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Hi All
Considering the excitement of the 50th Formula Ford celebration ,I've had several people contact me regarding owners and parts for AAR Eagle DGF. Any information regarding current or past owners of these cars would be appreciated. I'm trying to locate
all the cars and history of past owners and serial numbers.
Thanks Wes Allen
Two are entered in the Monterey Reunion:
Lawrence Webster 1978 AAR Eagle
Rick Dresang 1977 All American Racers Eagle DGF Jacques N. Dresang
That leaves, what, 4 more?
Jacques is a member of this forum.
I actually know where nine of thirteen cars built are,which is pretty good. Three are nicely restored and race ready,one is more original but in race condition. Four are in various states of disassembly and one is in the Gurney museum. I heard a rumor several years ago about a silver or grey one racing in Colorado but couldn’t track it down? I’m looking for any former owners and what serial number they had?
This is a list I started compiling with Jacques' assistance. Feel free to add any info to the mini registry.
Gurney Eagle DGF 1977 Formula Fords
#001 : Bruce Drenth possibly
#002 : Rich and Ed Wiseman
#003 : ?
#004 : Fernando Bobeda (ex Bill Kincaid car)
#005 : Jacques Dresang
#006 : ?
#007 : Gurney Museum (hanging on the wall)
#008 : Wes Allen (ex Hans Iwand's car)
#009 : ?
#010 : ?
#011 : ?
#012 : ?
#013 : ?
Larry Webster #?
13 cars made by AAR overall.
In the Monterey entry list, it's listed as a 1978 so sounds like it was a later one.Quote:
Originally Posted by dc
I sold my Eagle to Larry Webster, chassis #011
I believe chassis #002 belongs to Bill Fickling. I am pretty sure it is the same car he drove as teammate to David Loring when they were with AAR.
It has been awhile since I spoke with him, but I thought that was what he told me, my memory being what it is...:confused:
I indeed have #005, but it is the ex-Kincaid car, not #004.Quote:
Originally Posted by dc
Updated list:
Gurney Eagle DGF 1977 Formula Fords
#001 : Bruce Drenth
#002 : Mike Sauce (ex Rich and Ed Wiseman car)
#003 : Bill Fickling (ex Frank Vella car)
#004 : Fernando Bobeda
#005 : Jacques Dresang (ex Bill Kincaid car)
#006 : ?
#007 : Gurney Museum (hanging on the wall)
#008 : Wes Allen (ex Hans Iwand car)
#009 : ?
#010 : ?
#011 : Larry Webster (ex Chris Robson car)
#012 : ?
#013 : ?
I had a Gurney Eagle that previously belonged to Mike McFarland. I sold it to a local fellow who rolled it in his first time out at Waterford. It has since reappeared in the ownership of Bill Fickling in California. I was told it was chassis 03,
Frank Vella
PS There is an Eagle sitting in Ann Arbor, Mich area. I tried to buy it back but the owner said he had to get $75000.00 for it. (Chassis #11, Mr. Webster)
:ha:Quote:
Originally Posted by fvracerone1
WOW!! Does he think it's the F1 Eagle?
Loring crashed 001 and built a 2nd chassis that he won the runoffs with.... #002.
I don't know how far back you're indicating, but there was a red Eagle racing in Colorado in the late '70s to early '80s, owned/driven by Bob Tankersley. Bob owned Theatre Operators, and Western Service & Supply, if that's of any help -- and after the Eagle ran Super Vee/F-Continental in a March 80V emblazoned with those companies (I was his sign guy over the first half of the '80s).Quote:
Originally Posted by Wes Allen
Bob is gone now, but you might be able to find sons Steve or Tony online. I believe Jacques has been in contact with Steve.
Allen Brown or Richard Jenkins at OldRacingCars.com *may* have additional info on the Eagle FFs, but that's a guess.
Best of Luck.
Thanks for everyone’s replies! There is lots of mystery surrounding the Eagle DGF! The cars didn’t have a nameplate, only the frame was stamped with a S/N. They made two prototypes, some say these were the two that David started with??? The one that was wrecked was supposedly stripped and the frame was taken home to be built into another car by a AAR employee??? Bruce Drenth has always claimed he has 001??? Then currently their are two S/N 007! One in the AAR museum and one in private hands since the 80’s. The last car built by AAR was S/N 011. The final two cars were finished by Sandy Dells??? All is here say from multiple sources over the last 10 years of checking around. I need some good information on the cars before Al Olsen and Dan Clark gathered the bits and pieces.
Thanks to all!
