IRL Pro FF2000 series

[HazelNut]

In 2005 I think, while the Cooper F2000 series (the successor to my series) was still operating, the F2000 Championship Series started up and drivers had a choice where to race. The Cooper series folded a year later. Seems to me the marketplace will decide how many series it wants to support, and which ones will survive.

so basically what you're saying is that you're trying to split up the fields until your series kills off the other series and you're using your IRL connection as muscle to do it. Then once you've won out you can then move the rules forward and remove parity between the various pro series and clubs again in the hope that the new pro series rules will be adopted by the lower levels and lead to car trickle down.

I agree that working with the IRL is good, however fractionalizing the current field isn't.

Instead of creating a competing series why don't you put effort and some dollars (or is it krone and lutefisk?) into trying to build up the current series and increase it's profile from within? Or can your ego not handle being a team player?

[Dan Andersen]

so basically what you're saying is that you're trying to split up the fields until your series kills off the other series and you're using your IRL connection as muscle to do it. Then once you've won out you can then move the rules forward and remove parity between the various pro series and clubs again in the hope that the new pro series rules will be adopted by the lower levels and lead to car trickle down.

I agree that working with the IRL is good, however fractionalizing the current field isn't.

Instead of creating a competing series why don't you put effort and some dollars (or is it krone and lutefisk?) into trying to build up the current series and increase it's profile from within? Or can your ego not handle being a team player?

That is completely not true, nor can a reasonable person derive that from my posts. Not really worth debating however, since you have already made your decision about me and my series.

[Wren]

Then once you've won out you can then move the rules forward and remove parity between the various pro series and clubs again in the hope that the new pro series rules will be adopted by the lower levels and lead to car trickle down.

When Dan sold the last series, wasn't it still club spec? I know he has said he is looking into alternate engines though.

I could see the series surviving together. The current F2000 series represents a really good value to a lot of people in one region of the country and that is unlikely to change. I don't think that the F2000 championship series was the main cause of failure for the other F2000 series.

Dan- how soon will you have a schedule out?

The real burning question on everyone's mind is what brake calipers will be legal?

[Franklin Futrelle]

sure all three series may survive but i have a feeling that all series will be effected from a series sponsor stand point. will it be hard to find series fuel, tire, etc. sponsors with three different series with all the same rules running? if there where 3 nascar series i think sponsorship would be harder to come by for all.

[HazelNut]

We will accept entries for 2010 from all FC legal cars, and we will announce soon what the restrictions will be for 2011, so teams can see where we are headed with this series. There will not be a new spec car for 2010 or 2011, nor do I see us moving away from the tube frame design anytime soon. We will move slowly and deliberately to allow teams to function and survive,

that sounds like a rules change of some sort in 2012. It could be big one, it could be small, however it is a rules change.

When my team ran F2000 in 2008, we ran "box-stock" Van Diemens without any of the aero updates that are out there, but if the competition forced us to, we would have had to spend the dollars to try everything for the sake of our customers.

Box Stock? Weren't you the "Van Diemen factory team" with access to the "box stock" aero bits before any other teams?

For some reason, some people keep bringing up the Elan intake situation, which always confuses me because my only participation in that was as a potential customer IF Elan got it approved. I had no other interest,

See previous comments about being the van diemen aka elan factory team.

As to engines, the current Zetec engine will be legal, and we may be introducing an alternate engine as well.

sounds like another possible rules change.

I'm ok with eventual rules changes. In fact I like the idea of multiple engines in F2000, I've been wanting to squash a mercedes 4-banger into a van diemen for a while. However it needs to be done in a way to maintain compatability with other series so we can increase fields overall, not create multiple similar but unique and ill-subscribed formulas. So perhaps work with scca to keep rules homogenious throughout. If this means creation of an standardized SCCA process (yeah we all know SCCA rules changes are slow and difficult, but it is doable) by which new engines/rules can be phased into the existing and thriving pro series but allow proper trickle down to a club class, so be it.

[Matt King]

Dan, or anyone else for that matter, could you please give me one example in the last 13 years of American motorsports where the creation of a competing series positively affected the health of that sport?

