DUFFUS Update #3

Hi,

We would like to announce scheduling of the final "foundation" race in the DUFFUS 2104 championship. There will be a DUFFUS race held in conjunction with the final MARRS race Formula Fest at Summit Point Raceway on October 4 & 5. Our thanks goes out to the Washington DC Region for inviting us to participate in their race program.

DUFFUS #1 - Mid Ohio, July 4, 5 & 6 supporting Formula Race Promotions pro series
DUFFUS #2 - Pittsburgh International Raceway, August 1, 2 & 3 supporting FRP again
DUFFUS #3 - Summit Point Raceway, October 4 & 5, with WDCR MARRS Formula Fest

Please note our use of the word "foundation" race. If you recall our original premise was to schedule a limited number of races in different geographical areas. We wanted to have a race in the Great Lakes area and we were able to book the Mid Ohio event on the Fourth of July weekend. We wanted to have an East Coast event and we have been able to book the race at Summit Point on the first weekend of October. We wanted to have a race someplace in the "middle" and we have been able to book the event at Pittsburgh International Raceway on the first weekend in August. So we have been fortunate enough to get the "foundation" events of DUFFUS lined up.

Our goals are very simple; we are hoping for large fields; good completion that comes from the large fields; and having a lot of fun. There are very few opportunities for large numbers of FF & CF to get together these days outside of the pro series. We hope that organizing DUFFUS addresses that.

Everyone is welcome. We also want to keep it simple and will be awarding "horses hindquarter" trophies to the first three finishers in three different classes. Formula F (SCCA GCR rules; Kents, Hondas, any tire); Club Ford (MARRS rules; Kents, Hondas, hard tires as specified in MARRS rules) and Vintage (iron heads, Dunlop treaded tires).

Our original thoughts were for a "flash mob" type of organization where we say we are going to go to XXXX and we hope you all show up. Perhaps we may get there in the future, but for now we really want to see how everyone responds to these three events. We have been fortunate enough to have been offered other opportunities, but these three venues were what the four DUFFI (Dave, Phil, Doug & I) agreed we would all attend.

In order to make this concept work over the long run we really need to make sure we can get the good turnout for these three venues. If we get a really great turnout at Mid Ohio and a large number of drivers would like us to add another event to the calendar as well as attend PIR & Summit Point; we do have opportunities. But, let's focus on these for now.

Please let us know what you think.

Thanks,

Joe Marcinski
Club Ford #04

Great. We'll be at all three events.

This will be great fun. I'll be there.
Great work Joe.

I'm shooting for Mid-Ohio and Summit Point, I'm still planning on doing the NARRC Runoffs at Lime Rock in September, and I'd like to get to Thompson whenever that weekend is.

Thanks again for all the effort Joe and company!

-Will

Some home field advantage... I can't wait! Looking forward to next season. Thank you Joe for all of your efforts with this series.

Joe, I am still gearing for Mid Ohio. Thought about sticking with my Dunlops in Vintage but I've wanted to try the Hoosiers (CF) ever since I ran against them at the 40th and felt like I brought a knife to a gunfight...

Newbie and not sure what you mean about "...hard tires...", Joe. I went to the MARRS Club Ford rules and they say:

[FONT=Times-Roman]

B. Tire choice is restricted to four (4) tires: Goodyear 600, Hoosier 60, American
Racers, and Dunlop treaded racing tires. Competitors may mount rain tires at their
discretion. Rain tires must be manufactured, purpose-built, treaded tires. Handcut/
grooved or otherwise modified tires are not permitted unless based on one of the

approved slick tires.

I understand the "..knife to the gunfight.." thing but I can only afford Dunlops for my budget racing. Is the DUFFUS series asking CF to not be on Dunlops? Or, saying anything noted under "B." is legal?

Thanks,
David
[/FONT]

Hi Dave,

It was a pleasure to meet you at the Turkey Bowl and I hope that you will consider racing with us in DUFFUS. The MARRS Club Ford tire rule for 2014 is being amended to specifically call out the Dunlop tire tread code that is legal for Club Ford. Any tire listed in section B is legal for MARRS Club Ford.

I am not sure, but I thought I saw an iron head on the engine in your Lola T540. That gives you the options of either running the Dunlop tires either as a Club Ford or as Vintage in DUFFUS. The Dunlops are a really fine tire, but I believe that they will be a bit slower than the Hoosier R60 that most of the regular MARRS CF competitors run.

