the same.

Based on the experience that I had with the earlier RF98 conersion that I did for Mike Sirianni I am going to go ahead and fixture everything this time so that it can be easily duplicated.

Sean, do you have a car count for FB based on your roll call and other tracking from other builders? I figure that it will take approx 60 cars actively running nationals in order to get into the top 24. A friend took the time to review the number of FF's that were running nationals and found just over 100 and that they ageraged just under 4 races per car.

We need to have somewhere in the 250 to 260 count to be there in 08.

http://www.scca.com/documents/Club_E...ion_MASTER.pdf

[Stan Clayton]

Sixth ranked FF had 109 drivers who entered at least one National (402 total entries) this year, averaging 3.7 entries apiece. In contrast, SSC was ranked 24th with 57 total drivers and 244 entries (average 4.3 entries). There were 2809 drivers across all National classes, who averaged 3.6 entries. Based on that snapshot, I'd say that to be "safe" a class needs 70 racers averaging 4 entries, or about 280 total.

Watching the National participation numbers this year was interesting. Some classes that were strong early in the year, e.g., CSR and GT3 faded badly as the summer wore on. That's because those classes were strong in the South and West, where the National races are clustered early (all done by early June). Meanwhile classes strong in the northern tier States (MW and NE), like SSC, came on strongly June-August as they realized that they may not make the cut.

The problem with heroic efforts is that it may be difficult to sustain them. In other words, there is no substitute for numbers when it comes to being safely in the Runoffs. In the biggest class, SM, the drivers are "lazy", entering just 3.1 races on average. In contrast, T1 was the smallest class to make the Runoffs, with just 45 drivers, but they averaged 5.5 races apiece. With FB being a "economy" formula class, better to have strong numbers than strong personal participation.

Based on what I read here, I'm guessing that FB will have about 30 cars at the start of the season. It will be nearly impossible to break into the top 24 with those numbers, so I recommend the class members concentrate on getting more cars on track by maxing out participation at selected races. Adding cars builds the base, while big numbers at important races gets the class lots of positive attention. It's a virtuous circle.

Stan

[Matt Conrad]

Stan,

After pouring over the numbers for a while yesterday, I'm also a bit concerned about an FB Runoffs race for 2009....but I do hope the "newness" of the class, and a big push by the "early adoptors" will get us where we need to go....while more and more new cars are being built in the meantime.

Can you clarify how the participation numbers are derived? Is it based on "entries", "starts", or "official finishes"? I thought a car that is listed as a DNS doesn't count....but a car that starts and is a DNF counts....but someone has told me they thought you had to be an "official finisher" to count.

Matt Conrad
Phoenix Race Works, LLC

[Stan Clayton]

From page 75 of the 2008 GCR...

"Note 1: For the purposes of this section, “entrants” shall be defined as drivers classified in the final official race results of National races as finishers, did-not-finish (DNF), or disqualified (DQ). Drivers classified as did-not-start (DNS) shall not count as entrants."

Stan

[Sean Maisey]

Mike,

I am hoping that the "Roll Call" thread will give us some raw material to begin to compile an updated driver's register. Mike B. has one on Formula1000.com, but many more people frequent Apexspeed, so I am hoping that we can hit this from multiple angles...

As far as car count, I think that Stan is right. Approximately 30 cars should be active at the start of the 2008 season. Wayne told me at the ARRC that they have sold 18 Stohr F1000s. I can come up with more than a dozen planned or existing Van Diemen Conversions. Add in Phoenix, Speads, Piper and the one-offs and it might well be more than 30 cars total.

Sean

[WFelch]

Sean,

Our latest count is now twenty one, although all customers do not run SCCA events. There has to be over thirty cars.

Wayne

[Mike B]

Sean,

Our latest count is now twenty one, although all customers do not run SCCA events. There has to be over thirty cars.

Wayne

Wayne,
I understand your customers have varying levels of confidentiality. With their permission, would you be able to provide a list of current owners with contact info (offline)? This is a critical time for F1000 and we'll need the cooperation of everyone that has an interest to help it grow.
Thanks!

[carnut169]

Mike D- glad to hear you will be joining us! You will absolutely love the car. Like night and day better once converted.

[Lincspeed]

What the hell - if F1000 doesn't make it to the Runoffs - you end up with your own "runoffs" at a real race track. What's the worry...

IMHO, Clark

[Mike B]

What the hell - if F1000 doesn't make it to the Runoffs - you end up with your own "runoffs" at a real race track. What's the worry...

IMHO, Clark

Good point. On second thought, let's do our best to raise the participation level to 25th.
I much prefer a 4 day championship over a 10 day championship.

[996kyle]

You can ADD one more to the list,...

My name is Kyle Oberndorf, I have been racing in the Northwest for the past 4 seasons in ICSCC with my 1977 Crossle Club Ford. I have had a great time there and will continue to support ICSCC this and years to come.
I have a Stohr on order and if all goes well it will be ready for the first Double National at Thunderhill March 13th.

Looking forward to meeting everyone in 2008 and bringing more people to FB through word of mouth and some awesome wheel to wheel battles.

Cheers
Kyle

[bryancohnracing]

There is a way to work the system to get the numbers needed.
FM did it when they gained National status. FB can do it too.

Concentrate efforts in areas with the highest car counts. One guy racing alone hurts more than it helps.
Get 5-6 cars to a majority of Nationals in the "Big Divisions" (SE, NE, CE, GL, and maybe SP)
and you can work the numbers from there.

If each of the 30 (guessing at car count on March 1) raced in 6 Nationals thats 180 entries. Your not that far off.

The point is this: A small group can make the numbers if they are dedicated to that as a primary goal. Work the current system!

Look at GTL and how they work together to match cars, drivers, races etc to make their numbers. Got a car but only a Regional license? Then you ought to put a National driver in the seat!

I've got no iron in the fire other than seeing a neat class/car concept work out for the best.

[Sean Maisey]

The Piper post this afternoon reminded me that the numbers are looking better and better for F1000.

I had forgotten to include the Citations (sorry guys) in my original estimate. Assuming the ARRC results add a few Pipers to the ranks, we could defintely be approaching 40-50 cars before the end of the winter...

Sean

P.S. for those who haven't posted there yet, please add your info the the "Roll Call" post...

[RussMcB]

Well both clark and I hit the chassis' ths week with the "saws all". Both chassis are RF95's, mine will be an FB and Clarks will be a DSR. All of the chassis changes will be the same.

Mike, how far along are you with the conversions?

(I think I know the answer :-).

[Mike Devins]

Well Russ,

I am about 80 percent complete with the design for the rear sub-frame, for the third time.

Per our conversation that makes it 240% complete.

All joking aside the plan is to start welding in a few weeks.

[Stan Clayton]

Mike, I believe that qualifies as 90% complete...and 90% to go!