It would be news to me if 012 and 013 were built by Dells. AAR claimed in the Paul Zimmerman book that 13 were completed at AAR- I'd take them up on that wordage. For instance, three 1977 Eagle Indycar tubs were built but only one was serialized, and thus only one is claimed on the book.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wes Allen
I know Sauce (or one of his customers) recently purchased the one that was in St. Louis- a gent from Colorado is working on the second Tankersley car (the red one) and there is another one in NY state that has turned up in the past year.
Cheers,
JD
I did buy chassis 002 a couple of months ago for myself. I have always had an affection for the Eagles FF.I have a log book with the chassis #002 from 1981 with Sandy Dells in t race logsQuote:
Originally Posted by Gokart Mozart
Mike Sauce
Mike did you buy that car from Scott Livingston? Was it yellow....?
It was actually green when I got it. But it is completely torn down now and I am putting new roll hoops front and rear. The chassis is in really good shape but someone put caps on the roll hoops so that had to be redone. The body work is ok just a little heavy so I will be getting new to replace it.
This car, driven by Bill Fickling, was at the 50th in March at Willow Springs. Beautiful Car!
Those wheels! :oQuote:
Originally Posted by jhaley
I ended up with the whole Eagle project and rights from Al Olssten and Dan Clark here at my shop at Sonoma Raceway (properly known as Sears Point Raceway) around 1988. The car that Scott Livingston had was made up from lots of different pieces, I sold it to him as a project to assemble for his daughter to drive. He drove out here from St. Louis and picked it up.
Dan Clark's car came to me to pay off a debt then to John Anderson from whom I brokered a deal from John to Hans. I also gave Hans the body molds (original and narrow nose) and a lot of other parts such as the "rotisserie" stands for building the chassis, the bulkhead jigs along with David's hand written notes and a full set of drawings. The rear upright molds ended up with Fray Racing (now out of business) because they were great replacements for Lotus Europe coupes.
There was another car that Dan bought from the Unser family which I rebuilt and sold to Kevin Kash who lived in the N SF Bay area. To my knowledge he never raced the car. It was all white when it left here. That would be around 1988. I have no idea what happened to that car.
Al's car, which had been bought new by Harry Sortenburg ( SF SCCA region) and raced by him for many years went to a Mark Glesson from San Jose who raced it for a year then went broke and eventually sold it but I don't know to whom.
Also Bob Fernandez raced a red one for a number of years in the SF SCCA.
Sorry, didn't keep track of the chassis numbers, some frames didn't have any that could be found anywhere. They were just "Club Fords" back then.
To bad, was an interesting project but once the SCCA's "New Club Ford" project crumbled due to politics at the office there wasn't any more interest.
I finally gave up on anyone being interested in the jigs, molds and drawings and eventually disposed of just about all of it as scrap or used as material for other projects. Had all the chassis tube overlays for cutting and hole locations, about 50 shift knobs, even the never used adjustable rear anti-roll bar. I have a few things around like original side panels and I believe a floor pan. Their good aluminum.
Interesting items, the cars never really cooled properly when driven hard. Opening the "hole" as much as possible made a difference but looked ugly. The suspension geometry is some of the best I have ever seen( and I've analyzed dozens on the computer over the years) no doubt due to John Ward's Indy car background. We did a wider track front suspension which maintained the original geometry and really make the low to medium speed much better. Ward admitted the car was designed to win at Road Atlanta, a track that rewards narrow track a configuration
I've included a couple of pictures, one of the Sandy Dells Body, which actually cooled much better. The group shot I am not sure if taken at Laguna Seca or Sears Point. It includes Bob Fernandez's # 21, Dan Clark's # 12, Al Olsteen's # 2 and the #31 which may at that time have belonged to Bill Kincaid. It is signed by both David Loring (top) and Dan Gurney (bottom).
https://www.apexspeed.com/forums/att...id=85692&stc=1https://www.apexspeed.com/forums/att...id=85693&stc=1
The #2 car was the car we purchased thru Neil Porter. It is Chassis #011. This is the car now owned by Larry Webster. Quite a few modifications had been done to the chassis in what appeared to be driver fitment/SCCA roll hoop compliance. We got it up and running with the intention of a ground up restoration, but because of the mods made to the chassis virtually the entire top half of the frame would have to been cut off to get it back to it's original configuration. We spoke with both Bill Fickling and Wes Allen regarding rebuilding vs. purchasing a new chassis and after much debate, parked the car and moved on to the next project...