Now that I think of it, the rear shocks you had on your car were borrowed. I do have two Koni 3012-1613 shocks (I believe that these are the same as those on the front of your car) that you are welcome to try. I believe that Angelo at ANZE Suspension can add the ends that you need to mount them on your rear uprights. Please send me an e-mail if you would like to talk about them.

Best regards,

Joe Marcinski

Thanks, Joe. Yes, it was great to meet you and lots of other names I have seen on here at the Turkey Bowl. Indeed, the Lola has a cast iron head and her owner is often accused of the same. I'll send a PM on the other stuff; have already talked with Angelo.

Don't think I can run Vintage as I have CV joints and alloy wheels.

Thanks!
David

David, you couldn't run as a Vintage FF as the cutoff has always been First Generation cars , the so-called "cigar tube" cars of the 1968-1972 era.
The only Lolas accepted were the T200-T204 range.
Virtually all are front radiator simple basic cars like Lotus 51/61 but including the relatively advanced 69, Merlyn Mk 11 through 21, Caldwell D-9 which was essentially an almost bolt for bolt American Merlyn Mk 11 copy !, Titan Mk 5 through 6C, Elden Mk 6 through 10, Royale RP 2 through 16 and even though the 16 had side radiators it was first seen in 1972 and aside form radiator placement is in every way a First Generation car.
Paul Pfanner and I wrote the first Vintage FF rules in 1989, a document I retain in my files, which I would be happy to share with any interested party. It amazes me that Paul and I did this 24 years ago.
It makes interesting reading through the haze of the last 24 years.

Thanks, Mike. Yep, I pretty much knew the Lola and I are Club Ford - that's what I wanted and am happy there. I wanted to respond to Joe's note on the vintage idea and, though I was pretty darn sure I couldn't race in vintage, I'm still new enough I don't pretend to be an expert on all the various rules and rule-making bodies out there. Btw, the red #55 got some nice compliments on appearance (your handiwork) at Summit Point. :D I think a younger guy stopped by at Wild Hare last year and said he was the one (or his shop) that created the bodies & noses for you. Do you remember the guy's name? They are all in good shape; just want the info for my "build book."

David

Hi Mike. My car is a highly modified Lotus 61. When I say modified, I mean it was modified a long time ago and the photos I have show it being raced in 71,72 with the radiator mounted on the rear behind the motor. Then it went to side mounts in 73ish. So my question is, would it still be eligible for vintage racing or would it be a club ford. It also had suspension mounts modified and moved in the early 70's. Thanks for any help.

I guess it would depend on the organizer but generally, with so many mods from "as built" I would expect the entry should be happily accepted but as a CF. Returning it to original may be the way to go in the long run as far as resale value is concerned however. Must admit it looks pretty neat though...

Thanks Mike. I figured that but wasn't sure. It would take too much to put it back to original even though it has some real good history with it. I am just going to have fun with it, that was my intention from the start and is still my goal.:D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jonathan Hirst

Joe, I am still gearing for Mid Ohio. Thought about sticking with my Dunlops in Vintage but I've wanted to try the Hoosiers (CF) ever since I ran against them at the 40th and felt like I brought a knife to a gunfight...

---

Sorry if this caused confusion. I used to run my CF at Vintage Events on Dunlops, gridded with Vintage Fords but as a seperate class. I recall the 40th was set up the same way and I ran on both the Vintage and Regional grids with Dunlops.

Obviously for this series there is only 1 grid...I just need to see if I can budget for some Hoosier R60's or if I'll be on the Dunlops again.

Anybody care to start a tenetative chassis/tire/engine roster, and which rounds you are attending? I know some of the names here but not necessarily what people drive.


Jonathan Hirst 1977 Ferret Mk4b/Hoosier R60 /Kent. R1

Douglas Fisher NY - 1984 Swift DB1/Hoosier/Kent- I will be attending all rounds.

1984 Swift DB1 / Kent / Hoosier 35's

Summit Point / Mid Ohio / Beaver Run?

Chris Robson 1983 Swift DB1 FF /Hoosier R35/Kent
Mark Robson 1978 Eagle DGF CF/Hoosier R60/Kent

We plan on Running Mid-Ohio

Will Velkoff/1976 Crossle 30F/Hoosier R60/Kent

Mid Ohio Yes, maybe PIR/Summit

Hi,

DK540's question was well asked and Mike Rand's explanation was really helpful. The DUFFI are working a clarification so that we can make everyone feel welcome so please stay tuned.