Yes. The introduction of street-car type drag racing organizations such as the NMRA, NMCA, PRO and ADRL has greatly increased the popularity and participation in grassroots drag racing. Ever watch an episode of Pinks All Out? They get 10,000 fans in the stands to watch a couple hundred amateur drag racers battle it out.

[greg pizzo]

seems people's memories are not so sharp ....... didnt the CURRENT east series BUY cleavaland out from under the then COOPER Series and that then spelled the end of the Cooper series ????.... just because they wanted to run clubbie rules??.... The Cooper series had a CAR that was solid and CHEAPISH to run .... the "NEW SERIES" then took that away and replace it for a lot more OPEN set of rules that allows all the "AERO bits of the week".... granted I PERSONALLY like to OPEN rules BUT does it make it CHEAPER to run ... no way ...After running a set of rules that limited the developement of all the bits .... I have found ther are merits to it .... saves $$$ racing still is racing ... either way the cars a GREAT cars to drive and race ...

I was forunate to run a few times in both DAN's origional series and then the Copper series ... and I can say with out a doubt both made me better and was the best times in the car ... AND with out HIS series I would have NEVER been able to be driving a current spec Zetec... if HIS new series becomes what it was back then again GREAT !! it will certainlly NOT HURT FF2000 RACING in the US ..........

one last thing ... racing will NEVER be 100% fair for everyone that attempts to don a helmet !! .... get used to it .. if you allow it to, being around better competitors only makes YOU better ....thank God RACING is still not a "100% level, even for everyone" endoevor

thankyou AGAIN Dan for yet another round of improvement !!!

[brent_borland]

In the 1990's, we started with the USAC F2000 series at the same time as SCCA started with their American Continental Championship for F2000 cars. After two years of having both series, the ACC was folded into ours. The Hooters F2000 Championship then started up offering huge prize money, and after two years they folded their tents. In 2005 I think, while the Cooper F2000 series (the successor to my series) was still operating, the F2000 Championship Series started up and drivers had a choice where to race. The Cooper series folded a year later. Seems to me the marketplace will decide how many series it wants to support, and which ones will survive. My series is offering something quite different than what is currently available in the other programs, and time will tell if what we are offering is what indeed the marketplace wants. This is how the open market and free enterprise works. I don't see any reason why all three F2000 series can't thrive, and as a further example, in the 1990's, our series did not take cars away from FC club racing, it actually grew their club fields by a lot. More interest in F2000 can increase the overall number of teams, cars and drivers, it doesn't have to be a flat figure of cars divided by more choices. Just my views...

Yes. The introduction of street-car type drag racing organizations such as the NMRA, NMCA, PRO and ADRL has greatly increased the popularity and participation in grassroots drag racing. Ever watch an episode of Pinks All Out? They get 10,000 fans in the stands to watch a couple hundred amateur drag racers battle it out.

Hi Matt, good to see a fellow resident of Cedarburg here.

I was speaking more along the lines of professional series. I'm not sure that this issue will even have any affect on the club scene. They can claim that some cars will trickle down but I don't see that as being true with them talking of other engines. I don't see the club adding another engine option when they already have to equalize three.

[KevinFirlein]

not that it really matters but wasnt the Cooper series trying to drop their car package and run Dallaras with the zetec installed ?

[jim morgan]

Uncle Mark,

You may be on to something St. Clair runs a young hot shoe and you come along to subsidize, whoops join us.

[Bumpdraft]

Sorry, I wasn't even thinking of Iowa at the time. I'm not a geographical genius at that hour of the night.

Bumpdraft

[Camadella]

Uncle Mark,

You may be on to something St. Clair runs a young hot shoe and you come along to subsidize, whoops join us.

What about an older coldshoe? Where do I sign up?

[Bumpdraft]

I see that the IRL has made a big deal Of Dan's series on their website.

Bumpdraft

[Zebra]

this may have been answered already in the five pages of horse dung BUT how much is the ENTRY FEE and TIRES

FatBoy

[Zebra]

Since auto racing is the only circus that requires the clowns to pay are we getting a check from IRL for showing up.