There is nothing wrong with the car structurally, or otherwise and outside of those changes was complete, running and original. As with most older race cars the changes were done in order to keep it legal. It could/can be raced exactly as it sits, but neither my brother, nor I could fit in it comfortably to race it. The driving position is very horizontal/prone (think enduro kart) and both of us are under 5'8". We would have had to make additional modifications to the chassis as it sat in order for us to have proper distance/support to the rear roll structure, or put it back to the original specs which would have allowed us to fit more comfortably and correctly.
...just a little more history to fill in the gaps and add to the history....
What great information! Those are Gotti wheels on Bill Ficklings car. Bill was a codriver of David Loring and the car he has now is the actual chassis that he drove for Gurney!
The #31 was at the time owned by Bob Watt before it went to Chuck Raggio, then Kincaid, then Bannatyne and then our shop in 2009.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fmracerbob
The car came to us with an extra-long, low profile spare nose that doesn't even fit the car with a normal sized radiator. I'm guessing it would add another 6-8" to the length of the car.
Efrain Olivares, Efrain_jr. here on this site used to own one, or still does. Is it one at AAR?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wes Allen
That is what I thought Bill told me. He was really excited about the restoration.
Hey Guys,
Sorry I missed this. Larry Webster here. I think I have #011 but I can't find a number on the chassis. I think it's 11 because it came with the owner's manual and that number is written on it. Also, it was yellow when I bought it, which suggests it was Sorteberg's car. It does have the roll hoop modifications mentioned earlier.
I found it in a Michigan hanger a few years ago. Had to also buy a Lola to get it. I did a complete mechanical restoration, but didn't strip/repaint the frame. I liked the patina. I've run it a few times and even did a video with it. I painted it a different color than yellow because I've always remembered something bike-builder Jesse James said. "Yellow is the international color of the chicken." LOL
It does have a very relaxed driving position. I made a backrest so I could see properly, but oh boy the turbulence. Anyway, it'll be at Monterey next month so I hope to see some of you there.
Larry
video:
https://www.hagerty.com/articles-vid...e-racing-mecca
First off I'll say that I wish I still had my Eagle chassis #005 now in the capable hands of Jacques.
I look occasionally hoping to find a bird needing a new nest. I missed the one Neil Porter sold years back.
In response to Fmracerbob and anyone curious about the group photo, it was taken at Sears Point (now Sonoma Raceway) likely around 1988 or 1989 and car number 31 on the left was mine (Robert Watt) which I later sold to Chuck Raggio around 1991. Car #2 belonged to Al, and #12 was Dan's don't recall who had #21.
I believe chassis #011 belonged to Harry Sorteberg who sold it to Tony Baker when he bought a Swift, Tony later sold the car to Al Olsteen as I remember it.
It's a shame the jigs and other items went to scrap.
Cheers!
Bob Fernandez here.
I'm guessing I may be the senior owner here. I've owned my Eagle since 1988. My car is the red #21 car in the group photo. I was out having lunch when they grabbed all the cars for the photo.
My car is chassis #007 and I have the matching logbook. I'm told by someone that had access to the car in the museum that it doesn't have a stamped chassis number. That car was listed in Autoweek classifieds in 1991 and I spoke to the owner. He was in the Charlotte area.
I'm in the middle of cleaning my car up and freshening everything. Sitting for so long takes its toll.... I hope to have it back together later this year. (I've been saying that forever)
I remember Al Olseen sold his car to a local guy that crashed it pretty hard. It needed extensive work. AMAC fabrication did the repair work.
When I bought my car from Dan Clark, he threw in an extra set of the Sandy Dells bodywork that doesn't appear to have ever been used.
Thanks for the memories everyone and Bob Fernandez (weez58), it would be great to see your car sometime.
I found a couple more pictures the group might like to see. These were taken sometime in 1988 if memory serves correctly at Sears Point (Sonoma Raceway).
https://www.apexspeed.com/forums/att...id=97712&stc=1
https://www.apexspeed.com/forums/att...id=97713&stc=1
Enjoy!
I went over to Bill Ficklng's not long after he had completed the restoration of his Eagle DGF. It was stunningly beautiful. Now, don't hold me to this, but I remember Bill telling me that, while he had identified the car as his original because of crash-damage repair, he'd had a new chassis built.
Had the chance to see Bill Fickling's car this past week, and yes he ID'd the car based on the frame repair he did in period. He had some great stories about Dan calling him up to race the car as many in period thought David Loring was just able to drive around the car's faults versus it being a genuinely quick car as was proven in Fickling's hands.