Jonathan; your reply actually has triggered something that will be really helpful and I think we will have it worked out in a day or two. So, no apology necessary except from me for not really understanding the detail behind the rules that the vintage clubs use.

Joe Marcinski
Royale RP24 (well, a pile of parts that an RP24 could be made from), aluminum head Kent, Hoosier R60, Club Ford

Joe, count me in for all3 , or 4, or whatever....
Crossle 30F Honda Fit and assorted Hoosiers, anything form 35's to 60's and the F1600 pro series spec tire, approximately 45's I think.....

Sounds good Mike. By the way, we have a Chief Steward for DUFFUS for the two FRP weekends. I ran into Larry Oliver at the PRI show and he has very kindly agreed to be our guy at Mid Ohio & Pittsburgh.

And the trophies have arrived (I also always get to the airport 2 1/2 hours early!). Pardon my poor photography, but pretty nice for $6 huh?

Joe Marcinski

Joe,
I don't have the talent to compete for one. Can I buy it? :o

Chris

Hi Chris,

I am pretty sure you are going to have a shot at one. But, if it doesn't work out at the front end of the field we do have another option.

We have the same trophy (horse's hind quarters), but the engraving says "DUFFUS Dead Last". Hopefully, we won't have a lot of sandbagging just to get one of these prestigious awards but you never know..................... That would make for some interesting after race conversations.

I bet Larry would love to hear a protest over someone unfairly finishing last! Come to think of it, I would love to be sitting in on that one too.

Here is a quick summary of what we are thinking about regarding the various classes we would like to run. We are thinking about four classes so that everyone who has one of our cars can have someone to run with and something to race for.

Formula F - SCCA GCR rules, Kent, Cortina & Honda engines, any tire.

SCCA Club Ford - at least one end outboard suspension, Kent with iron or aluminum head and Honda engines, hard tires per the MARRS CF rules.

Vintage Spec Club Ford - at least one end outboard suspension, Kent or Cortina with iron head only, Dunlop treaded tires.

Vintage Formula Ford - 1968 thru 1972 "cigar cars" as described by Mike in an earlier post in this thread (Monoposto rules I think). Kent or Cortina with iron head only, Dunlop treaded tires.

We hope this will attract anyone with one of our cars regardless of the rules package that they prefer to run and stick with. The trophies cost $21 for a podium and I think we should do this to show that we want everyone to come. To keep this from becoming too expensive we are going to only award trophies for the finishing order of the final race of the weekend. How does that sound to all of you?

Doug is thinking of unique (and some are somewhat offensive!) other things to give trophies for, but we have to keep this reasonable, simple and really, really cheap because it is just for fun. Picture one of Frank DelVecchio's tongue puppets for the best pass/move in each race? Best looking car? Ugliest car (perhaps 5 puppets for that one)?

Joe Marcinski

Hi Joe,
Flattery works so, how about I just get one in absentia. I could save some money and still brag to people back home about how good I was. Otherwise, I already have my excuse (and bribe) for running last. That will be revealed to the steward (and you) when the time comes.

Being only moderately familiar with the numerous different rules that come from so many different sanctioning bodies your concept of 4 different run groups sounds great. Seems to cover it all. I think that most everyone wants to be able to compete with like groups and have something to show for it at the checker. To make it that much more special I can't imagine anything better than the shiny replica of a horse's hindquarters.

That said, I'm not sure about the trophy being presented for the finishing order of the final race. Does that take away from someone who has run well all weekend in the qualifying races, etc. and then blows it on the last day from mechanical issues, running out of talent, or whatever? Maybe something cumulative? Or maybe one of the 'lesser' awards could go to that driver....

Whatever, the other awards are going to have to be at least on par with the 'offensiveness' of the podium trophy. I would suspect and hope that anyone who participates in the series couldn't be offended. Let 'er rip!

Chris

The three "Duffus" series races will run at events under SCCA and SCCA Pro sanctions. So will the "Vintage" CF/FF drivers need a SCCA license, membership and will their cars need SCCA logbook/approval?