We did put on the best show in auto racing at the Glen we should be paid for it

[Zebra]

Enough with the F2000 history lessons from nostalgic has been race drivers who contribute Blah Blah Blah but never show up to the race unless its in their backyards.

Further, for me it is fun factor. Canada F1 I pay lots for Entry. Summit Point with PDA/EMRA you pay me to come. Homestead with IRL you pay ME to show up. Watkins Glen with IRL a draw, NO ENTRY FEE.

With out payment from Dan or waived entry fees and cheap tires a second series is a waste of time.

All this nonsense for 5 or 6 18 year olds is masturbation in the wind. the meat of the circus is the rest of us who want to pay less with more fun, and Dan you have a lot of great attributes and one of the best business men out there and I am not just blowing smoke but you are not warm and fuzzy and certainly not fun. I ran in the Cooper Series it was well run but NOT fun.

Charles "Fat Boy" Finelli
let the fun begin

[Zebra]

Chris Miller made some good points:

More professionalism!
What a waste, that is the problem in the sport the drivers/clowns walk around aloof to the fans. last year at Watkins glen I and several drivers walked around with our driving suits on by the bus stop, the toe of the boot and various other spots, had hot dogs hamburgers beers with the fans and they loved it. When I went out racing you could see out of the corner of your eye the fans cheering for YOU and only YOU. Then after the race high fives beer food campfire and fun WITH THE FANS who also came by the trailer IN MASS to root you on.

The fans make the sport viable and professionalism destroys it. BORING. I do recognize that most YOUNG race car drivers other than Cole Morgan are introverted social basket cases who desire "Professionalism" to protect them. It doesn't translate into fun for fans

Also the good old days of the late 90's and 2000's with big fields.

Memo to all those out there. Recession NOW.

Fat Boy having fun

[HazelNut]

Come on chuck the racing in Cooper was always fun and they did a bang up job of running it and keeping us band of lunatics inline.

You are right about the paddock atmosphere though. It was a bit Funeral-esque.

[Douglas Kniffin]

Charles, you have eloquently explained why there is room and should be two series. The Cooper Series, and I'm assuming Dan's series, is not there to be "Fun". The series is there to hone the skills of the best young race car drivers in the world into experienced drivers who can compete anywhere.

The proof of that is on your TV every weekend. You can turn on any IRL, ALMS, Grand Am race and see a litany of veterans of the Cooper and original F2000 series and after 5 years you will see no drivers from the current series. They serve two different goals and they are each great at what they do.

If you are a 50 year old attorney with no racing ambitions and who is annoyed by really aggressive 18 year old psychos with no interest in scotch and cigars but will kill themselves(and maybe you if you are in the way) to move up one position on the grid, then you stick with the current series. You have a ton of fun, you don't spend a lot of money and you can drink all weekend in peace.

If you are a serious 18 year old or anyone who wants to be tested by the best in their field and you are willing to rise to that challenge, pay the price both financially and in long weekends on the road working like a dog, then you go with the other program.

They both work!

[Zebra]

Doug racing is on the decline everywhere and much more so with IRL, ALMS Lemans Series and that is part of the economics we live in.
As for me being frightened of racing with kids you know me better than that.
As for kids honing their skills the top kids can fight at the top in our series with 25 cars on track, and by the way Tim Minor slapped a few kids around and I am sure Jason Beyers could do the same. Dans series may attract 6 clowns with big budgets but whoopi, IRL if they had a brain would soon drop it for the bigger clown base of the F2000CS.
It is a circus Doug and in these trying times the clowns had better start mingling with there fan base and creating a better circus.

Chas Fat Boy Loving every minute of it

[Zebra]

BTW Doug lunch with Thom and I ? Miss you, Big Kiss

[Zebra]

Has Dan obtained any survey of how many hot shoes are out there waiting to sign up for the "Professional" Pro Racing series?
Or is it Build it and they will come.

Tough economy for this guess work.