Darn.
Conflict.
Summit Oct 4-5 is opposite NER at Thompson.
As I have been working for the Hoenig group on a consulting basis I do feel the need to attend.
It really is not the tow time, Thompson, a whole 125 miles from home [which is 5 miles from LRP] and the complete opposite in CT being in the far NE corner versus LRP in the very far NW corner, dragging a trailer could well be a 3 hour tow for me, depends on traffic on the mostly 2 lane country roads.
While Summit is a relatively simple and calm 6 hour interstate jog with only the last 20 miles 2 laners.
Thompson trip has an aggravation factor of maybe 8 on a 1 to 10 scale while Summit would only rate a 2 , maybe 3 if the trucks on 81 gang up on you.
Regardless, similar lodging costs and likely entry fees and the fact that while I have scheduled and run the F2000/1600/Atlantic series at Summit numerous times over the last 8 seasons I really cannot remember the last time I raced there myself.
I do recall my very first time there however, a test day on the way to Daytona for the Runoffs in 1969 when I went as an alternate. Summit was 1.75 miles as the carousel was not there yet. I am not sure if it was when I won FC at a National there in the spring of 1970. Someone knows.....
Anyway, my previous post stating I was in for all 3 was a bit premature. Sorry Joe. Maybe 2015......

No need to apologize Mike. We knew that we would have some date conflicts no matter how hard we worked to alleviate them. We just found out that Dave Harmison (one of the four DUFFI) has a family outing conflict for the PIR weekend and won't be able to make it.

Getting to Thompson from Sharon is a PITA, but the new facility at Thompson will be worth the trip! Doug, John D. and I went up to see it before the Thanksgiving holiday and it is NICE!!!

Our hope for the DUFFUS is that by having them at the tracks we have scheduled that drivers from OH, IN, MI, KY, CO (Steve Meyer!) will be willing to come to Mid Ohio. We hope that everyone will have a great time and will want to make the effort to go to PIR and Summit Point. But we know that might not be possible. We are pretty sure that the names on the entry lists will vary from venue to venue.

DUFFUS is an experiment. We are really, really gratified that you & FRP and the WDCR region believe enough in the concept to have made time available for us to try this. FRP & WDCR are taking a chance by inviting DUFFUS. If we can't get a good turnout it has some negative effects for both FRP & WDCR and we may not be presented an opportunity to try it again. Despite what the toads in Washington say (I probably need to apologize to toads now), I don't feel that times are getting dramatically better economically so we understand that there are limits for club racers like us. All we can do now is see what happens.

Wildest dream............we have such a good time at Mid Ohio that everyone asks if we can schedule a fourth race. I would love to try out the Royale on that new infield section at Thompson............I got my first SCCA podium finish there in 1975.

Joe M.

Excellent question Bill,

SCCA membership is required for all of our races. However, the SCCA does have temporary memberships available. As I recall from the Formula Fest, one of drivers who was thinking of running did not belong to the SCCA and was a member of several vintage groups and held their licenses. All that he would have had to do was to execute a temporary SCCA membership at the registration that weekend. It is my understanding that the SCCA does acknowledge and accept licenses from virtually all the large vintage organizations.

A logbook will be required for the Oct DUFFUS at Summit Point as DUFFUS is going to be running within regular MARRS series weekend and subject to normal tech procedures. Therefore, evidence of an annual tech inspection must be presented.

We have been compiling a list of items that either the DUFFI or the drivers will need to accomplish or provide. This is one of those items. Come April or so, we will be asking for a headcount for the first race at Mid Ohio. We will ask a few questions such as "are you an SCCA member?", "What is your license affiliation"?, "Do you have a log book for your car?", "have you had an annual tech inspection?", etc. At that point we will address and resolve any conflicts or items of omission.

DUFFUS has to accomplish its own registration for the two pro weekend events, so we will start early (but not now) to get a good picture of entry. We have an agreement with FRP that requires us to provide them with an entry list at least one week before the event. So we are building a form that we are going to ask all of you to fill out and return to us so that we can address these things (but not right now). We might share it with the NSA, oh never mind, they are probably reading this right now............

Numbers; Doug has volunteered to oversee the process of getting numbers assigned and conflicts addressed (but not right now). Having said that; #27 belongs to Phil Kingham & #04 belongs to me (there has to be some benefit for the DUFFI). Just so you know; Dave Harmison and Doug Fisher have first call on #10. They have to resolve that themselves. If it is one on one basketball, put your money on Dave. If it is cage fighting; choose Doug.........

So, it is our plan to address these things (very early on, but not right now) so the arrival at the track will be as effortless and painless as is possible. Pro weekends run with a different regimen than do club races and we are going to borrow from the best of both.

Does that help?

Thanks,

Joe M.

LOL.

How did you know I was proficient in all things 'cage fighting' ???
Because I'm married ?!?!?!
In any case, wildest dreams....Thompson. Would love it.
I had my first pole there....