[brent_borland]

Dan, or anyone else for that matter, could you please give me one example in the last 13 years of American motorsports where the creation of a competing series positively affected the health of that sport? It seems to me that no matter how you look at this you will be dividing the existing available pool of teams, cars, drivers, sponsors, tracks, etc and forcing them to make a choice of one series or another whether that is on a race by race basis or a season long basis.

In the 1990's, we started with the USAC F2000 series at the same time as SCCA started with their American Continental Championship for F2000 cars. After two years of having both series, the ACC was folded into ours. The Hooters F2000 Championship then started up offering huge prize money, and after two years they folded their tents. In 2005 I think, while the Cooper F2000 series (the successor to my series) was still operating, the F2000 Championship Series started up and drivers had a choice where to race. The Cooper series folded a year later. Seems to me the marketplace will decide how many series it wants to support, and which ones will survive. My series is offering something quite different than what is currently available in the other programs, and time will tell if what we are offering is what indeed the marketplace wants. This is how the open market and free enterprise works. I don't see any reason why all three F2000 series can't thrive, and as a further example, in the 1990's, our series did not take cars away from FC club racing, it actually grew their club fields by a lot. More interest in F2000 can increase the overall number of teams, cars and drivers, it doesn't have to be a flat figure of cars divided by more choices. Just my views...

Hi Dan, sorry for the delay in responding.

You didn't really address my question but did point out that the different series competing with one another in the 90's certainly didn't promote any stability in the sport. I'm not concerned about club racing as I don't think this issue will have any effect on it (positive or negative).

I don't question whether you are within your rights to create a competing series. It is certainly a free market and you can do as you wish. I do, however, question whether it is good for the health of our sport and I feel we are all responsible, as stewards of the sport, to keep that health in mind when planning our actions. Recent history in the upper levels of professional open wheel racing and professional sports car racing has shown that competing series do nothing other than harm the sport itself. I know this personally as I'm a refugee of that mess. Currently the FC/F2000 community is as strong and stable as anytime that I can recall and that includes the turbulent '90's. I simply question the wisdom of introducing a split into that community at this time. We, as a team, make our living off of this sport and I would like to see it retain it's current health.

[mark defer]

hey guys, to be fair don't forget. this wasn't dan's idea.
the IRL decided to add a ladder series below the current indy lights. they asked to speak to wright, guibord, and rand whether there was interest on their part to become that series. after a meeting at the glen this year, the guys politely decline the IRL's idea [i think mostly because of the ovals]. anyway, did anyone really think that the IRL was going to can their idea after that one meeting? as i understand it, they then contacted dan due to his previous series experience. apparently dan felt it was a good fit for him and there you are. believe me, the IRL was going to find somebody to create and run this thing.

mark d

[Bumpdraft]

F2000CS is a fun series and not for those with professional hopes? Are you nuts? Don't tell that to Anders Krohn and his teamates during the 2008 season. They were there to train for professional careers and win races. If that's the case, then why did USF1 endorse our series? They certainly don't want to waste their time with a bunch of over 40 year olds looking to have a good time. That's what cool about our series... you can go in with a "just for fun" attitude, or you can be as "pro" as you like. Frankly, I don't care where you go, without a certain amount of professionalism your gonna suck anyway. Personally, I think F2000CS is also a great training ground for race engineers and crew chiefs and crew members to. The commoradory between the teams is helping to raise a new generation of those unsung heros that have to know how to make these things go fast and keep these finicky drivers happy. I hope that USF1 is also looking at the potential talent in that area to. The IRL is sucking wind with deflating TV coverage (Versus has been dropped by Direct TV) and crowds and F1 is growing in the current economy. And those "Minor leagues" will either sink or swim with ships that they are sailing on, even if they manage themselves well. The steady growth shown by F2000CS is credit to the series management and that's why USF1 endorsed them over series like Star Mazda. Remember, IRL approached F2000CS first because they to saw an awesome series that is both entertaining and competitive and gives the fans a great show for their ticket dollars.

Bumpdraft

[brent_borland]

hey guys, to be fair don't forget. this wasn't dan's idea.
the IRL decided to add a ladder series below the current indy lights. they asked to speak to wright, guibord, and rand whether there was interest on their part to become that series. after a meeting at the glen this year, the guys politely decline the IRL's idea [i think mostly because of the ovals]. anyway, did anyone really think that the IRL was going to can their idea after that one meeting? as i understand it, they then contacted dan due to his previous series experience. apparently dan felt it was a good fit for him and there you are. believe me, the IRL was going to find somebody to create and run this thing.

mark d

Hi Mark, I agree with what you are saying but I don't feel that the cars need to be the F2000 car. This is an attempt to capitalize on the strength of the class.

[Dennis McCarthy]

the IRL was going to find somebody to create and run this thing.

Now all they need are 30+ drivers with fat wallets to make a show........

[George Main]

As someone who ran FF2000 in the Hoosier series and the night before Indy several times and the Orlando FF2000, which BTW was the fastest top speed oval of all them...
Also have lot's of experience running ovals in Atlantic and Indy lights...

The highest injury rate and the most horrific crashes that I've experienced have come on ovals. Generally speaking the footbox is the lesser of the evils, unless the car makes contact with a another car.... 1994, Jeret Schroeder had such an FF2000 accident at IRP (night before Indy) when he crashed into a stationary car at 125mph. (a black car in between the lighting poles, and hidden in the shadows) The impact demolished the footbox on his DB-6 breaking both feet and trapping him in the car for 15 minutes while they cut him out. Jeret would recover and go on to race again six months later. Part of the reason for this accident was caused by a slow yellow flag while the car sat stationary and had dumped oil from start finish to the middle of turn 1, which went unnoticed by officals for almost 1/2 lap of the leaders...about 13 seconds...(laptimes were 22 seconds)
Had this been a Carbon Tub, he would have most likely not been as seriously injured...can't say for sure, but the nature of how he was injured can't happen with a carbon tub.
The majority of impacts "tend" to be side impacts on ovals, and depending on the suspension mountings and type of car, intrusion of the suspension a-arms is of a major concern. This needs to be addressed if ovals are in the picture for tube frames.
Having a large, crushable side pod, mainly for safety needs to be considered.

As Dan has said, the Hans device was not around during these years, and many of the neck injuries that happened, may have been prevented with the Hans. Combine that with driver head surrounds will add to increased safety of the driver. Seats also have come a long way.
Though as experience would tell, it's the carbon tubs that had far least injuries, even at the much higher speeds of atlantic and Indy lights.

Some of the most exciting races were on the smaller ovals, 1/2 mile, 3/4 and "flat" one mile ovals like Loudon. Though the large one mile races are still very fast for an FF2000 cars with 135 mph average the "norm" (non-zetec cars).

In most cases at these small ovals, FF2000 crushed the existing track records of even Super Modifieds and World of Outlaws. The spectators had no idea what kind of cars these were when we started but created huge interest after our races.

With exception to the high speed large ovals (high banked 1 mile ovals and above), having races at the smaller ovals is a "shoe in" for the series. And if the fields are large enough could become more popular, than "regular" run of mill cars that frequent these tracks like Silver Crown, Super Modifieds, Midgets or Sprint Cars...

If the cars are to be considered for higher speed tracks, then things must change for the chassis and in MHO would involve putting the pedals at the front axle line or behind it. Side pods that are extended out to the tire line, mostly crushable and increased in height (similar to atlantic size). And some type of out board mounting of the front suspension prevented from intruding into the driver compartments.
Prevention of engine and trans intrusion into the driver area from a rear end collision or backing in.

It's is great to see not only USF1 and the IRL taking interest in FF2000, but seeing it come back as a pro series is fantastic!!


IMHO

[Zebra]

Guys its OVER!!!!! If you didn't make it work in the last fifteen years the next 15 will be really painful. Dan Anderson will fail and have ZERO entries by the end of his series UNLESS he has IRL pay for us to show up.

As For

Doug Kniffins contempt, hatred and loathing for ones competitor as a sign of a TRUE champion is tragically FLAWED. I for one prey on such weakness and find it amusing in my profession and profitable.