Duffi,

for some reason I am feeling vague about committing. Probably afraid of jinxing myself.

I plan to do as many of the Pro races and all three Duffus races this coming year in the Wyvern Honda on Pro series tires. Would love to have car number 36:thumbsup: I have rebuilt the engine in the RP31, so will have a spare car in the wings in case something happens. So why the dread?? Must be the winter blues??

Steve

I am fairly concerned that you are trying too hard to be all things to all people.

Specifically:
- Four classes (!?!?) Really?
- How many trophies?
- How many "gag" trophies?
- Mixing "modern" FF, CF, Vintage CF, and pre 73 Vintage classes in one run group?

This part REALLY concerns me.

I really enjoyed the Formula Fest, we had lots of good close racing, everyone was respectful, but raced very hard, and there was more than a little "rubbing". (Browse all of the Formula Fest videos as exhibit A)

I mean this with no offense at all intended to anyone, but most of the pre-73 Vintage FF guys I have met are absolutely HORRIFIED by this kind of close racing. And probably rightly so, as their cars are getting pretty valuable. In many vintage groups (outside of SVRA perhaps) passing in corners is strongly frowned upon, and aggressive driving of any kind will earn you a visit from the Stewards…. I am fairly certain that our entire group from the Summit Formula Fest would be banned for life from most vintage events.

Mixing these cars and CF cars on treads with a no-holds-barred lead pack of FF/CF cars on slicks will make for 2-3-4 lapping opportunities per race. I would hate to be the owner of one of these cars looking at my mirrors as the lead pack bears down on me fanning out 3-4 cars wide…

Seems like a recipe that will end in tears…

Not looking to be a wet blanket - just a voice of reason.

Best,
Sean

IMO, expecting any run groupings better then what has been proposed for the DUFFUS events is simply unobtainable.

The only better scenarios out there are the Pro 1600/2000/Atlantic series, because it's all top level driver/cars, so the differential between the cars will be a little less.

What happens when you go to a normal SCCA weekend and we are stuck in the normal run groups? Either praying that Vee you're lapping sees you, or watching your mirrors as you get lapped by an FA.

Being able to have the opportunity to run in a Formula F only grouping would be awesome, and is something I have not had the opportunity to do in my 3 years racing.

I can't comment on the driving from the Summit race in the fall, but given the people that will be entering these events, myself included, I would think none of us want to tear up our cars and/or risk hurting anyone.

Point well made Sean,

It is one week before Christmas of 2013. We made this announcement really early so that we would give drivers a lot of notice and plenty of time to try and plan their 2014 season. I don't really know who will really show up and who will not; particularly more than 6 months before the first race.

Perhaps this may allay your concerns. My count via replies here on Apex and private e-mails that have come to me is 34 drivers. Of those 34 drivers only two drivers are interested in running what I have called Vintage Spec Club Ford. One of those drivers is a newbie and the other has extensive FA experience. Only one driver is interested in running as what I called Vintage Formula Ford and that driver has extensive experience in FF. Everyone else is a known quantity in either FF or CF.

Obi Mike has advised us to keep it simple. He has not wacked me with his staff as yet, but I am sure that he will if he thinks it is necessary. Those of you who are from the Mid-Atlantic would be right if you thought there were a very real possibility that I may be overcompensating in my attempt to be inclusive versus the current situation in club racing in our area where so many formula car drivers feel disenfranchised.

So, when someone with one of our cars asks us if they can come I would prefer to say yes rather than say "no" or "yes, but only if you have this or don't have that". I would prefer that they be made to feel welcome and that they have a good time. Jonathan's comment was very appropriate; I gather he thinks he would have had an even better time at the 40th if he were on slicks rather than on treaded tires. Maybe someone who shows up at Mid Ohio on treadies has a great time and decides it would be even more fun at PIR or Summit if they were on slicks. I would prefer for our drivers to make that decision; not the DUFFI.

Will Velkoff has never had the chance to do what I and some of the rest of you have done; race in a huge FF/CF field. When our fields were 35 to 50 cars there were fast guys and slow guys; there was traffic (expletive deleted). The DUFFUS is just an experiment to see if we can give drivers like Will an opportunity to do something that a lot of us miss; that's all it is.