Most true champions that I hold in regard have class, style, self esteem, love of life, love of competition, they respect the moment when a worthy competitor gets the upper hand and doesn't feel the need to "Put Him In The Wall". It is a shame that the Doug Kniffin mentality is fostered by Dan Andersen.

Bring back the days when true champions existed NOT the Schumacher days.

[Zebra]

As For:

Doug Kniffin


"If you are a serious 18 year old or anyone who wants to be tested by the best in their field and you are willing to rise to that challenge, pay the price both financially and in long weekends on the road working like a dog, then you go with the other program"

Question: How many NEW drivers moved into IRL and are being paid LAST YEAR?

[Zebra]

As for:

Doug Kniffin

"If you are a 50 year old attorney with no racing ambitions and who is annoyed by really aggressive 18 year old psychos with no interest in scotch and cigars but will kill themselves(and maybe you if you are in the way) to move up one position on the grid, then you stick with the current series. You have a ton of fun, you don't spend a lot of money and you can drink all weekend in peace"

Response

I am 45 and in my brief 4 years of racing have found that ALL of the top drivers have very LIMITED TALENT and that it is a sponsor game NOT a talent game AND now without sponsors in this economy we will find the same "Danica Patricks" driving in boring circles at "Homestead".

You are living a fantasy Doug, ITS OVER, have a cigar and a scotch, its a lot of fun.

BTW who in the last 6 years has gone anywhere in racing ?? Jay Howard one of the best? Anders Krohn ?? COLE MORGAN ??? MAtos ??? Hilderbrand ??
It's a fraud Doug.Self perpetuating Fraud upon young kids and their families.

[jim morgan]

zebra,

good to see you are still kicking and being polite on the net. WTF with the no talent barb and a third place rating on the list. give me a call you are now the lead sponsor on the Chinese Drywall Special ,he can aquire a taste for good scotch not so sure about the cigar but we have enlisted a fat cuban on the team for constant cigar training
OBTW when Cole runs this series with your support he will be the most fan friendly driver they have seen in years

Puderpotty,

Why the constant beat down on Dan?

[dc]

Can we at least pretend to be civil in here?

[jim morgan]

? PM

[mark defer]

charles,
in reading your posts, i get the same headache i used to get reading jon baytos' posts.
your spelling is better than jon's though.

mark d

[Zebra]

To quote James Carville "It's the economy Stupid"

(In the spirit of civility that quote was not intended for any individual)

Mark my words racing 2010 will be dramatically different then anything we have seen in fifteen years. Dramatically reduced corporate sponsors, factory teams and advertising as well as reduced racing budgets for us old timers. As for young hot shoes has anyone counted how many are eligible age and $$$$ for IRL

I just want to go racing without the history lessons. i want cheaper tires and NO entry fees. I think the way racing is run today is backwards and FAN APPRECIATION is non existent.

And, COLE MORGAN is the best driver in many years

Charles FatBoy Finelli Spells better at 1:00AM hmmm Scotch

[Stan Clayton]

Dan, thank you for replying to my teaser post on the previous page. Now, I am pretty agnostic about what non-SCCA series do with their rules, but I am interested in whether those rules take the cars in non-compliant directions. So, if you don't mind a few more questions and guesses...

A tub car would be a safer driver module if we were racing at much higher speeds, but at these speeds, the tube frame is as safe, and possibly safer than a tub.

Setting aside the safety argument, we can surmise that the new cars will be tube-frame. H-pattern gearbox or sequential? Alloy calipers or ferrous?

...we will design our rules package to control the costs as much as is possible and thereby control the teams who seem willing to spend whatever it takes to win.

Umm, Dan, this is ApexSpeed you're talking to, not mums and dads you have to assure you have costs under control.

We will accept entries for 2010 from all FC legal cars, and we will announce soon what the restrictions will be for 2011, so teams can see where we are headed with this series.

Ah, so you ARE going to step away from current FC legality. Do you plan to seek SCCA homologation for your cars? And if so, in which class?

There will not be a new spec car for 2010 or 2011, nor do I see us moving away from the tube frame design anytime soon.