I expect that we will all race very, very hard and I hope that we will do it cleanly. I would race if there were no trophies, but trophies are important to some people so we found some really cheap ones. We thought that perhaps a trophy that was a bit unusual in a "don't take it so seriously" kind of way would add a little bit to the fun and provide something that was a bit unique. The trophies and other things are very much secondary to the real purpose; having a good time in the best class of road racing cars ever.

Again; wildest dream............at the front of the field there are 12 to 14 soft tired FF streamliners fighting for the lead, 6 seconds back there are another 15 springs in the air stream cars fighting for the CF lead; 8 seconds behind them are 10 or 12 cars of various ages and configuration looking to be the first vintage tire finisher. If the idea of that appeals to you please come. If the idea of that gives you second thoughts; perhaps DUFFUS is not for you.

Sorry if this came across as being crabby, its late, I'm tired...........

Joe M.

You wrote the last post at midnight, then edited it at 5 am. Older fellas need more sleep than that.

I'll be at M-O for sure, possibly the other two.
Chuck Smith
Indianapolis, IN
Tiga FFA-81, CF, Kent, Hoosier R60s

there was almost no issue at the 40th with 110 cars on the track and similar groupings. what few issues there were, came from cars within the same group for the most part, if I remember correctly. I can't see why it'd be an issue now. my experience with vintage drivers is that they are, perhaps excessively, accommodating in allowing a newer car to pass.

Chuck is right, I need to get some sleep. I have not had a total of 8 to 10 hours sleep in the last 10 days. My 50 pound dog Beaker somehow managed to yank my feet out from beneath me and I tore some muscles in my right arm and shoulder. I just can't get comfortable laying down in bed and have been trying to sleep sitting up in a chair.

Anyhow...................

I do hope that Sean was not offended by my reply because it was just poorly written and not meant to take a shot at him. Sean is a great guy and his concerns are legitimate. I am no fan of class proliferation, but as Ric has pointed out; he and I and many other regulars on Apex have been in a huge field recently where we all seemed to deal with one another's speed potential pretty successfully.

I would also like to explain more clearly my thought process as it relates to the purpose of making the offer to provide trophies for some "sub groups". Ralph Zuponic (I do hope I have not slaughtered Ralph's last name) had asked if he could come with his vintage Alexis. Thus far, Ralph is the only driver from the Pre-1973 group to get in touch with us. If making it known that there were trophies available for this "sub-group" could entice another few similar cars to come out and give Ralph some other "cigar cars" to run with; I think it would be worth $21 for the three trophies.

I do not know how many of you were at the Jefferson 500 at Summit Point last May or have watched the video that the Fairchild's posted of the Club Ford race there, but that was no parade. That racing with those 6 or 7 cars was as good as I have seen in a long time. It made me want to go home and get my car, but I did not think I could afford a set of Dunlops that I would race on perhaps once a year. Frank Delvecchio, Dennis Austin and a fellow in a Royale RP16 who I don't know had a hell of race at the Turkey Bowl last month at Summit Point. Yes, there are FF drivers in the vintage group who drive with a great deal of reserve, but there are some who are putting on a hell of show.

Wouldn't it be a shame of those drivers chose not to come because they felt they couldn't afford some Hoosiers that they might race on once? Check the list of those reading the thread at the bottom of this page. You will see people from the vintage groups checking this out. Would the opportunity for a podium trophy entice some of them to come and join us? I don't know, but I do think it is worth making a $21 offer.

One last thing on the trophies and "sub-groups". We have had a donor who wishes to remain anonymous send a check to pay for our horse's hindquarters trophies.

The check came with a note wishing us good luck with DUFFUS and was sent in appreciation of the effort to try and create conditions where large groups of Formula Fords might gather. It said, "I am glad to see that an effort is being made to include all various types of Formula Ford racing going on because it has become so splintered. SCCA guys won't race with the vintage groups and vice versa. Perhaps a chance for a little comingling will allow for a bit more appreciation of one another's preferred style of racing".

Again, I am blown away by the support we have received thus far.

And that is all I have to say about that...............

Joe Marcinski

Personally, I think it is a great idea

And that is all I have to say about that!!! :thumbsup:
Graham.

No offense taken. Just felt something should be said.

I certainly want to be inclusive and welcome all comers, but I want everybody to go in with both eyes open.

As for Ric's point about the 40th race, I hope that is the case, but three races a weekend on much tighter and shorter tracks is a whole different atmosphere.

Finally, don't get me wrong, I am very supportive of the concept, and plan to make all three events. I just don't want to see the program collapse under its own weight so I would echo Rand's KIS recommendation.

Best Regards,
Sean