So, there WILL be a spec car for 2012, eh? An offering from one of the current manufacturers or your own bespoke chassis? Hint: you can squeeze more cash out of mums and dads if you go the bespoke route. But of course, you'll need to keep playing the "cost control" card to make that work.

We will reign in the rules for 2011 as the current rules would be exploited hugely by some pro teams, and the budgets would rise to unreasonablae levels.

More justification for a spec chassis, eh? So, for 2011 there will be a spec wings and diffuser package.

As to engines, the current Zetec engine will be legal, and we may be introducing an alternate engine as well. Those with Zetecs need not worry, but if and when we announce that alternate, it will come with sizeable rewards for those utilizing it, and that partnership will benefit everyone.

Can you Pinto guys feel the love? After 2010 you are no longer welcome.

Reading between the lines, Dan is considering an engine from VW, Honda or Mazda, since they are the only ones still interested in club racing and willing to spend any money on it, and each has a healthy 2 liter engine in their stable. Or rather I should say that Dan is negotiating with one or more companies to get the best deal he can, which is understandable. It won't be a diesel, so that leaves VW out in the cold. Honda's weakest K20 makes 198 hp, so I'm guessing Mazda's MZR20. It makes 165-ish hp stock, and Mazda are spending money in club racing like drunken sailors on liberty at Subic Bay.

The MZR20 makes a lot of sense. Dan can contract someone to build a post-99 Van Diemen clone from his own car. All the support systems are there...dry sump, bell housing, 5-sp sequential gearbox, ally calipers, etc. No need for anything as doughty and dated as iron calipers, 2- valves and *gasp* a carburetor. Think FE car with a 2 liter engine. It's a sweet deal for you, Dan. You can control the revenue stream pretty much completely with such a vertically integrated plan. Think Swift in Pro Atlantics and BMW in Formula BMW.

It's not such a good deal for club racers, though...

...we will be the first step on the road to Indy Ladder

I thought that title belonged to Formula Ford...?

[Beartrax]

for us old timers.

45 is not old!!!


"Doug Kniffin
If you are a 50 year old attorney..."

"Zebra: I am 45"

I was going to correct him on that..."

Go Charles!

[Zebra]

Barry you Ready for 2010?

[HazelNut]

Why the constant beat down on Dan?

Couple reasons:

A. I enjoy a good argument, discussion and the exchange of ideas generally lead to better solutions to problems. This series looks like it's happening, so if we can influence it's direction and improve racing as whole though open discussion, arguing or even Finelli's Johnie Walker rants I'm all for it.

B. I really like racing. I particularly like f2000 racing. I'd like to see it thrive. The IRL connection will help Dan's series, however I have serious questions as to weather his new series will remain an actual "f2000" series. So if he does either by intent or by accident split the fields, end up killing off the f2000cs by "market force" and then shift the rules package away from the current formula we'll be back right where we were a few years ago.

C. I think racing, at least top level professional racing, has gotten really sterilized. Professionalism is great. I appreciate drivers who are really dedicated and talented. However the push towards trained overt professionalism in young drivers has come at the cost of personality. Danica is the most popular IRL driver. She's gorgeous and a dedicated and talented driver, however she's about as interesting as a potato. That isn't a surprise at all because she's done nothing but drive, study data, and hawk her sponsors wares since she was a kid driving a kart.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRtpDK5fwQw
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...0090902058987#

D. I have serious questions about Dan's motives. He's driven to win and become the "Roger Penske of Jr. Openwheel Racing" and that is ok, but at what cost to the rest of us? Is it ok that he upsets the fairly precarious stability that we've currently got? Why couldn't he work with the current series? It's not like he doesn't know mike, bob, and al. He raced with them for 2 years. Is he willing to put his own ambitions on hold for the sake of the overall stability and surviveability of the class? I'm not sure. But based on his recent passed, (see posts above about "box stock, factory team" "elan intake" "i'll spend to win if i have to" etc etc), i have some pretty serious doubts about that.

Benevolent dictator, I doubt it, but I'd love to be proven wrong.